John Kerry is going to win. Repeat after me: John Kerry is going to win. Normally I’m not one for mantras and affirmations, but to beat George W. Bush we all better start saying—out loud, to our neighbors, on the train, at the water cooler, anywhere a swing voter might be in earshot—that our guy (and, like it or not, he’s… return to article
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Reader Comments (20)Page 1 of 1 pagesIt’s true that the stars of the Progressive world are lining up behind pro-war and inevitable draft John Kerry because they hate Bush. But young people will die in Iraq not Michael Moore. Mostg people don’t know that the Democrats fought Nader off of many ballots -the new K St. KKK- to keep people from choosing him. Suckers will vote for Kerry because their friends say so. Others will cast a secret vote for Nader and leave the group pressures outside. A vote for Nader is the only anti-war vote and a vote against the anti-civil rights tactics of the Dixiecrat Democrats of 2004.
Posted by steve conn on Oct 21, 2004 at 2:23 PM I might tend to agree with your last comment, Steve. I think Moore, however, is a little moore realistic in his views than he may be showing. I believe at the beginning of this election year—and in years prior—he has been extremely critical of the Dems, but threw his lot behind them because of the Bush factor, i.e. Bush is simply a loose cannon who has no business leading the country, and his government is made up of corporate bigwigs who don’t give a hoot about anything other than swimming in bucks. Under the circumstances a vote for Nader is a vote definitely for war, since the guy is only drawing about 1 or so % of the national vote. Kerry is, I hope/think/evaluate, a fellow with more sense and I believe a better agenda.
And I say this, Steve, as a long-term admirer of Nader. I have followed and applauded his career for decades, and if the Republicans would have a guy that was more to the center (they haven’t had one there since Ike, and he was fast asleep and snoring), I would cast my vote loudly and with the angels trumpeting for Nader. But this time it’s no.
About the war in Iraq: Even if Nader would win the election, assuming all the Dems and a few of those enlightened fundamentalists decide to pull a fast one… We cannot just pull out of Iraq and blame GWB for it. That was the big mistake there: You always need an exit strategy. During the propaganda blitz before the war, I did not hear a single voice (there might have been one or two) debating what would happen. Some of us (we are ordinary Joe Blows) did suggest what would happen. The US army and it’s tagalongs would win quickly, W would do a testosterone show for the yokels, and then civil war would break out and we would be caught in the middle. And because of that (it’s our damned responsibility) we would not be able to just up and leave. There would be untold bloodshed in the country, believe me. One of my closest friends is Iraqi. Besides, Halliburton and others haven’t finished yet. All I am waiting for at this point is the Kurds to start clamoring for their independence using their old blunderbusses. They already have, actually, but not loudly. After all, Kurdistan has enough oil to support a handful of warlords in a lavish lifestyle for a generation or two while leaving us a little more fuel for SUVs.
Kerry’s suggested exit strategy is smart. It involves rebuilding the alliance with the rest of the world outside Palau, Rumania, GB, Macedonia, Hungary, etc… Getting some heavyweights on board. That will make the difference. He also is thinking along the lines of less dependence on fossil fuels, etc… That is also smart.
My last argument right now is: Four more years of Bush and there may be neither a second nor third party left to vote for, there may not even be elections. Tom Ridge gave the world the recipe for ending our democracy when he suggested postponing the elections because of the threat of terror attacks (he probably heard the threat from Rove). That was July 12. It was quickly brushed aside…. Instead of being thoroughly investigated. We jave come to accept our democracy as if it were a given, a birethright. It ain’t. It’s a privilege, not god given but fought for with real human blood, sweat and tears and, when you come right down to it, brain cells. It’s because of that democracy that millions of Christian fundamentalists can pray, sing and talk in tongues without being pilloried. And that mountebanks like Pat Robertson can suck them dry of their last earnings by promising them a little nest in the heavens.
i have to go, regards,
Posted by Marton on Oct 21, 2004 at 3:38 PM I think the only people I’ve met who are more self-righteous than Bush supporters are hardcore Nader supporters. You’d think that if they wanted to get more people to vote for Nader, they wouldn’t refer to Kerry supporters as suckers. Vote your conscience, but don’t try to force your conscience onto others.
Posted by Tornado Rex on Oct 21, 2004 at 3:44 PM Kerry *IS* going to win & it’s not going to be close (not 2000 close anyway).
He will win the whole BigTen (that’s Illinois, Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio & Pennsylvania) minus IN. Florida will not matter, but he will probably win that too when the dust settles.
Posted by Adam on Oct 21, 2004 at 6:54 PM “A vote for Nader is the only anti-war vote…”
I am anti-war and would dearly love to have a true anti-war candidate that could win this election, but Ralph Nader is NOT IT. And if I need so desperately to cling to my illusion over that reality that I would knowingly hand this election to the fascist supreme, George W. Bush, I will deserve the administration I help elect by doing so.
Furthermore, Kerry, who could have exempted himself from the Viet Nam War as GWB did, committed himself to it, and then had the decency to come back and openly regret it, and to call it what it was: a monumental tragedy.
To sum up, steve conn, you :
pretend Nader can win;
pretend that even if Nader cannot win, it means something to register your complaint by voting for him;
pretend that Kerry is pro-war;
pretend Kerry is pro-draft.My advice to you :
If you want to play pretend, buy yourself some paper dolls.
If you want to help create a better America, GET REAL, because this is no time to pretend.
Posted by Kim Louth on Oct 21, 2004 at 8:02 PM Nader hasn’t a chance . He has lost the respect of many former supporters who thought he had a message. Now, his message has been severely diluted by his hubris.
I saw UPRIVER last night and encourage any ABB or Nader supporters to view it.
Granted this is Kerry propoganda, but it shows a side of Kerry when his political life was budding, and it shows a man of high moral charcter, which is more than I can say of either Bush or Nader.
When there is a sure runaway for president other than the Rove adminsitration, I’ll go green or libertarian..as long as it isn’t Nader.
Until then “KERRY”
Posted by Robin on Oct 22, 2004 at 12:15 AM “for steve Conn”
i find it almost incomprehensible to believe that having learned the excruciating lessons of 2000, that a sane human being that does not share the zealot ideologies of the Bush administration (and the republican right wing as a whole) would waste a vote on the self-righteous, conceited, misguided goof that’s Nader. it shames me to deride nader this way (having been a supporter for decades), but the man has flat out lost his old mind. i will cut an arm off to get Bush out of office. i will sell my soul to the devil—whatever it takes. But on Nov.2 my vote will not only be a hate-Bush vote, it will actually also be a vote for the man that i feel is better qualified to lead this great nation. sure, kerry does not have the charisma and charm of Bill Clinton, but he certainly comes to the table with as much intellect and more experience. All one has to do is go back to his days after vietnam, and yes, look at his senate record. i know small minds might no comprehend the complexities of his senate achievements, but he did achieve things there. Kerry’s an excellent candidate, and it’s time dems start acknowledging that.
Posted by Ugonna on Oct 22, 2004 at 10:52 AM It seems that everytime I see Nader of t.v. recently he looks more and more unhinged. He’s got this manic buzz about him. I’m from Canada and recently he wildly berated a host from the CBC for having the temerity to suggest that this election might be too important for him to fck it up. Then he went on an incoherent rambling about Canadians and third party politics blah blah blah…
anybody thinking of voting for him in a swing state is a deluded poor soul. I mean sure when I was 18 I thought it was cool to vote for the Marxist-Leninists…but the reality of big party politics has to sink in at some point folks.
Posted by neil on Oct 22, 2004 at 3:03 PM Hiya
Nader Voter hereLook, I just want to clear something up. We did not cost Al Gore the election in 2000. Gore lost due to electoral fraud, a poorly run campaign, and the Senate Democrats unwillingness to contest an obwiously fradulent election. Nader did not take votes away from Al Gore. If I could not vote for Nader in this election, I would vote for Walt Brown, or Cobb, or another fringe party candidate. I mean, come on, even a broken clock is right twice a day. Kerry has supported the Patriot Act, the Iraq war, and much of the Bush Administration’s legislation.
Also, I am quite frankly disgusted with the Democratic party’s attempts to keep Nader off the ballot. The republicans for all their flaws, never tried to force Perot, Buchanan, or any of the Libertarian candidates off the ballot. And Badnarik might actually prove a threat to Bush.
The worst part about this is that Kerry is currently kicking Bush’s ass in the polls and they still insist that he could spoil it. Al Gore won the last election with Nader doing much better than he is now, and there is no reason a perfectly intelligent man like John Kerry should not be able to do the same.
Posted by Matt Colgan on Oct 22, 2004 at 4:49 PM Listen up Folks! I’m not an American, but right now I am feeling presumptuous enough to speak for the rest of the world. Everybody knows that Bush tricked his way into power and the Iraq fiasco is his personal war. If you actually vote him in this time it will be your war, America’s war. You will be the enemy. Of everybody. It will not matter if you voted for Bush or Kerry or Nader. Other nations will doubt Americans good faith. Those who hope to co-operate with America think also of resistance. New alliances may form directed against America.
Kerry at least appears to have a plan to avoid isolating America. A vote for Nader splits the Anti-Bush vote.
Posted by xyptol on Oct 23, 2004 at 11:55 PM Dear xyptol,
I do not doubt what you assert. I also would not blame anyone for hating Americans if we as a country allow him to take office AGAIN, after what he has shown us so far. I cannot tell you how depressing it is to see fellow Americans blinded by the propaganda these right wing extremists spew. What is truly despicable is how they claim their actions are in alignment with Christian values ! Since when is bombing innocent Iraqi citizens Christian?? Four more years of this kind of drunken, reckless, arrogant abuse of power and this country will be lost for good. I can only say, sadly, that the Bush voters will have gotten what they deserve—as for the rest of us, we will have gotten what we allowed. I, myself, will probably leave this country if the worst should happen on Nov 2, and will pray for those I will leave behind.
Posted by Kim Louth on Oct 24, 2004 at 2:54 PM We have 9 days to go. Please, all of you who see the light—the anti-war,anti-Bush,pro-freedom,pro-environment people,get out there! Bang the drum for Kerry! To save your country and to save your own lives. If Bush squeaks back into office, you will regret forever not having worked your tail off to get out the vote for our side. There is nothing you can do today that is more important. If each of us can turn out just 5 or 6 voters, we can make a difference.
Let’s ROCK AND ROLL!
Posted by Beverly Cummins/spangler on Oct 25, 2004 at 1:31 AM “Kerry *IS* going to win & it’s not going to be close (not 2000 close anyway).
He will win the whole BigTen (that’s Illinois, Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio & Pennsylvania) minus IN. Florida will not matter, but he will probably win that too when the dust settles.”
Posted by Adam on October 21, 2004 at 1:54 PM
Adam, George’s brother, Jeb, who is just as big a crook as George (maybe bigger), is the Governor of Florida in charge of counting the votes which will be tabulated, in large part, from purposely hackable electronic voting machines.
IMHO, Florida already elected Bush.
Posted by Lefty on Oct 25, 2004 at 4:05 AM Here’s a link worth more to click than the one above:
http://www.bushrelativesforkerry.com/pages/1/index.htm
Posted by Tornado Rex on Oct 26, 2004 at 2:42 AM Mr Xyptol,here is another view from the rest of the world.
To “hate” americans because let’s say,51%
of the voters reelected Bush would be quite
irresponsible : What about the other 49 %?
Not only would they have lost,but they would have to be hated as well…
It is the same hasty equation that condemns
the French for the slimy politics of their president,forgetting there might be more than
a few french people to respect and like America.I would like also to point out that if Bush indeed accumulates unexplainable blunders
and unflattering images,it does not mean that
Kerry will be a better president.Remember the enthusiasm about Carter in
1976. Remember his utter rejection in 1980.Would you say ,today, that Reagan was worse
than Carter ?If Kerry is elected,I am quite sure that the anti-americanism that flourishes in our"rest of the world” will quickly find other nutrients than
the very rich Dubbya.America has to be the policeman of the world.
What is easier than calling for criticism and
hatred of the police ?
Posted by george babushes on Oct 27, 2004 at 8:17 AM FLORIDA’S 2004 ELECTION RESULTS NOW AVAILABLE
Tallahassee; Paul James Reporting.
Late Friday, Florida’s Election Commissar, Glenda Hood, issued a press release late Friday stating that the 2004 Presidential Election Results would be available by October 29.
Hood further stated that this was an attempt by Governor Jeb to forestall any of the nastiness associated with the 2000 election.
When called and asked for further clarification, Hood stated:
“We don’t need any slick, Eastern establishment liberal type attorney’s poking their nose into our business.
That happened last time and look at the mess created.”
“Governor Jeb hopes making the election results available early will keep voters pacified.”
When asked who the winner will be, she chuckled and stated, “It won’t be a surprise.”Ass. Press
Posted by Greg Bacon on Oct 27, 2004 at 9:53 AM Oh quickly the Kerry campaign evaporated, but has anyone noticed that Nader is still pushing for a fair count of America’s votes? Isn’t it time for those progressives who were so willing to hold their noses and vote for Kerry to stand up again with Nader and join in his effort to impeach George Bush?
Posted by steve conn on Nov 16, 2004 at 2:05 AM As a disappointed Kerry supporter, I just wnat to remind everyone that we lost by ONLY 2 percent. The world knows that almost half of this nation does NOT support our president.
I believe we lost this election because of the religious right. I used to think they were only the lunatic fringe but now realize their numbers are huge-still lunatic but now mainstream.
Some Christians,misled moderates,have just been swept along.
Please go to the site for the Interfaith Alliance to see what Extremists are doing. IA is led by leaders of ALL the churches worldwide. Walter Cronkite is their spokesman.
To give you an idea of the serious threat The Right has become, let me quote the pres. of the Christian Coalition. She told a reporter at the GOP convention “We OWN the president”.
Send shivers down your spine???
Posted by Beverly Cummins/Spangler on Nov 16, 2004 at 3:57 AM Page 1 of 1 pages -
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