As a special holiday treat for its readers, In These Times asked Kurt Vonnegut for his thoughts on the Christmas season. Here’s what he wrote. Happy holidays from everyone at In These Times. I met a man in Nigeria years ago, an Ibo, who said he had three hundred relatives he knew by name. His wife had just had a… return to article
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Reader Comments (24)Page 1 of 1 pagesThat’s the irony isn’t it? With all of his talk of love, forgivness, and charity, Jesus wouldn’t have had a chance under this administration.
Posted by OttoReponse on Dec 23, 2004 at 7:42 AM True… Bush hasn’t been to a Church service in years but is viewed by so many as such a wonderful Christian. He is a ‘born again’, maybe he just needs to be born again again? The bible says if you want to know if someone who comes calling themself a man of God really is, just look at their works. I struggle to understand how so many “Christians” in this country could have missed that passage. Happy Holidays to all readers.
Posted by Ryan Conover on Dec 23, 2004 at 1:34 PM this country is in the worst mess it could ever be in there is to much to list and to thik about but family is what is left ???? extended or the lost nuculer family the cost of heating fuel and gas is a joke to pay for a second nam oh boy the united states on its mission of globle unity why just bring our troops home and shut down the borders and tighten up security of what comes in and out by all means of travel but will she nooooooooooo but any way iam a old soul in a young body just hating this country capitalisum has set this motion and wont stop untill it bolws
Posted by vincent on Dec 23, 2004 at 2:34 PM Sometimes I feel privileged being icelandic. We are well fed, have no army and, above all, have a birds eye view of the rest of the world. The freedom to think for oneself is absolute. I continually roam the net to find enlightning articles on the state of things on this little ball of OURS (me and you). I wanted to share with you this article I found. It is very much a “birds eye view” article I think.
http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2004/12/21/americas-war-with-itself-/
Happy holidays fellow humans!
Posted by Þráinn Guðbjörnsson on Dec 24, 2004 at 5:19 AM There are extended families related by blood lines, and then there are those related by lines of thinking (e.g., intellectual, spiritual).
So the person who is physically alone this hoilday season, but knows he/she stands in some line of relation others, spiritually they are not alone, and perhaps closer than ever during this season.
Happy holidays to all!
Posted by Jgomez on Dec 24, 2004 at 9:12 AM Holiday Greetings on the Magical Day!
I have been blessed with one biological son, one adopted daughter (from Korea), one fine son-in-law and the two most wonderful and beautiful grandchildren in the world.
We have all embraced and been embraced by a small, but steadfast circle of extended family who have sustained us over the past 35 years. Actually, they are not really “extended” family, (i.e., at what point does an extended family undergo it’s transformation to become, “family?") Now they are just a part of our lives.
Our biological family is our blood.
Our children are our legacy.
Our extended family is our choice.
The three together are a composition of our life.Since we, here in this country, have embraced the smaller family, AWA a traveling and rootless gypsy lifestyle, I would think it only natural to see people return to the, “One World, One Family” philosophy of the 1960s—remember, when we were all going to, “Love One Another and Embody Brotherhood?”
Well, we opposed a war back then—and eventually stopped it—and I can tell you with absolute certainty that you can successfully raise a blended family, develop strong relationships which will carry you through the years, and continue to fight for Peace and Justice in the World - but you have to want it, then do it.Now go out and shout it from the mountain tops: Peace On Earth Good Will Towards Men - Bring Our Troops Home Now! These are our precious kids.
And, God Bless all of those suffering people in Iraq today and everyday. They are our precious neighbors and friends.
Posted by Sally Petrovic on Dec 24, 2004 at 10:49 AM Every year its the same story everybody goes and celebrates a man who had nothing to do with the man we celebrate today. Lets face it already Christ was Jew and he died a Jew. The rest of history is just good PR. The church needed Christ to die to push their agenda.
Its makes me sick to look over history to see how many died when they did not have to, all because of his name. Right now we have a government going around telling everyone what’s right and killing an torturing those we think are our enemies. It the end this Iraq conflict will come back to bite us in the ass. Just study history sometime and you will be amazed how many mistakes mankind has made. We are sick that 3000 died at the world trade center but no one remembers the millions we killed to expand this country, from sea to shining sea.
Happy Holidays
Posted by Edward Stern on Dec 25, 2004 at 1:07 AM The Church needed Christ to die to push their agenda? What all-powerful but non-existant Church was this? What does his dying a Jew have to do with anything? Why do yo say he had nothing to do with the man we celebrate today? None of that makes any sense, nor does it hold water. Phrases like, “from sea to shining sea” in your writing DO make you sound like a Vonnegut wannabe, but don’t necessarily prove your point. Witty sarcasm is fun, but back it up with something if you want it to be taken seriously. Merry Christmas to you too, and happy Chanukah.
Posted by Ryan Conover on Dec 25, 2004 at 11:16 AM Hello All
I’m a devout Catholic (I go roughly twice a month..pretty good considering I like to drink on Saturday nights :)
And I disagree with, oh, about 95% of what the church says. Why do I keep going? Because the story of a man that basically said “Hey! I have a novel idea, let’s treat one another kindly, with dignity and respect. You know those people we piss on? How about being nice to them for a change?” is a pretty powerful story. It’s true it’s a travesty what has been done in His name, but one must never forget that singular message, it’s a message of hope (even if most people who claim to follow Him have forgotten this).Tommy Douglas (the founder of the canadian social democratic party, who brought universal healthcare to canada and also a minister) was once asked why he was a socialist. He responded that as far as he could see, Socialism is Christianity in practice.
Merry Christmas Everybody (and I hope all had a wonderful Channukah)
Posted by the great went on Dec 25, 2004 at 6:07 PM Thanks Þráinn for that terrific link. Indeed, the bird’s eye view is vital in today’s global world, lest we lose sight of the forest for looking at the trees. And your description of Iceland and it’s bird’s eye view seems very appropriate. It even has the shape of a bird, somewhat, a duck sitting in the Atlantic. I visited your country twice already and found the bareness of the landscape very inviting to big thoughts. Let me share brief story that gave me much food for thought: We were 7 journalists, mostly of the cynical stamp. One of our group (she worked for one of thoose chain hip radio stations owned by some huge and anonymous coropration) wanted to do something on all the trolls and fairies that the Icelanders take so seriously. She honed a tough question, which she threw at ayoung waitress at some café lost in the lava fields:"Why are these trolls here in Iceland, and not where I come from?” The waitress laughed, and said: “Because we believe in them!” The journalist didn’t say anything for about 2 hours.
And so Merry Christmas to all. It is, in my books, the festival of light in the darker moment of our hemisphere, and so transcends all religions. We do like to share our spiritual beliefs, so let me add my grain: The story of JC is the story of the higher self that each of us possesses. And for us to become conscious of it, we do need if not humility, then at least great simplicity. So Christmas is for me the rediscovery of the true self in each of us, and the gifts we distribute are tokens to acknowledge that true self in others. It is also the time of year to remember that the point is not what life owes me, but what I owe to life: gratitude.
Happy New Year
Posted by Talleyrand on Dec 25, 2004 at 11:36 PM Vincent posted on Dec 23 that we are in the worst of times.....I’ve seen much worse times-it was the years of 1929 to 1940.Vince don’t know what bad times really is.
Edward Stimach
Stafford,Tx
Posted by Edward Stimach on Dec 28, 2004 at 8:43 PM Ryan poses a question of Edward, about why the Christ we worship today bears little resemblance to the man who lived 2000 years ago. To begin with, Christmas, aside from the commercial aspects, is mostly focused on his birth, while on most sundays in church, we are focused on his death, and resurrection, and assencion into heaven. Not enough attention is paid to his teachings, and what his birth meant for the people and place and time at which it occured. If he was the messiah prophesied, He was a threat to the puppet King Herod and to the Roman empire whose armies occupied and ruled most of the known world. For this reason Herod sought to have him killed while he was still an infant. He was a threat to the established religious order of his day, and spoke out about the hipocracy of it’s leaders. He praised the PEACEMAKERS, admonished the rich, defended the poor, and healed the sick. He led no army, won no military victories, aspired to no earthly rank, riches, or posessions.
Were he to return today, whose power do you think he would threaten, which political leader would have him arrested, tried, convicted, and executed, and at the urging of what wealthy and influential religious figures. Is it just coincidence that one of the most popular movies about him ever made, didn’t spend a minute on his message? Is it not ironic that so many of our leaders, political, miltary and religious, presume to be doing God’s will as they slaughter other of God’s children, and poison the planet?
Posted by Kenneth D. Brown on Dec 28, 2004 at 10:14 PM Kurt,
Hope you are feeling well. I am one of the many who ready everything you write. Love it.
You should try to write something without a direct reference to the current political divide (if that is possible).
I thought your Christmas note was quite suite, but you had to spoil the taste with the last line.
I always found your work enjoyable because I never took it very seriously. If had I doubt I could have liked it as much.
Are you succombing to the fate of many old men and taking everything to seriously.
A fan
Posted by yahshureyoubetchya on Dec 29, 2004 at 2:32 PM Who on earth would take life seriously? Republicans seem perfectly happy in their own ignorance… comeon everybody, let’s party it down!
Posted by Ryan Conover on Jan 1, 2005 at 9:54 PM What’s with these people looking to give Vonnegut all this amazing advice? From what I know, he hates computers. This is lucky, otherwise he might actually read some of this nonsense
Posted by Ryan Conover on Jan 1, 2005 at 9:56 PM Dear Kurt,
I’ve come a little late, please, excuse me for that. I had to visit some other relatives first :) Nothing to add, just that your crystal feeling like directly from a child’s eyes was always my refuge.
Thank you with all my heart for that.
Please, take care of yourself.
Posted by poppy on Jan 27, 2005 at 8:23 AM I’m sorry, I read those comments from yahshureyoubetchya and I couldn’t stay silent. Don’t take it serioulsy? I know that there’s plenty of jokes in Mr. Vonnegut’s work, Timequake is a great example. But even then, there are still serious undertones and parallels being drawn. For you to not take any of that seriously is to completely miss the point. That’s like calling history fiction! I may be over-stating this and asking for it from those better at analizing liturature, but I think that a real fan of his work would take it seriously enought to look for the deeper meaning in Mr. Vonnegut’s works. It’s called reading between the lines! If my old English teacher knew you, he’d probably kill you.
Also, in our world as it is today, I don’t see how people could not be getting serious. If that’s a sign of age, then call me an old fart, just don’t say I’m wrong for being so.
Posted by Collin on Jan 27, 2005 at 10:14 PM i wish people werent so goddamned pretentious
if i really didnt like an author, i’m pretty sure i wouldnt be reading his articles and then taking the time to comment on them and nitpick
and be terribly condescending with comments such as “you had to spoil the taste with the last line”
yes, i definitely wouldnt do that
arent i special
Posted by annie on Jan 30, 2005 at 11:26 PM Dear Collin and Annie,
I read also yahshureyoubetchya’s comment but even in a little edge-tongue, it was well-intented. I got the sense that what actually he was trying to say was this; Mr Vonnegut’s humour reaches to the heart of the things and pierce their very core much more sharply and precisely than all the pretentious seriousness of this world.
Yahshureyoubettchya, god, isn’t it too obvious just by that that he likes penetrating even his own skin with the same humour?...excuse me if it’s your real name, dear Yashureyoubetchya :) Lol!When will we have again a piece of Mr Vonnegut?
Posted by poppy on Feb 3, 2005 at 6:26 PM If Jesus were to return and act as he supposedly did 2000 years ago, he would speak out against today’s Christian practices the way he did those of Judaism at the time. Then we’d kill him again.
Posted by Anthony DiMieri on Feb 23, 2005 at 1:59 AM I would love to be that famous baby. There’s a lot of talk on here about Jesus and our government and whether he would’ve liked it or not.
He would’ve been indifferent. That was his whole message. See, his whole idea was a talk about civilization and humanity. That baby you talk about doesn’t live in civilization—not much anyway. Jesus was pointing out, “Hey, from here on it looks like a lot of us are going to be living in a civilization. Its positive points are that I think in a while nearly all the babies will live past 5 years and you can do somethijng with your life other than digging roots. The downside is that you’ll live under constant threat of becoming an abstraction. Here’s how to avoid that: love each other for real.”
It is possible to create as human beings the sort of society that famous baby lives in. The mistake we make is trying constantly to make our government do it for us, which—I’m sorry—can never happen in a good way. Jesus asked us to take it on as a personal mission and it’s easy enough to do.
I’m not even religious, but I love you all!
http://craicpipe.blogspot.com/
Posted by craichead on Mar 2, 2005 at 2:19 PM Page 1 of 1 pages -
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