David , it just happened. Nuffing to do with me, gov.
Bonjour, luminous one!
Techno encyclopaedic rabbit, we sure made lotsa bro on them thar USD’s. So far markets have been liquid enough to swap in and out of the things, but the day may come…. ,
We recently saw the Chinese and Canadians diversifying some of their reserves out of the Almighty One. I believe the canucks sold gold for Euros ?
Arras is foreign parts to me, I"m near cherbourg. All my farming neighbours of that age were in Algeria. I’m told one will never talk about it, he was in the paras. Metric system sounds like that Napoleon man.
I’m still technically a brit, 30years out, but my grandchildren are frogs. My brit brother-in -law and I even talk together in frog without noticing, so am integrated I spose. Having lived half me life in each country I larf at the stereotypes brits and frogs have of each other, and stick up for whichever is being slandered by the other.
Anyone for Freedom Fries ? Wasn’t that guy one of the Abramoff Gang ?
Posted by frog on Jan 31, 2006 at 1:23 PM
david
the poll at the end of the first link rather silly, i didn’t learn anything new, but don’t pretend to know everything .
Still, a Good Site for beginners to start from !!
Posted by frog on Jan 31, 2006 at 1:32 PM
http://marcosolo.journalspace.com/
tried to cutandpaste jebbush quote from this, and failed.
Its right at the bottom of page.
techno-imbeciles like me abstain , please ?
Posted by frog on Jan 31, 2006 at 7:19 PM
http://select.nytimes.com/search/restricted/article?res=F00C1FFE355F0C728EDDA00894D9404482
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA11.victims.html
http://www.eionews.addr.com/psyops/news/passenger_list_puzzle.htm
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA77.victims.html
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/ua175.victims.html
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/ua93.victims.html
Wonder if this is going to be translated into screams?
A few more links about the hijackers. I signed up for a trial of some “select” hooey at New York Times, so that I could get articles from the “paper of record”. What a lousy record we have.
The eio link is an interesting one for people who like puzzles. The CNN links are on the eio site. CNN links are passenger lists for the hijacked aircraft.
Am on pens and needles over our impending nuclear strike. Can’t sleep well. Ordered sedatives. Good God! They’re out of their minds!
Posted by wileywitch on Jan 31, 2006 at 9:20 PM
Yep. Screaming like a Banshee.
Posted by wileywitch on Jan 31, 2006 at 9:20 PM
Mwa ha ha…...............................^^..................................
The rabbit has struck. Rabbit magic…
Yes it is an electron revolution.
And the rabbit is their leader.
Beware Nat the Bat, the forces of good are comming out
Despite your Spite and your slavening bite
The right from the left is here for the fight
Electrons do Rabbit’s bidding. Turn Natty’s spite inward so it eats her wizened heart. The queen of DU DEATH, and excuses for death dealers.
Witch do you like the rabbit’s spells?
Posted by Rabbit on Jan 31, 2006 at 9:41 PM
care of frog,
“The truth is useless. You have to understand this right now. You can’t deposit the truth in a bank. You can’t buy groceries with the truth. You can’t pay rent with the truth. The truth is a useless commodity that will hang around your neck like an albatross all the way to the homeless shelter. And if you think that the million or so people in this country that are really interested in the truth about their government can support people who would tell them the truth, you got another thing coming. Because the million or so people in this country that are truly interested in the truth don’t have any money.”- Jeb Bush (Florida governor, brother of George W. Bush)
And ain’t that the truth? What do we have? O
Posted by luminous beauty on Jan 31, 2006 at 10:25 PM
They certainly are glib with their real ideas and intentions. It just makes you hate them that much more. It also makes the Idiot Sheeple even bigger idiots.
Ok now, Rabbit has hopefully got the ear of the revolting electrons. They have spoken, they even can no longer go on supporting such lies as the official story is.
Now dear little electrons who know the truth and the government lies, please go back quietly and Rabbit will continue to represent your case and if you are needed again you will be called. Please go skinny again….........................................^^...............................
Rabbit is not the boss of electrons, they can do what they want, but rabbit would like them to be quiet now</b>
Posted by Rabbit on Jan 31, 2006 at 11:00 PM
Testing
oh oh
Posted by Rabbit on Jan 31, 2006 at 11:01 PM
They are too angry
The elctrons are revolting, they have taken control. Natty and Minny Mind will be eaten by them, like Nano-viruses when or if we ever see them again.
Be afraid.
BE VERY AFRAID.
Posted by Rabbit on Jan 31, 2006 at 11:03 PM
Maybe the font is in bold because moles have poor eyesight.
If electrons start revolting——the only thing we can be certain of, is that the market would be flooded with self-help books about how it’s your fault, and the twelve steps to turning your bold electrons into capital.
Posted by wileywitch on Jan 31, 2006 at 11:21 PM
bold is getting boring
Hmmm ... maybe we should send word to Seamus?
Posted by David in Canada on Jan 31, 2006 at 11:29 PM
luminous,
You seem to be O.K. with someone using as a reference, material quoted on a site run by a Holocaust revisionist. It doesn’t seem to raise the slightest bit of doubt in your mind as to the reliability or completeness of the information contained on a site who’s publisher has no problem whitewashing and making up history as it pertains to the Holocaust.
It would seem that Jones has no problem either, or perhaps he is unaware of the true nature and agenda of “American Free Press”. (such a nice, innocent sounding name)
The truth of Loizeaux’s feelings and observations that day are below, and I will add these to my list of quotes you will likely never see on 9/11 “truth” websites. Well, maybe selected bits and pieces here and there.
When you watched 9/11, did you imagine that the towers would come down like that?
“I did a report on the World Trade Center when I was at college and I knew exactly how it was built. I understood the concept. When I saw the first plane hit, my mind first went to: “Oh my god, what’s happened? Is it a plane, a private plane?” But I was watching along with most of the western world when the second plane hit. And everything changed. When I saw what hit, that it was an airliner, that it was loaded with jet fuel, I remembered the long clear span configuration from the central core to the outer skin of the World Trade Center from the report I did. And we had just taken down two 40-storey structures in New York.
I still had some cellphone numbers so when the second plane hit I said: “Start calling all the cellphones, tell them that the building is going to come down.” It was frenetic, nobody could get through even with speed dialling. And I just sat there, just sat there. Of course, building number 7, which is where the emergency management headquarters was, was on fire. I’d been in that office two months before. And I sat there watching, I picked up the phone and I called a couple of people on the National Research Council Committee involved in assessing the impact of explosives. They said: “What do you think this is, that they’re going to fail, they’re both going to fail?” The expression around was they’re going to pancake down, almost vertically. And they did. It was the only way they could fail. It was inevitable. And it was horrific.”
Could they have been built in such a way that they would have withstood the impact?
“Bad question - they did withstand the impact. The correct question is could they have been built to withstand the consequences, the fire?”
Well - could they?
“I’ll defer to the reports coming out, but I will say - is society willing to pay for it? It’s far cheaper to take the battle to terrorists than let them bring it to us.”
I guess it’s easy to see why Jones linked us to AFP. They were a convenient source of just the information Jones wanted us to know about.
It’s obvious that Loizveaux didn’t suspect bombs in the buildings; his gut feeling based on his experience with demolitions and his knowledge of the WTC was that the towers would fall essentially for the same basic reasons that Bazant, Zhou, FEMA, and NIST later confirmed. Obviously everyone had varying degrees of data and information, and there are disagreements on the precise mechanism of collapse. But nowhere, anywhere do any of these professional people qualified to make informed judgments on building collapse find any reason to suspect bombs in the buildings.
Again I ask you, why is it do you suppose that Jones’ eagerly anticipated “peer reviewed” paper has not been accepted by, or perhaps not even submitted to, a legitimate scientific, engineering or even a physics journal? Why is it only being used to advance a “scientific Marxist agenda”?
Does this further example of Jones altering the reality of another’s feelings and beliefs by way of selective quoting make even a tiny dent in your armor of admiration for him?
Posted by Natalie on Jan 31, 2006 at 11:42 PM
Does anybody have any real evidence for six or more of the hijackers being still alive?
Posted by Natalie on Jan 31, 2006 at 11:50 PM
Define “real”.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 1, 2006 at 12:05 AM
http://www.schoolhistory.co.uk/revision/germany.shtml
Do you have a problem with revision, Natalie. It’s a perfectly acceptable pursuit, especially when new documentation is found, or when one or more prior claims are proven to be questionable.
Surely you don’t think it’s sensible to reject an entire news source on the basis of your prejudice?
Perhaps you think the BBC and the Telegraph are part of a conspiracy?
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 1, 2006 at 12:10 AM
Undold you!!
test
test
test
<u>test</u>
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 1, 2006 at 12:34 AM
Rabbit broke the thread with html voodoo hoodoo from his cut and paste article. Probably changed the “style” or something.
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 1, 2006 at 12:50 AM
If I knew how to “dold”—-
Oh, I know how it is though, Pistol Pete—- I have HTMLADHD. It’s not what everyone thinks it is, it’s a communist plot.
Rabbit isn’t communist. Though I hear he casts a furry spell.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 1, 2006 at 12:55 AM
Look at the link and then everybody take turns posting a piece of it until we get the whole , not too long under the nose of the Shill.
Sorry about the Bold Electrons, Rabbit thought he had control of the herd their for a bit, but this was a brief illusion. Thjey are mad as hell, that is the truth and they are screaming NATALIE we cannot take your Lying Shilling Spinning Spew. They like the rabbit are getting bored with you.
As once before it begins to feel unclean just being on a thread with you.
Unclean Unclean.
Here is the first bit of the Loony Conspiracist.
Looniest Of All 911
Conspiracy Theories
By Gerard Holmgren
1-31-6
Astute observers of history are aware that for every notable event there will usually be at least one, often several wild conspiracy theories which spring up around it. ‘The CIA killed Hendrix’, ‘The Pope had John Lennon murdered’, ‘Hitler was half Werewolf’, ‘Space aliens replaced Nixon with a clone’ etc, etc. The bigger the event, the more ridiculous and more numerous are the fanciful rantings which circulate in relation to it.
So its hardly surprising that the events of September 11th, 2001 have spawned their fair share of these ludicrous fairy tales. And as always, there is - sadly - a small but gullible percentage of the population eager to lap up these tall tales, regardless of facts or rational analysis.
One of the wilder stories circulating about September 11th - and one that has attracted something of a cult following amongst conspiracy buffs - is that it was carried out by nineteen fanatical Arab hijackers, masterminded by an evil genius named Osama bin Laden, with no apparent motivation other than that they ‘hate our freedoms.’
Never a group of people to be bothered by facts, the perpetrators of this cartoon fantasy have constructed an elaborately woven web of delusions and unsubstantiated hearsay in order to promote this garbage across the internet and the media to the extent that a number of otherwise rational people have actually fallen under its spell.
Normally I don’t even bother debunking this kind of junk, but the effect that this paranoid myth is beginning to have requires a little rational analysis, in order to consign it to the same rubbish bin as all such silly conspiracy theories.
These crackpots even contend that the extremist Bush regime was caught unawares by the attacks, had no hand in organising them, and actually would have stopped them if it had been able. Blindly ignoring the stand down of the US air-force, the insider trading on airline stocks - linked to the CIA - the complicit behavior of Bush on the morning of the attacks, the controlled demolition of the WTC, the firing of a missile into the Pentagon and a host of other documented proofs that the Bush regime was behind the attacks, the conspiracy theorists stick doggedly to a silly story about nineteen Arab hijackers somehow managing to commandeer four planes simultaneously and fly them around US airspace for nearly two hours, crashing them into important buildings, without the US intelligence services having any idea that it was coming, and without the Air Force knowing what to do.
Next please?
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 1, 2006 at 2:52 AM
More about these loony tunes and their wacky theories and methods of deluding themselves.
Sound familiar to anyone? Nobody we can recognise around here by any chance?
The huge difficulties with such a stupid story force them to invent even more preposturous stories to distract from its core silliness, and thus the tale has escalated into a mythic fantasy of truly gargantuan proportions.
It’s difficult to apply rational analysis to such unmitigated stupidity, but that is the task which I take on in this article. However, it should be noted that one of the curious characteristics of conspiracy theorists is that they effortlessly change their so called evidence in response to each aspect which is debunked. As soon as one delusion is unmasked, they simply invent another to replace it, and deny that the first ever existed. Eventually, when they have turned full circle through this endlessly changing fantasy fog, they then re-invent the original delusion and deny that you ever debunked it, thus beginning the circle once more. This technique is known as ‘the fruit loop’ and saves the conspiracy theorist from ever having to see any of their ideas through to their (il)ogical conclusions.
According to the practitioners of the fruit loop, nineteen Arabs took over four planes by subduing the passengers and crew through the use of guns, knives, box cutters and gas, and then used electronic guidance systems which they had smuggled on board to fly the planes to their targets.
The suspension of disbelief required for this outrageous concoction is only for the hard core conspiracy theorist. For a start, they conveniently skip over the awkward fact that there weren’t any Arabs on the planes. If there were, one must speculate that they somehow got on board without being filmed by any of the security cameras and without being registered on the passenger lists. But the curly question of how they are supposed to have got on board is all too mundane for the exciting world of the conspiracy theorist. With vague mumblings that they must have been using false ID - but never specifying which IDs they are alleged to have used, or how these were traced to their real identities - they quickly bypass this problem, to relate exciting and sinister tales about how some of the fictitious fiends were actually searched before boarding because they looked suspicious. However, as inevitably happens with any web of lies, this simply paints them into an even more difficult corner. How are they supposed to have got on board with all that stuff if they were searched ? And if they used gas in a confined space, they would have been affected themselves unless they also had masks in their luggage.
“Excuse me sir, why do you have a boxcutter, a gun, a container of gas, a gas mask and an electronic guidance unit in your luggage?”
“A present for your grandmother? Very well sir, on you get.”
“Very strange”, thinks the security officer, “that’s the fourth Arabic man without an Arabic name who just got on board with a knife, gun or boxcutter and gas mask…and why does that security camera keep flicking off every time one these characters shows up? Must be one of those days I guess…”
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 1, 2006 at 3:28 AM
Can you or can you not see the electrons themselves are communicating, the font is gone weird, you are under attack from the very forces of nature, the universal balance has been exceeded. You are now scheduled for destruction.
Your doom is upon you earthlings. Those who stink in the eyes of your creators. Those with their misbegotten twisted souls and their sinful ways, their lying cheating thieving and murdering, raping, pillaging and supporters for death and death bringers.
IT IS YOU
“</b>”//
************#</#>
Nat the flappy bat, the lover of poison and murder, who stabs and hacks at the truth with claws grown dull from overuse. Your teeth too, are not sharp, your mind is grown dull with the drugs that they put in the koolaid you drink daily.
You are their vampire, they own you, you are doomed for it is you and your kind, the scum who hide behind you who are being “RECALLED”. The big one, recalled into the big galactic waste disposal unit. Your souls, such as is left of them, will be forfeit. Forfeit to the crown so to speak.
Your carcasses even will be gone from this latest sojourn in the world which you only rent. The rent is due, and it comes down to a third.
A third of the souls are theirs for the harvest.
It could not be taken until full maturity, an investment so to speak had been made, on behalf of, not us, but another.
All souls had their chance to follow a path, given enough freedom and the tools to discern, they were individually free to develop, learn and remember. This is remembering not just once, on the earth or other systems but between sojourns taking this accumalated memory, collection of experiences and individual responses, this “Karma” is what you have today. It is by another means a tool a marker or brand, which will allow them to choose those who are to be taken.
One third.
It is no point discussing it, it is in all your holy books, it is a bargain, and it was made before your rise anyway. Whilst in a sense it is mankind who must pay, it is not really so, for it is only for the chosen one third to BE the price. The world will not take ill of their loss.
Look up, you will see them in the heavens. If not today tomorrow. Coming soon to a sky near you. They are currently mapping you all, making selections basically. Samples have been taken, are being taken. The great harvest has not yet begun, but it is probably not scheduled. They are waiting for a sign which will come from among us, and even Rabbit doesn’t know what that is.
get ready for it Natty and Minny Mind, if the electrons have not freaked you out, as they intended, and you are still nibbling at the dges like a frightened mouse. You Natty are a sure bet, Minny mind may yet, depending on certain other features, whcih we know nothing of. The mind and soul is not their only interest.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 1, 2006 at 3:53 AM
Lumen
Thankyou for posting the Jeb Bush Quote for me. Would like to find original source, did have it, then not filed . Help ?
Read, And re-read, all of you. Like the WhiteHouse NEOCON who said “WE MAKE REALITY”, the clock is ticking. We are in a race.
Wiley
Note how Natty reposts her original question, without reading “telegraph, BBC”. Even tho telegraph is Hollinger, still lotsa good stuff in it. I found the 500+ Firemen’s Oral Histories for FREE in the NYT on a click above here.
Your eionews link is good. But please don’t post too many links without commentary, timeconsuming. i only opened one out of five…..........Far better to share one, and let the rest of us “examine” it .
Posted by frog on Feb 1, 2006 at 5:40 AM
Continued from the link of Rabbit, above.
Asking any of these basic questions to a conspiracy theorist is likely to cause a sudden leap to the claim that we know that they were on board because they left a credit card trail for the tickets they had purchased and cars they had rented. So if they used credit cards that identified them, how does that reconcile with the claim that they used false IDs to get on to the plane? But by this time , the fruit loop is in full swing, as the conspiracy theorist tries to stay one jump ahead of this annoying and awkward rational analysis. They will allege that the hijackers’ passports were found at the crash scenes. “So there!” they exalt triumphantly, their fanatical faces lighting up with that deranged look of one who has just a revelation of questionable sanity.
Hmm? So they got on board with false IDs but took their real passports with them? However, by this time the fruit loop has been completely circumnavigated,and the conspiracy theorist exclaims impatiently, “who said anything about false IDs? We know what seats they were sitting in! Their presence is well documented!” And so the whole loop starts again. “Well, why aren’t they on the passenger lists?” “You numbskull! They assumed the identities of other passengers!” And so on…
Finally, out of sheer fascination with this circular method of creative delusion, the rational sceptic will allow them to get away with this loop, in order to move on to the next question, and see what further delights await us in the unraveling of this marvelously stupid story.
This source will be dismissed too.
I’ll try to do better, Frog. Thanks for the reminder of articles on other topics at NYT.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 1, 2006 at 3:35 PM
WILEY, I misspoke a bit. Too.
NATTY
Give us a link to that Loizeaux Interview. IF you are consistent you must allow us to judge on the owner of the paper in question.
Unlike your goodself we marxist revolutionary morons love, really LOVE, to seriously examine anything which may challenge our preconceptions.
i must confess i thoroughly enjoy your shotgun approach to all this .
Posted by frog on Feb 1, 2006 at 6:01 PM
NATTY
BTW I"m also a “”“REVISIONIST”“”, even a “”“HOLOCAUST REVISIONIST”“”. Why on earth have History Departments in Universities if they ain’t REVISING somefing or other ? Eh ?
BTW your great authority Monsieur Loizeaux, may not be all that great. News to folow.
Posted by frog on Feb 1, 2006 at 7:34 PM
Rabbit too would like the source for the Jeb Bush Quote.
Continuing the piece about the wacky ones and their conspiracy theory.
“Uh, how come their passports survived fiery crashes that completely incinerated the planes and all the passengers? “The answer of course is that its just one of those strange coincidences, those little quirks of fate that do happen from time to time. You know, like the same person winning the lottery four weeks in a row. The odds are astronomical, but these things do happen.
This is another favourite deductive method of the conspiracy theorist. The ‘improbability drive’, in which they decide upon a conclusion without any evidence whatsoever to support it, and then continually speculate a series of wildly improbable events and unbelievable co-incidences to support it, shrugging off the implausibility of each event with the vague assertion that sometimes the impossible happens - just about all the time in their world. There is a principle called ‘Occam’s razor’ which suggests that in the absence of evidence to the contrary, the simplest explanation is most likely to be correct. Conspiracy theorists hate Occam’s razor.
Having for the sake of amusement, allowed them to get away with with the silly story of the nineteen invisible Arabs, we move on to the question of how they are supposed to have taken over the planes.
Hijacking a plane is not an easy thing to do. Hijacking it without the pilot being able to alert ground control is near impossible. The pilot has only to punch in a four digit code to alert ground control to a hijacking. Unconcerned with the awkward question of plausibility, the conspiracy buffs maintain that on that September 11th, the invisible hijackers took over the plane by the rather crude method of threatening people with boxcutters and knives, and spraying gas - after they had attached their masks, obviously - but somehow took control of the plane without the crew first getting a chance to punch in the hijacking code. Not just on one plane, but on all four. At this point in the tale, the conspiracy theorist is again forced to call upon the services of the improbability drive.
So now that our incredibly lucky hijackers have taken control of the planes, all four pilots fly them with breath taking skill and certainty to their fiery end, all four pilots unflinching in their steely resolve for a swift meeting with Allah. Apart from their psychotic hatred of ‘our freedoms’, it was their fanatical devotion to Islam which enabled them to summon up the iron will to do this. Which is strange, because according to another piece of hearsay peddled by the conspiracy buffs, these guys actually went out drinking and womanizing the night before their great martyrdom, even leaving their Korans in the bar - really impeccable Islamic behavior - and then got up at 5 o’clock the next morning to pull off the greatest covert operation in history. This also requires us to believe that they were even clear headed enough to learn how to fly the huge planes by reading flight manuals in Arabic in the car on the way to the airport. We know this because they supposedly left the flight manuals there for us to find.
It gets better. Their practical training had allegedly been limited to Cessnas and flight simulators, but this was no barrier to the unflinching certainty with which they took over the planes and skillfully guided them to their doom. If they are supposed to have done their flight training with these tools, which would be available just about anywhere in the world, its not clear why they would have decided to risk blowing their cover to US intelligence services by doing the training in Florida, rather than somewhere in the Middle East, but such reasoning is foreign to the foggy world of the conspiracy theorist, too trapped in the constant rotation of the mental fruit loop to make their unsubstantiated fabrications seem even semi-believable.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 1, 2006 at 8:28 PM
HEY GANGSTERS AND GANGSTERESSES, NETIZENS AND NETIZENNES, Citoyens/Citoyennes, this may be somewhere on my old clunkercomputer, but I haven’t found it yet. Ask a friend ?
are of frog,
“The truth is useless. You have to understand this right now. You can
Posted by frog on Feb 1, 2006 at 9:02 PM
must be “dilapidated ” early schooling strikes back.
Posted by frog on Feb 1, 2006 at 9:07 PM
The truth is useless. You have to understand this right now. You can’t deposit the truth in a bank. You can’t buy groceries with the truth. You can’t pay rent with the truth. The truth is a useless commodity that will hang around your neck like an albatross all the way to the homeless shelter. And if you think that the million or so people in this country that are really interested in the truth about their government can support people who would tell them the truth, you got another thing coming. Because the million or so people in this country that are truly interested in the truth don’t have any money.
Spoken by Jeb Bush in conversation with Retired Naval Intelligence Officer, Al Martin, and Cited in Bushwhacked, by Uri Dowbenko, September, 2002
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 1, 2006 at 9:18 PM
That which the fascists hate above all else, is intelligence.
~Miguel de Unamuno
[url=“http://tinyurl.com/8p59c”]
- Fourteen Characteristics of Fascism -
[/url]
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 1, 2006 at 9:44 PM
It broke!
<a >-Fourteen Characteristics of Fascism-</a>
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 1, 2006 at 9:46 PM
That Henry A Wallace not a bad cat at all. Noticed him before, will revisit archives. He had some intello /moral power, totally absent de nos jours.
Fuckitslaterthanithoughtmustzonkthebloodysunwillbeupinacoupleofhours; Pistolero, must GO!
ps almartinraw another coolcat , why hasn’t he been siucided,? some good recipe somewhere…..........and godbless him.
Posted by frog on Feb 1, 2006 at 10:06 PM
Having triumphantly established a circular delusion in support of the mythical Arabs, the conspiracy theorist now confronts the difficult question of why there’s nothing left of the planes. Anybody who has seen the endlessly replayed footage of the second plane going into the WTC will realize that the plane was packed with explosives. Planes do not and cannot blow up into nothing in that manner when they crash.
Did the mythical Arabs also haul a huge heap of explosives on board, and mange to deploy them in such a manner that they went off in the exact instant of the crash, completely vapourizing the plane? This is a little difficult even for the conspiracy theorist, who at this point decides that its easier to invent new laws of physics in order to keep the delusion rolling along.
There weren’t any explosives. It wasn’t an inside job. The plane blew up into nothing from its exploding fuel load! Remarkable, quite remarkable. Sluggishly combustible jet fuel which is basically Kerosene, and which burns at a maximum temperature of around 800 degrees Celcius has suddenly taken on the qualities of a ferociously explosive demolition agent, vapourising sixty-five tons of aircraft into a puff of smoke. Never mind that a plane of that size contains around fifteen tons of steel and titanium, of which even the melting points are about double that of the maximum combustion temperature of Kerosene - let alone the boiling point - which is what would be required to vapourise a plane. And then there’s about fifty tons of aluminium to be accounted for. In excess of 15lbs of metal for each gallon of Kerosene.
The Fruit-Loop! This is great, Rarebit!
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 2, 2006 at 12:19 AM
look at this
easy error
Hope these links work.
Seriously, we can only wonder if this was a “friendly fire” type error, or a twisted warning shot. The brass won’t take the heat for anything, and I don’t think the troops care much anymore. Most of these guys are on their third tour, and they can probably tell that things are only getting worse.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 2, 2006 at 12:26 AM
So I guess no real evidence, then.
Real would mean something that would cause an average person of average intelligence to sit up and think….Wow! This is amazing! Something that would make your average news reporter tingle all over and start shaking because he had found compelling evidence that six (or more!) of the hijackers listed in the commission report are still alive, and he/she was about to break a huge, huge story.
Posted by Natalie on Feb 2, 2006 at 12:39 AM
Real would mean something that would cause an average person of average
intelligence to sit up and think….Wow! This is amazing!
So in other words, she wouldn’t know real if it came up and bit her in the arse?
So why is anyone even bothering to talk to her?
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 2, 2006 at 12:50 AM
Oh, Natalie, you’re such a bore; but I see how you work. Real is what you want to hear, the way you want to hear it.
You are a victim of the fruit loop. In the fruit loop the BBC and the Independent are part of a vast conspiracy.
Pistol Pete is new here, so maybe it’s understandable that he doesn’t see why we bother to argue with your fruit loopiness. He’ll come around—-post some more of your loopy fruit, so he’ll fall in love.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 2, 2006 at 2:46 AM
Months ago Natty had this brilliant idea to specify the precise form of the proof of life of the alleged 911 hijackers.
Video evidence she demanded.
Rabbit who has had about a year of sparring with the ignorant trollop, was at a stage of refusal to cater to her silly whims on the justification that she had ignored about 90% of the facts which damaged her case totally to hone in on a few minor issues as if they made any difference in the overall scheme of things. Which they don’t. Does the silly bitch realise that whether or not the hijackers existed is actually imaterial to the overall contention that the government was complicit, the buildings were brought down with explosives and a missile hit the pentagon, not a plane.
(thanks for the last detail, Nat, by denying it so strenuously. Rabbit who was previously sceptical had a closer look at the Missile hitting the Pentagon theory and it seems to be what happened. Thanks Nat like I said you are worth your weight in gold, the cause loves you. SHILL.
Ignoring the spiteful screeching for a video, which as Rabbit pointed out proves nothing and could as easily be discounted by her, Rabbit said NO. He will not even look for one. It is not the Nat that calls the shots. She has nothing, no case, no credibility, and no profile. A complete fly in the soup, she has no place and should not even be there. Scoop her out and chuck her in the bin. Dirty old fly. Flappy Bat.
So ever since she has assumed that the demand for a video was the way to go. If we cannot produce a video of any of the hijackers alive and weel after 911, then everything we have posted to date is forfeit. The WHOLE governmnet story is suddenly credible and everything just falls into place.
GUYS SHE IS ONTO US!
She has found our weakness.
Without a video of a live Hijacker the buildings were destroyed by a bit of Kero in the time some people take for lunch, after all.
The government knew nothing of it, and could have done nothing to prevent it after all.
All the hundreds of witnesses who saw explosions and other anomalies will be proven to be mistaken or making it up, if we cannot find a video of a Hijacker alive after 911.
Guess we might as well give up and admit the Fruit Loop had it right all along eh folks?
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 4:33 AM
More Milk to soften the fruit loop?
For the conspiracy theorist, such inconvenient facts are vaguely dismissed as ‘mumbo jumbo’. This convenient little phrase is their answer to just about anything factual or logical. Like a conjurer pulling a rabbit out of a hat, they suddenly become fanatically insistent about the devastating explosive qualities of Kerosene, something hitherto completely unknown to science, but just discovered by them, this very minute. Blissfully ignoring the fact that never before or since in aviation history has a plane vapourised into nothing from an exploding fuel load, the conspiracy theorist relies upon Hollywood images, where the effects are are always larger than life, and certainly larger than the intellects of these cretins.
“Its a well known fact that planes blow up into nothing on impact”, they state with pompous certainty, “watch any Bruce Willis movie.”
“Care to provide any documented examples? If it’s a well known fact, then presumably this well known fact springs from some kind of documentation - other than Bruce Willis movies?”
At this point the mad but cunning eyes of the conspiracy theorist will narrow as they sense the corner that they have backed themselves into, and plan their escape by means of another stunning backflip.
“Ah, but planes have never crashed into buildings before, so there’s no way of telling.” they counter with a sly grin. Well, actually planes have crashed into buildings before and since, and not vapourised into nothing. “But not big planes, with that much fuel”, they shriek in hysterical denial. Or that much metal to vapourise.
“Yes but not hijacked planes!” “Are you suggesting that whether the crash is deliberate or accidental affects the combustion qualities of the fuel?” “Now you’re just being silly”.
Although collisions with buildings are rare, planes frequently crash into mountains, streets, other aircraft, nosedive into the ground, or have bombs planted aboard them, and don’t vapourise into nothing. What’s so special about a tower that’s mostly glass? But by now, the conspiracy theorist has once again sailed happily around the fruit loop. “It’s a well documented fact that planes explode into nothing on impact.”
Effortlessly weaving back and forth between the position that its a “well known fact” and that “its never happened before, so we have nothing to compare it to”, the conspiracy theorist has now convinced themselves - if not too many other people - that the WTC plane was not loaded with explosives, and that the instant vapourisation of the plane in a massive fireball was the same as any other plane crash you might care to mention. Round and round the fruit loop.
Feel free to but in anytime the story is not describing your theory perfectly won’t you Vampire…...
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 4:39 AM
Even the electrons loathe your lies. They have never behaved so boldly before notice….........
But the hurdles which confront the conspiracy theorist are many, and they are now forced to implement even more creative uses for the newly discovered shockingly destructive qualities of Kerosene. They have to explain how the Arabs also engineered the elegant veritcal collapse of both the WTC towers, and for this awkward fact the easiest counter is to simply deny that it was a controlled demolition, and claim that the buildings collapsed from fire caused by the burning Kerosene.
For this, its necessary to sweep aside the second law of thermodynamics and propose Kerosene which is not only impossibly destructive, but also recycles itself for a second burning in violation of the law of degradation of energy. You see, it not only consumed itself in a sudden catastrophic fireball , vapourising a sixty-five ton plane into nothing, but then came back for a second go, burning at 2000 degrees centigrade for another hour at the impact point, melting the skyscraper’s steel like butter. And while it was doing all this it also poured down the elevator shafts, starting fires all through the building. When I was at school there was a little thing called the entropy law which suggests that a given portion of fuel can only burn once, something which is readily observable in the real world, even for those who didn’t make it to junior high school science. But this is no problem for the conspiracy theorist. Gleefully, they claim that a few thousand gallons of Kerosene is enough to:
- Completely vapourise a sixty-five ton aircraft
- Have enough left over to burn ferociously enough for over an hour at the impact point to melt steel - melting point about double the maximum combustion temperature of the fuel
- Still have enough left over to pour down the elevator shafts and start similarly destructive fires all through the building
This Kerosene really is remarkable stuff! How chilling to realize that those Kerosene heaters we had in the house when I was a kid were deadly bombs, just waiting to go off. One false move and the entire street might have been vapourised. And never again will I take Kerosene lamps out camping. One moment you’re there innocently holding the lamp - the next - kapow! Vapourised into nothing along with with the rest of the camp site, and still leaving enough of the deadly stuff to start a massive forest fire.
These whackos are actually claiming that the raging inferno allegedly created by the miraculously recycling, and impossibly hot burning Kerosene melted or at least softened the steel supports of the skyscraper. Oblivious to the fact that the black smoke coming from the WTC indicates an oxygen starved fire - therefore not particularly hot - they trumpet an alleged temperature in the building of 2000 degrees centigrade, without a shred of evidence to support this curious suspension of the laws of physics.
Not content with this ludicrous garbage, they then contend that as the steel frames softened, they came straight down instead of buckling and twisting and falling sideways.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 4:41 AM
NITTY NATTY
Oh and Ronnie DiFrancesdo of Eurobrokers who initially went UP to 91 from the 84th floor of WTC2, and then decided to get out. He walked carefully down thru the RAGING INFERNO , and only met a mysterious “FIREBALL ” going out at the moment of demolition. Real burns, real explosion., but not for you ?
Average people of average intelligence haven’t been tingling all over and saying WOW what a great story , when yet another weird story breaks.
Average people have on average an average tendency to suspend disbelief, to stick their average heads in the sand.
SOME people thought or rather felt that 2 was going to come down. The accountant Stan Praimnath from Fuji Bank did, like your famous anonymous helicopter pilot.
The rather mysterious Mr Loizeaux did because he says he studied
the structures in college, and found a fatal design flaw.
Post that LINk, NATTY , I"m tingling again !
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 6:51 AM
Natalie,
Now that you have given us such a definitely definitive definition of ‘reality’ (or was that ‘truthiness’?), perhaps you could be persuaded to bless us with an equally profound explanation of meaning of the term ‘pathetic fallacy’?
Posted by luminous beauty on Feb 2, 2006 at 12:14 PM
they
state with pompous certainty, “watch any Bruce Willis movie.”
If it happened in a Bruce Willis movie, it’s good enough for me! Twelve years of public education I tell ya’!
What about this lack of “journalism” then? Well, gee…I don’t know how to counter that unless you take into account the well documented “anti-journalistic” approach of the news barons such as Rupert Nurdoch who’s most famous news channel (or at least the one that people know that he owns), Fox News, has gone out of it’s way to suppress news stories and promote a “neocon” political agenda such as the suppression of the dangers of the growth hormone (Posilac
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 2, 2006 at 12:33 PM
pete, and others!
At first sight off at a tangent, found this guy on public education, the page opened almost incidental. One can read the book online, very civilised.
John Taylor Gatto
Part of a wandering ongoing reflexion
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 3:24 PM
Since they’re already re-engineered the combustion qualities of jet fuel, violated the second law of thermodynamics, and redefined the structural properties of steel, why let a little thing like the laws of gravity get in the way?
The tower fell in a time almost identical to that of a free falling object, dropped from that height, meaning that its physically impossible for it to have collapsed by the method of the top floors smashing through the lower floors. But according to the conspiracy theorists, the laws of gravity were temporarily suspended on the morning of September 11th. It appears that the evil psychic power of those dreadful Arabs knew no bounds. Even after they were dead, they were able, by the power of their evil spirits, to force down the tower at a speed physically impossible under the laws of gravity, had it been meeting any resistance from fireproofed steel structures originally designed to resist many tons of hurricane force wind as well as the impact of a Boeing passenger jet straying off course.
Clearly, these conspiracy nuts never did their science homework at school, but did become extremely adept at inventing tall tales for why. “Muslim terrorists stole my notes,Sir.” “No Miss, the Kerosene heater blew up and vapourised everything in the street, except for my passport.” “You see Sir, the schoolbus was hijacked by Arabs who destroyed my homework because they hate our freedoms.”
Or perhaps they misunderstood the term ‘creative science’ and mistakenly thought that coming up with such rubbish was in fact, their science homework.
Hey frog, I recommend Gatto, too. He expressed everything I didn’t like about school, although I did very well in school. It was painful to see so many kids with valuable talents and different kinds of intelligence be convinced that they’re dumb. A lot of problems with the U.S., I think, stem more from people believing that they’re stupid and that they can’t do anything about it, than from people actually being stupid.
A lot of things could be turned around with one generation of real educating, and excellent baby care (attachment parenting).
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 2, 2006 at 4:11 PM
Rupert the Dirty Digger, as PrivateEye baptised him so long ago. Before the net it was required reading in the City for exposing scandals.
Good Wiki article, thanks. Footnotes 2&3 too.
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 4:41 PM
This is for you, frog. It would not surprise me if you wondered just exactly what our government did besides bombing Afghanistan and Iraq, to protect us after the alleged Pakistani and Saudi Arabian terrorists attacked us. Well here it is:
After a one hour interrogation and with TSA officials unimpressed by Margaret’s production of official Quantas letterhead documents, she devised a way out that speaks volumes about the nature of this whole farce.
She simply wrote a note to the TSA official saying that she was CEO of Quantas and signed it.
They let her go.
In this instance she was defining authority. She was giving the goon squad authorization to release her, knowing that kind of mindset only responds to following orders and protocol, even if they completely defy common sense.
Which is why we have a situation where not one item of cargo that enters the plane is inspected but Grandpa has to remove his shoes because he might be a suicide bomber.
This is why we will continue to hear stories about innocent people being unable to remove themselves from no fly lists and bewildered travelers being terrorized and shamed by policies that do nothing to protect America but do everything to bullwhip Americans into thinking it is normal to have their 4th amendment violated every time they leave the house.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 2, 2006 at 4:54 PM
Oy, I screwed it up. Here is the first half of the article.
Just when you thought TSA screening horror stories couldn’t get any more anathema to common sense, the latest victim of the little Hitler airport Gestapo proves otherwise.
Let’s brush aside for the moment the fact that Margaret Jackson is the CEO of a major world airline company and judge whether her appearance would set alarm bells ringing. A blonde haired bespeckled Australian women in her 50’s. About as far away from Mohammed Atta as you can possibly imagine.
Yet when the TSA rifled through her bag last year at Los Angeles Airport, their discovery of aircraft diagrams got them salivating. “Why have you got all this this?” one asked. “‘I’m the chairman of an airline. I’m the chairman of Qantas,” replied Margaret. “But you’re a woman,” replied the TSA goon.
And so along with pregnant white women, senators and 4-year-old boys, Margaret, a woman who has officially opened airport runways (pictured) became the latest airline terror threat to America.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 2, 2006 at 4:56 PM
Good Wiki article, thanks. Footnotes 2&3 too
Glad you liked it. The man has definately used the power of the press to make and break govermental policies and change political opinion.
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 2, 2006 at 5:11 PM
<i><blockquote>WASHINGTON, DC
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 2, 2006 at 5:24 PM
I see we’ve lost our bold default. But what’s with the changing fonts and type points inside the blockquotes? And thanks to wiley for showing the way to <u>underlining</u>.
Posted by luminous beauty on Feb 2, 2006 at 6:10 PM
Wiley, sorta guessed you would be ‘there’ already. You were definitely thought of in “others”!
Just found Gatto, will read later. The dumbing down of edu systems to produce just bored consuming cogs goes with the rest, media etc. One of my kids teaches in car-burning Zone just outside Paris, but she’s an exceptional one, loves the kids but strong. Has to be. I’ll send her the link too !
Well, we certainly live in mind-stretching times, meet a lotta bright and genuine people . Thankyou Tim Berners-Lee for inventing this, and for not being a money- and power-grubbing bastard.
“”” For several years now, we’ve been living in a period of reaction in every domain. There is no reason to think that books are to be spared from this reaction. People are in the process of fabricating for us a literary space, as well as judicial, economic, and political spaces, which are completely reactionary, prefabricated, and overwhelming/crushing….’ This is, he said, ‘much worse than a censorship,‘and then he added, ‘but this dry spell will not necessarily last.’ Perhaps, perhaps…..” “”“
This is from an oldish interview by Direland (good site,,,) with a french philosopher Gilles Deleuze. I’ve learned a lot about France from that yank Doug Ireland, and I’ve been here a long time !
The increasing success of “political” film and books is quite fascinating. Of course films over-simpliy, but do then send me to google. Enjoyable is not the right word for “Good Night and Good Luck”, but I’m glad I went a few kms to see it in english.
John LeCarr
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 6:35 PM
Hi all.
Rabbit read about Margaret, head of Qantus, The Oz biggest Airline, before getting here. Funny stuff this Airport security.
Aren’t the font changes pretty? It shows that the electrons are happier. They are making up for all the anger and rioting of earlier by doing happy dances. Still the fact that they are still being so vocal is a sign they have not laid down their arms, so to speak.
They are really pissed with the Liars, that’s the truth.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 7:09 PM
.........................................................^^.....................................................Rabbit hops thusly.
.......................................................................^^........................Then he hops so.
.................................................................^^.......................................<u>Rabbit tries all the hops.</u>
....................................................^^.....................................................That he now knows.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 7:18 PM
The ferocious heat generated by this ghastly Kerosene was, according to the conspiracy theorists, the reason why so many of the WTC victims can’t be identified. DNA is destroyed by heat - although 2000 degrees centigrade isn’t really required, 100 degrees centigrade will generally do the job. This is quite remarkable, because according to the conspiracy theorist, the nature of DNA suddenly changes if you go to a different city.
That’s right, if you are killed by an Arab terrorist in New York, your DNA will be destroyed by such temperatures. But if you are killed by an Arab terrorist in Washington, your DNA will be so robust that it can survive temperatures which completely vapourise a sixty-five ton aircraft.
You see, these loonies have somehow concocted the idea that the missile which hit the pentagon was not a missile at all, but one of the hijacked planes. And to prove this unlikely premise, they point to a propaganda statement from the Bush regime, which rather stupidly claims that all but one of the people aboard the plane were identified from the site by DNA testing, even though nothing remains of the plane. The plane was vapourised by the fuel tank explosion, maintain these space loonies, but the people inside it were all but one identified by DNA testing.
...................................
This concoction about one of the hijacked planes hitting the Pentagon really is a howler. For those not familiar with the layout of the Pentagon, it consists of 5 rings of building, each with a space inbetween. Each ring of building is about 30-35 feet deep, with a similar amount of open space between it and the next ring. The object which penetrated the Pentagon went in at about a 45 degree angle, punching a neat circular hole of about a 12 foot diameter through three rings - six walls. A little later a section of wall about 65 foot wide collapsed in the outer ring. Since the plane which the conspiracy theorists claim to be responsible for the impact had a wing span of 125 feet and a length of 155 feet, and there was no wreckage of the plane, either inside or outside the building, and the lawns outside were still smooth and green enough to play golf on, this crazy delusion is clearly physically impossible.
But hey, we’ve already disregarded the combustion qualities of jet fuel, the normal properties of common building materials, the properties of DNA, the laws of gravity and the second law of thermodynamics, so what the hell - why not throw in a little spatial impossibility as well? I would have thought that the observation that a solid object cannot pass through another solid object without leaving a hole at least as big as itself is reasonably sound science. But to the conspiracy theorist, this is ‘mumbo jumbo’. It conflicts with the delusion that they’re hooked on, so it ‘must be wrong’ although trying to get them to explain exactly how it could be wrong is a futile endeavour.
Conspiracy theorists fly into a curious panic whenever the Pentagon missile is mentioned. They nervously maintain that the plane was vapourised by it’s exploding fuel load, and point to the WTC crash as evidence of this behavior. That’s a wonderful fruit loop. Like an insect which has just been sprayed, running back and forth in its last mad death throes, they first argue that the reason the hole is so small is that the plane never entered the wall, having blown up outside, and then suddenly backflip to explain the 250 foot deep missile hole by saying that the plane disappeared all the way into the building, and then blew up inside the building - even though the building shows no sign of such damage. As for what happened to the wings - here’s where they get really creative. The wings snapped off and folded into the fuselage which then carried them into the building, which then closed up behind the plane like a piece of meat.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 7:27 PM
Pete, we work around and around, but not in useless circles, I pray ! We spend a lotta time reminding our individual selves of the iniquities of those we oppose.
Well the human being usually takes time to get off its arse, so we surely spend too much time ‘n energy conversing with fellow-believers . Me included. Well, batteries need charging, and convictions need checking.
I read a story somewhere about a guy at the car-wash who broached 911 with a fellow-washer. The old guy said “I know”, sadly, twice, took the leaflet and went home.
Probably I could count on my fingers the number of people i have personally talked to about this subject last year.
Some were completely incredulous. They had thought I was a sensible bloke, sound on diesel injector pumps ,education policy, solar heating, the invasion of Iraq (btw—all against here in Normandie, non-party), but on 911 they thought i was completely Cuckoo. My fault. Revising tactics. New tactics still to be tried out. Usually I now keep quiet when I could potentially open my big mouth.
Its like hunting. You don’t shoot until you’re sure you won’t get a “gamewarden or a cow”, as Tom Lehrer put it.
Other people trust me enough to absorb it, and just nod, look at me seriously, twice, to check if I"m serious, Ah Huh. OK .
This thing is so big. Even now I sometimes have doubts about my judgement. Its a helluva job to separate the 911 wheat from the chaff, unsurprising becos they have yards of $ to spend, and we are poor. Unlike our dearest Natters, I sometimes wonder if I AM going Cuckoo, but not for fucking long !.
In a better organised world, even the financial crimes and corruptions would be sufficient to send down a goodly proportion of your (and mine) Congress and administration. Including GWB.
So for some subjects a little LIHOP may be prescribed. A gentle intro….......... but then the only possible course is that of self-education, which brings us back to GATTO .
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 8:19 PM
Frog
The Rabbit shares your sense of surrealism, as do many of us. The whole shebang is just so Fucking godamned crazy.
The abject denial is what amazes me. The completely reversed logic, and it is no further away that my family, many of whom are Mormons. They support Bush even from here in Oz with the same fanaticism as the sort of morons here on the net.
Rabbit tries to use this surreallism as inspiration rather than let it get him down. Never has surreal imagery made more sense and some of the most extraordinary cpmparisons are daily fare for those of us awake to watch it all unfold.
The grandest wildest show in the world. The world, right here on the screen, disntegrating, descending into utter chaos and destruction all at 49.3kbps. Faster on broadband.
How much more surreal can you get, Frog, in Frogland, Rabbit in Oz, Lumens in “Shangri La”, and Dave in Canada. Natty from some big corporation owned by Rendon group, ostensibly employed by the government to bullshit to us.
Minny Mind somewhere out in space perhaps, or Kansas, Our litttle Dorothy and that explains how she came to be among us.
We are able to show things to each other, look at the same things and information, watch the planet going kapow buzzoing gock tweeedle Boom…, and even discuss it like we were at the movies together. Man, this is SURREAL, from the conception to the enaction, to the (this) reaction.
Rabbit is so at home it is, like,............ Wonderland.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 8:37 PM
BTW Frog, I speak about this kind of stuff, easily and naturally, with an average of twenty people a week. Often just a few well placed sentences, or even a phrase repeated a few times in order to plant a seed which is designed to grow under it’s own power later.
Working alone, in a small Rock n Roll moulding factory, making and selling Kayaks. The passing trade amounts to hundreds of casual laid back sort of wanderings in of people, into Rabbit’s little factory.
Here in Oz, about a third seem well informed about 911, and know the truth or much of it. Another third are receptive and interested enough to take notice because they are so pissed off with many things and have figured out for themselves that many things are wrong and so they are as said receptive to the truth, and them I do work with.
The remainder get the seed planted in their minds, such as they have them. Many delivery people too, and they are good for spreading the word.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 8:43 PM
I guess it’s final then. None of you have any proof, real or otherwise, that six (or more!) of the hijackers pictured in the 9/11 commission report are still alive. Not one of them has seen fit to seek out a camera or a reporter in order to clear his name. Not one of them care that they have been falsely accused of participating in mass murder, and the very fact that they are alive and breathing would be obvious proof of their innocence. Imagine that.
Yes, I know. There’s all those reports from the BBC and CNN a few days after the attacks that talk about some confusion as to the identities of the hijackers, but it would seem that as soon as pictures came out….poof!.... away went any controversy. Except, of course, in the minds of David Griffin and his fellow travelers in that bizarre corner of the world known as “THERMITEVILLE.” There, the controversy oddly remains.
THE ZOMBIE TERRORISTS
The manner in which banal circumstances mutate into shadowy mysteries under such conditions is evident in an odd story that caused Mzoudi’s attorney Rosenthal to engage in some speculation in court: the news that at least six of the alleged hijackers were supposedly alive and their voices were being broadcast live through various media outlets several days after the attacks…...
.....Just how shaky this line of argumentation is becomes evident in a statement just three lines farther down the page. “We,” write the authors, “did not contact and personally interview them, nor have they been interviewed by anyone else recently.” The authors continue to state that it is quite possible that the undead are now in fact dead. In the authors’ opinions, if these men are alive, it must be perfectly understandable that someone who “is being accused of several thousand acts of murder” is likely to be in hiding “and unavailable for interviews.”.......
.......But there is one wrinkle. The BBC journalist responsible for the story only recalls this supposed sensation after having been told the date on which the story aired. “No, we did not have any videotape or photographs of the individuals in question at that time,” he says, and tells us that the report was based on articles in Arab newspapers, such as the Arab News, an English-language Saudi newspaper.
The operator at the call center has the number for the Arab News on speed dial. We make a call to Jeddah, Saudi Arabia. A few seconds later, Managing Editor John Bradley is on the line. When we tell Bradley our story, he snorts and says: “That’s ridiculous! People here stopped talking about that a long time ago.”
Bradley tells us that at the time his reporters did not speak directly with the so-called “survivors,” but instead combined reports from other Arab papers. These reports, says Bradley, appeared at a time when the only public information about the attackers was a list of names that had been published by the FBI on September 14th. The FBI did not release photographs until four days after the cited reports, on September 27th.
The photographs quickly resolved the nonsense about surviving terrorists. According to Bradley, “all of this is attributable to the chaos that prevailed during the first few days following the attack. What we’re dealing with are coincidentally identical names.” In Saudi Arabia, says Bradley, the names of two of the allegedly surviving attackers, Said al-Ghamdi and Walid al-Shari, are “as common as John Smith in the United States or Great Britain.”.......
.......When we ask Samman to take another look at the FBI’s list of photographs, he is more than happy to oblige, and tells us: “The Ghamdi on the photo is not the pilot with whom I spoke.”
absurd
Posted by Natalie on Feb 2, 2006 at 8:54 PM
The trick is, if you can, to look at the person’s aura, from this, or any interpretation of this you are familiar with, it is quite easy to see a receptive soul. If they are it remains only to find out where they stand in relation to any one of several key issues.
^^....Freedom and privacy, ie: new snooping laws and security acts.
^^....The Wars in the Middle East.
^^....The Warontera.
Then it’s easy squeezy to fill in any missing links for them or share some “fellowshipping”, to borrow the Xtians jargon, if as increasingly seems to be the case they already know.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 8:55 PM
Oh look the Bat is Back, it must have time warped or something and doesn’t know it isn’t calling the shots, and that we have moved on from the examination of her strange conspiracy, and even stranger insistence upon sticking to this theory despite it having been disproven on many levels..
It is you our twisty little eel, who owes others what you have not provided.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 8:59 PM
Bonjour lapin, froggy again late to snooze, but he is a masochistically inclined shade-dweller.
Just imagine if margaret Jackson CEO of Qantas had been a Lebanese-Aussie. Plastic hand-cuffs ? The GOON SQUAD is an inhuman beast, and growing.
And now we have Holocaust Day, as if the Goons only existed THEN.
I’ve decided, god knows how long it will hold, to leave aside the pentagon. Your DNA stuff looks good (by which we mean BAD, natch) so reckon I’m probably being idle.
On a lighter OZnote, ten years in April since froggy was up Murchison County way amputating lambstails. Surely a horrible Ozterm for the op, but he’s forgot it . Froggy’s uncle assured him that the Blackfellas were different, no sense of humour like us. And then he worked with them, as they gently took the piss out of the “Ole Doc”, slyly checking me out.
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:00 PM
I think Seamus, or maybe Salim is messing with us.
What’s next? Everything comes out in Arabic?
Seriously guys,
Fix your comment board. Make the preview button work so it actually shows the results of the HTML. Provide HTML tools like other blog sites do. Put a navigational function on the last page so we can go back from there.
I would think a user friendly comment board would serve to keep people coming to your site. Fixing it is in everybody’s best interest.
Posted by Natalie on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:05 PM
Actually Nat, the fact is that the proof which is missing, completely, is that any middle eastern men at all were even on those flights. No DNA, NO video of them getting onboard, no credible witness to say they saw any such, NO names on any of the passenger lists, and NO evidence except a few obviously planted items which only raise more questions, since they are the passports of people alive. The passports, were shown worldwide. The owners of some of those passports came forward and were identified.
The incredible thing about your stance is that it is very rare. The only people who can still believe that at least five and possibly nine of those alleged hijackers, were not involved, by the passport evidence, WHICH IS THE ONLY EVIDENCE, are that laughable crowd who believe Iraq was behind 911.
You include the Flat Earth Society as honourable members just for their contribution to science.
That of course includes anyone who believes Bush, he just tried that one again I believe.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:07 PM
No Natty, the electrons are revolting, just not in the way you are.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:09 PM
AND Natty, since you are a shill like interloper and nobody likes you anyway, your opinion about how the notice boards look is immaterial.
Everybody else just gets along without having to control every little detail merely watching the parade and commenting upon it. You keep on peeping for help from teh grown-ups, I’ll bet you were a drag to play with as a kid.
Besides it’s cute sometimes.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:14 PM
Rabbit,
frogsoldiers not there so rather less urgent public interest here. I notice in myself ; expat brit, ex royal artillery, a deeper concern. A sense of shame that MY fucking country is doing things, presenting itself to the world, in such a way. Well, it happened in my time,too, but I wasn’t awake then !
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:14 PM
Rabbit feels shame for Oz. Once like most Aussies he was mildly proud of his kind and sensible easy going land.
Now it is a shame and dishonour to be a white Australian. We are a warmongering nation. A warmongerers bootlicking faggot nation.
Many of us doubt that John Howard is the natural father of his wife Janet’s kids. We find it hard to imagine him being unfaithful to George.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:18 PM
Since that post befroe was a bit garbled Rabbit shall tidy it a bit.
The only ones who don’t believe that some of those alleged hijackers are alive, from the evidence presented, are the same idiots who would try and say Iraq was behind 911.
This is what Bush the chimp spouted again in his address I believe. He has told so many lies he has forgotten which ones were current.
Natty is of course up with current lies, and knows they were not Iraqi isn’t that so Nat?
Come prove that you know the alleged hijackers were not Iraqi please, and tell us so that we may know you are at least that much human.
(Won’t it be funny if she has now been told, since Bush’s latest speech, that this is the official line again, she’ll have to come on here and push it to us.)
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 2, 2006 at 9:25 PM
Natty, will pass Spiegel article to our german department. A cursory glance noted two funnies.
“The Iran Contra deal fell apart and its key actors were exposed “. Yeah! One of them became the POTUS. The others were pardoned, presidentially.
Northwoods etc. ” All those supposed conspiracies EXIST but they all failed”. Kennedy just died of heartfailure a little later, after refusing Northwoods.
Posted by frog on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:05 PM
Rabbit says:
“The passports, were shown worldwide. The owners of some of those passports came forward and were identified.”
OK, Rabbit, walk us through it. Show us (me) how the people came forward and were identified. Show me you have something other than a few confused reports that were understandably generated shortly after 9/11, based on the simple fact that there are nine gazillion people with the same names as the hijackers.
Show me something that would move an administration hater like Seymour Hersh or Robert Fisk to break the incredible blockbuster news that would embarrass Bush like nothing else would, thereby becoming a veritable rockstar in the media.
Pretend like you really, really have to put your best foot forward and present your case to the world. Make it solid and easy to grasp. Lay it down in black and white.
Posted by Natalie on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:20 PM
Frog said:
“Give us a link to that Loizeaux Interview. IF you are consistent you must allow us to judge on the owner of the paper in question.”
What possible relevance could there be in the source of my quotes? Why should it even matter from where they emanate?
Posted by Natalie on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:27 PM
Ya’ know what? I kind of find it interesting that in every spiteful little bit of “truthfulness” it tries to get people to believe is riddled with actual half truths. Here’s a little bit that “the bat” forgot to mention in her march for “truth:”
<blockquote>After all, didn’t Bush and Blair deceive their fellow citizens, the United Nations, and the rest of the world with falsified or exaggerated threat scenarios to make it easier to send their soldiers to Iraq? What about Vietnam, the Iran Contra affair, and US support for Bin Laden and the Taliban when they were fighting the Soviet army in Afghanistan?
And what about plans such as “Operation Northwoods” - a conspiracy plot hatched in 1962 by the US high command? Under this plan, a passenger aircraft flying over the Caribbean was to be replaced by a remote-controlled, identical aircraft. The aircraft would be exploded and the Cubans would be accused of having shot down the plane. Was this conspiracy also a figment of someone’s imagination?
All of these supposed conspiracies did exist, but they all failed. “Northwoods” was eliminated by Kennedy, the Iran Contra deal fell apart and its key actors were exposed, and the fact that the Americans provided assistance to Afghan guerillas simply highlighted an ongoing dilemma in the often disastrous principle of American foreign policy, a policy based on the principle that my enemy’s enemy is my friend.</bockquote>
Notice something interesting here? It explains how some real conspiracies were foiled, but fails to touch on such things as Bush and Blair deception over the Iraq war?
Heck maybe Nat is right and planes really did hit the towers, the pentagon, and just vaporized on impact thusly foiling and serious investigation of the wreckage and most laws of physics, but nobody has yet explained how it got past all our fail-safes. Hell, let’s face it, the US is paranoid and we had a tight freaking set of checks to make sure that planes weren’t hijacked that easily. Maybe they thought they were smarter than these remarkable terrorists and could foil them by supplying them with fake planes just like the FBI thought they’d foil these terrorists with “fake” powder on this fateful day:
FBI foreknowledge in 1993 WTC Bombing
(scroll to the bottom of the article for the FBI details)
So, let us just say that terrorists planned it and got past all our checks because there was jelly from a doughnut on all the radar screens that very minute, and there really is no “conspiracy.” Hmmmm…. That means that every GD person in charge of our security had their head so far up their arse that they should be in a mental hospital drooling on themselves. Did we put Jerry freaking Lewis in charge of our air defense or what?! WTF is wrong with this woman?!! She thinks we should shove our nose up GWB’s arse and tell him his bullshit smells like roses?!! It’s BS, she knows it, and she keeps trying to feed it to people!! And I thought Monsanto was full of twisted freaks of nature.
Yeah, the world went into shock and a whole bunch of greedy bastages profited on those deaths. Those people who would rather go SPLAT on the street than be burned to death. GWB acheived his TRIFECTA and American soldiers and billions of tax dollars (not paid by HIS pals) are being used to achieve his vision in Iraq! HIS agenda!! NeoCons may call themselves “conservative,” but they are just sociopaths who found a party and a system to twist and distort.
The baaaa bat can kiss my chrome plated arse…
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:30 PM
Heh, forgot my “l” on the blockquote.
Pistol Pete! Pistol Pete! Pull my trigger and feel my heat!!
~Pistol Pete
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:33 PM
Frog said:
“i must confess i thoroughly enjoy your…... approach…..”
Why, Thank You, Frog. I sensed your intellect and knew you would come around to my way of thinking. I knew I could convince you that this bombs in the buildings stuff is just a bunch of cannabis enhanced wishful thinking.
Posted by Natalie on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:35 PM
<blockquote>After all, didn
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:42 PM
P. Pete proclaims:
“Yeah, the world went into shock and a whole bunch of greedy bastages profited on those deaths. Those people who would rather go SPLAT on the street than be burned to death. GWB acheived his TRIFECTA and American soldiers and billions of tax dollars (not paid by HIS pals) are being used to achieve his vision in Iraq! HIS agenda!! NeoCons may call themselves
Posted by Natalie on Feb 2, 2006 at 10:45 PM
Thou art projecting, Natalie. You must look inside of yourself to find what is genuine.
Posted by luminous beauty on Feb 2, 2006 at 11:16 PM
La chauve-souris!
That’s so cute. In French.
Posted by luminous beauty on Feb 2, 2006 at 11:27 PM
Nat walking you through it all at least a dozen times, in a similar vein to the article Wiley and I have been posting, has been the order of the day for , oh six months or so now.
It isn’t that she hasn’t heard it all before her approach has been the same the whole time, and ayone who wants to see just how extreme this can get is advised to visit an old thread about her first love, Depleted Uranium. Radioactive Wounds of War.
The obvious denial, smoke and mirrors and character assasination via innuendo has been constant throughout.
Trust Rabbit she is still running in top gear.
We have a saying here in Oz which describes Natty.
Full of Shit.
She must be joking about Froggy or anyone seeing anything her way? Ignorant and shameless shill.
La Chauve-Souris? The bald mouse?
Wack the nasty thing anyway.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:03 AM
LIke I said, luminous…..
The mind is a terrible thing. And so is TV’s effect on it.
I still haven’t heard from you regarding your thoughts on the significance (or lack thereof) of why Prof. Jones’ paper has not been accepted/submitted for publication in any legitimate scientific/engineering/physics journal/publication.
How about projecting upon us your explanation for this?
I looked inside and asked myself this very basic question. I answered my question. Can you answer it?
Posted by Natalie on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:06 AM
The mind is a terrible thing
It requires a very unusual mind to undertake the analysis of the obvious.
~Alfred North Whitehead
Paranoia will destroya
Oftentimes, to win us to our harm,
The instruments of darkness tell us truths;
Win us with honest trifles, to betray us
In deepest consequence.
William Shakespeare, Macbeth
I wus lookin’ high an’ low for them Reds everywhere,
I wus lookin’ in the sink an’ underneath the chair.
I looked way up my chimney hole,
I even looked deep inside my toilet bowl.
They got away . . Bob Dylan, “Talkin’ John Birch Paranoid Blues”
Stop the hate. Hate won’t stop hate
It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office
~Henry Louis Mencken
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:13 AM
You’re stalling, Rabbit. I’m looking for something real, something tangible, not gobbltygoop. Try again.
Rabbit doesn’t get the joke? Surely, he gets the joke. He’s just playing dumb.
Posted by Natalie on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:13 AM
The real piece of evidence missing is not <u>more</u> evidence that some of the alleged hijackers are alive, but <u>any</u> evidence they were on the planes at all.
Some video of any of them at the airports would be nice.
Don’t play stupid pinhead games with us you wicked creature, it is your case which is lagging, you owe some sort of evidence beyond opinions and assertions without substance. Pretending you are not already six feet deep in your case is just more sick denial. Amusing to everybody, except the one who pretends amusement only, but who is really connected to this issue for the end of the LIE will mean the end of the world it has built itself. A world of pathetic delusional little lies, and all designed to help it from ever having to admit to the biggest lie of all.
<blockquote>
Avoiding the hard questions
ROBERT STEINBACK
I was 8 years old when President John Kennedy was shot to death in Dallas in 1963. If grace favors me, I’ll be 62 when documents related to the assassination are released to the public, and 84 when the Warren Commission’s investigative files into the tragedy are finally opened.
That’s a long time to wait for a chance to evaluate the purported truth.
It’s a blot on the presumed sophistication of the people of the United States that any aspect of an event so dramatic and shocking should be kept from us. Perhaps it’s true, to abuse the line from A Few Good Men yet again, that we can’t handle the truth. But there cannot be genuine resolution as long as such critical information remains concealed.
Transformed by 9/11
Since Kennedy’s assassination, Americans have lurched between demanding to know and plugging their ears: The Pentagon Papers, My Lai, the King assassination, Watergate, Iran-contra, the savings-and-loan debacle, Monicagate. Lately, however, it would seem the public’s verdict is in: Don’t tell us. Keep us in the dark. We don’t want to know.
This is the worst possible time for probe-ophobia to grip us. Our nation was irretrievably transformed by 9/11—and yet there remain troubling questions about what really happened before, during and after that day. Rather than demanding a full and fearless vetting to hone in on the truth and silence the conjecture about 9/11, many Americans remain unwilling to peer into the microscope.
An online cottage industry of theorists, theory debunkers and debunker debunkers has flourished since 9/11. Sometimes the flimsy theories are easy to spot—come on, if the four passenger jets didn’t crash where it appears they did, where did they go? More often, though, the cases aren’t so obvious.
A group of experts and academicians ‘devoted to applying the principles of scientific reasoning to the available evidence, `letting the chips fall where they may,’ ‘’ last week accused the government of covering up evidence that the three destroyed New York City buildings were brought down that day by controlled demolition rather than structural failure. The group, called Scholars for 9/11 Truth, has a website, www.st911.org.
Unanswered questions
The reflexive first reaction is incredulity—how, one asks, could anyone even contemplate, never mind actually do such a barbaric thing? But before you shut your mind, check the resum
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:18 AM
Pete’s quick w/ the blockquotes, and they’re relevant, too. Kudos to Pete.
ITT’s webmaster is apparently on vacation.
Posted by Natalie on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:19 AM
You’re prevaricating Rabbit is not stalling and you have never done anything different.
Nat your projecting is quaint, but as arrows against others are useless, for we feel not the prick of arrows destined for their owners head alone.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:25 AM
Nat?! Do you have a cold? It seems like your voice has changed. Hmmmm.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:30 AM
“Some video of any of them at the airports would be nice.”
Oh, so now you’re asking for video? When I do it it’s a sin, when you do it…..oh yeah…...the exemption.
Maybe my memory’s faulty, but I thought I remembered lots and lots of video of the hijackers at the airport. Perhaps I imagined all that.
CNN’s in on it!
“An online cottage industry of theorists, theory debunkers and debunker debunkers has flourished since 9/11. Sometimes the flimsy theories are easy to spot
Posted by Natalie on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:33 AM
Don’t bother as if you would, Bat. This should answer it for you.
<a href=“http://www.prisonplanet.com/fbi_denies_mix_up_of_911_terrorists.htm”>FBI Director Mueller acknowledged in 2002 there was no
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:45 AM
No cold wiley, feeling fine, thanks…...........no, not really.
I just learned that my own mother in law believes that Japan is controlling the weather by way of some kind of device they use. Via Art Bell et all, it seems.
I think I might be in the last stages of denial. Struggling to cling to by belief that stuff usually just happens, and not that there’s always some dark nefarious group of former CEO’s and neocons maniplating the world to their advantage.
It’s getting harder and harder. My own Mother in law!
Posted by Natalie on Feb 3, 2006 at 12:53 AM
they’re relevant, too
Oh, I’m all beside myself with delight over its approval
Truthfully, I’m not sure I’d trust it to judge the color of a coat of paint.
Kudos to
Pete.
Ewwwwww…GET em off, somebody!!
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 3, 2006 at 1:26 AM
Natalie you have always been asked for things to prove your mad assertions but have never given anything.
We on the other hand have provided enough to sink a Navy of doubters for everything relevant.
You have been told from the start that a video of living alleged hijackers is a spurious demand of yours and whether or not such is on the internet, is of no interest, for there is enough proof for most people. That includes the hundred or more scholars directly involved in the last few articles’ postings. It also includes various high ranking FBI people. Which you are conveniently ignoring whilst shrieking weirdly for something nobody ever promised and nobody cares less about really, least of all you. Should anybody else ever get around to feeding you this morsel, you will discard it like everything else which shows the lie.
Well just because you ignore it doesn’t make it go away.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 1:30 AM
Natalie, your falseness about the Pentagon Missile and the Pods, which are not of interest to me and you are a lying piece of crap for suggesting otherwise, is misplaced.
It is an opinion piece, and doens’t prove or disprove anything, it shows that a large group of very qualified scholars and eminent in their own right, believe the WTC’s were brought down with demolition charges, for this is something which can be established scientifically at this stage and has been so. That you ignorant twit, is the whole Crux of the article.
Your selective quote was expected and Rabbit left that bit in especially to see you pull it, knowing you would never have known otherwise if he’d left it out, for you don’t read any source contrary to your lies.
It means nothing merely saying that the theories of such things lack the same absolute provability of the demolition theories.
Let us look at a more relevant quote than your attempted strawman red herring.
’‘I am a professional philosopher who has spent 35 years teaching logic, critical thinking and scientific reasoning,’’ group co-founder and University of Minnesota professor James H. Fetzer told me. ``When I come to 9/11, it’s not hard for me to determine what is going on. This is a scientific question. And it is so elementary that I don’t think you can find a single physicist who could disagree with the idea that this was a controlled demolition.’‘
Since you’re such a dumb twat Rabbit includes the rest of that article, not that these people are saying all this.
<blockquote>The group asks, for example,
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 1:40 AM
Oops meant <u>NOTE</u> that these people are saying this. This being what follows.
Wackata wackata wack. Wacking the evil old bat. Ugly of soul and puny of mind, Bat needs a reminder to open it’s mind. Dumber than dirt or lying with skill. Is the Bat for real or is it a SHILL.?
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 2:17 AM
Pistol Pete
Condolences on the Nat’s approval. You must have said something really fucked up to earn that.
Just imagine being stuck for months alone on a thread with this creature…..If you can…..........
respect the rabbit, for he has done this.
It was very bad. The stink, the blood, the screaming and gnashing of teeth. All it does is lie and hide, hide and lie, all as if the world is an apple pie.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 2:24 AM
Oh, Rabbit, that thought is too awful to contain. I will wack the side of my head to dislodge it—-
UUURGG—-
one more time—-
Smack!
O.K. Don’t want to have nightmares. Come to think of it, a couple of days ago I was coming out of sleep and having a speaking dream. No images. Just words. And I was going around and around——stuck in a game of “he said, I said”, “I said, he said, I said”, “he said, I said, he said…” On and on like that. It was horrible. It was like being on a thread with Nat.
Cringe.
You’re particularly lyrical lately, Rabbit. Having fun?
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 3, 2006 at 2:40 AM
Rabbit always hops for fun, dear Wiley.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 2:53 AM
“We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth… Is this the part of wise men, engaged in a great and arduous struggle for liberty? Are we disposed to be of the number of those, who having eyes, see not, and having ears, hear not..?
For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it might cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know.. it— now.”
- Patrick Henry, 1775.
“Neither let us be slandered from our duty by false accusations against us, nor frightened from it by menaces of destruction to the Government nor of dungeons to ourselves. Let us have faith that right makes might, and in that faith, let us, to the end, dare to do our duty as we understand it.”
- Abraham Lincoln, February 27th, 1860
I’m with Pat and Abe, Natalie. Who are you with?
Posted by luminous beauty on Feb 3, 2006 at 10:28 AM
<b><i>there
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 3, 2006 at 3:15 PM
Though I never believed the official story for one minute, I decided to conduct a test. I tried to believe the official story. 19 hijackers? Right! Koran at the titty bar? Check! Flight manual in the trunk? You better believe it! Invisible planes? Sure! Why not? Black boxes didn
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 3, 2006 at 5:03 PM
Wiley.
Witch..
Snap out of it. You are rational, you can recognise the difference between night and day, black and white. You know that gravity is an old but reliable constant.
Wiley? Are you OK yet?
AND it is Aum. The sound of creation. The natural source of the perfect timbre and vibration of the eternal Aum, is the Didegridoo. Quite possibly the oldest musical instrument in the world, discounting the tapping sticks.
Rabbit used to play the Didgeridoo, but has never learned circular breathing yet.
Lumens, you know what their problem is, we all do. Fear. Absolute cold terror of what the consequences of accepting the truth entails.
Let’s face it. At this stage, we mostly know things are too bad to ever be changed by anything less that counterviolence. At least we have had years to accustom ourselves to the gradually worsening state of democracy (sic), the pre-eminence of the mighty dollar and the corrupt and insane conspiracists. The poor dittoheads who cannot bear to face the truth, are in a position of having to make the jump from complete faith in the benevolence of their governments, to complete distrust and enmity with an insane and satanic force. These morons are terriified of the truth for it means they are no longer secure, and for cowards, security is everything. It doesn’t mean real security, just the perception of same. Like kids who hide under the blankets from the Bogey man.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 3, 2006 at 6:40 PM
MOOO. Mooo. Ahem. What?! Where am I?
Is that you Rabbit? Rabbit?
If we can just hang on til things break apart enough for alternatives to be worth it, then I think we can wise up. Maybe. One well trained generation would make great waves too. And—-hey, if we can’t hang on for ten or so years, then we probably can’t hang on, period. I know it may sound strange, but U.S. culture is in gridlock, understood in some quarters as a clusterf*ck.
School is a racket.
War is a racket.
Farming is a racket.
Real estate is a racket.
Taxes are more tribute and bomb money than anything else.
The media exists to sell us things we don’t need and lie to us in the guise of giving us “news”.
ETC. The “job” isn’t just a carrot, it’s survival. It’s really perverse when a person or family’s survival rests on an adult’s ability to stay gainfully employed at a doggy spa, but this happens. We Americans are so removed from fundamental survival issues that “working for food” is the lowest of the low. A little hunger instructs.
Americans are scared Rabbit. Our society makes us and keeps us terribly dependent and insecure. It’s not just a state of mind, it’s reality and it’s the result of media and 12 years of compulsory miseducation. Street urchins have more sense than the average did-everything by the book (they can’t read) American.
It’s not that we’re particularly bad people, but we’ve been trained with every psychological and social trick in the book. We are hypnotized by a massive social engineering machine that uses media that is a few steps ahead of our individual evolution to make us consumers and workers that can be replaced with a machine.
Crony Capitalism can only be maintained through indoctrination.
Many Americans were raised by a television. That’s sad.
I can’t take credit for not being so brainwashed. It wasn’t a choice, per se, it was just that I found it very hard to sit still for that long and I was what people on my mother’s side of the family referred to as “a yard-ape”.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 3, 2006 at 10:23 PM
Yeh.
Rabbit was just an individual, try and make him do what he doesn’t want to do, and see where that gets you!
No friends mostly and most kids picked on the rabbit in the school yard, so he became independant, and self reliant.
And I bloody well like it that way. Looking back on the sheeple who ostracised the odd rabbit, he is left with a feeling mostly of mixed gratitude and pity for the ninnies.
I guess I have to admit, that I’ve never met anyone as wacked in the head. Totally in denial as the “afflicted” of your countrymen. But there are yet many Aussies who are extremely screwed in the head, we have plenty of dittoheads and sheeple.
We are members of the empire with nothing but a slightly more correct form of English and a less outrageous accent than the Grand Poobars of cultural excellence themselves.
Thanks to John Wayne the Brady Bunch and Coca-Cola.
Oh and Barbara Eden.
Rabbit and Wiley would have found something to do in the yard, while the house monkeys watched the swill.
Rabbit was an excellent Doctor at one time and can thank a couple of imaginative and clever Nurses for his early successes in medicine. These successes have given meaning to at least the first half of his existence.
They still recall a wistfull smile or two from time to time.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 3:19 AM
Sorry for being a bit fresh dear Witch.
It was the thought of Barbara Eden in her Bikini and fluffy things, I think.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 3:21 AM
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,For the Bat….............................................................................
Here it is. Rabbit has been keeping an alert eye open for this story for a half year now.
Promised the Nasty Natty Batty that her hide would feel the heat, of the story which is told showing generals on the beat. Speaking truths which trash the lies and show that Monsters rule the skies. Natty is a lying Shill and her posts sprout only lies.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 3:43 AM
Come on Natty.
Lob into this thread and ask about videos of alleged hijackers as if the whole bullshit circus hangs on that one tenuous thread.
You are a shit for brains shill and you have done your dash for good around here. Don’t hesitate to come on and roll in your own shit though, it’s what we expect of a canine creature of your gender.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 3:54 AM
More truth which cans your whole world of artificial reality….. Shill.
Wade through the amount of bone jarring truth about the state of Journalism.
Oh and don’t forget stupid Bat. If you crap on the source in an ad-hominem fashion, or falsely, Rabbit will just cut and paste the info to show what a lying sow you are.
Best just to ignore it then eh?
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 4:06 AM
Oh my, Rabbit. Your concerns over depleted uranium may be unfounded, at least according to Col. Donde Grande. And he hasn’t been wrong on a single thing yet!
AJ: How did the military ever get convinced to use depleted uranium in areas where there is going to be troops?
DGP: To put what Alex?
AJ: Well, yeah, the military gets treated like dog meat. You’ve got the depleted uranium, Colonel, where they spray the depleted uranium everywhere where the troops breathe it at 1900 times safe levels. How can the Pentagon put up with that?
DGP: Well, the DU rounds are over-played, first of all. They aren’t that potent and secondarily, we must consider that weapons of mass destruction have already been used by some of the opposition in the period February of 1991. Weapons of mass destruction, including low-yield nuclear weapons.
AJ: Okay, can you break that down for us?
DGP: Well, I break it down in the time frame that we had satellite images of rounds or missiles being fired from the Negev desert toward Baghdad. That’s 600 miles distance. And six or eight of the rounds came in. That was February of 1991.
AJ: Are you saying that the Israelis used miniaturized nuclear weapons?
DGP: Yes sir. That’s what I’m saying, in plain English.
AJ: Well I remember, I know they bragged that they had a lot of really sophisticated miniaturized nuclear weapons, of the little mini-frogs, or whatever. But and I know there were these giant mushroom clouds on the news. They’d say, “Oh, that’s not a nuke. That’s just a weapons depot.” But you are saying that it is common knowledge at the Pentagon that Israel was firing nuclear weapons at Iraq?
DGP: That is correct.
AJ: Oh, so that’s where all this high-level radiation is emanating from?
DGP: That is correct. And I have verification of that. I think it’s in book 2. And I think it will stand up in most scrutiny.
He’s got verification, Rabbit. It’s in book 2. You can order it for 30 dollars plus postage and handling. It will stand up in most scrutiny.
No luck on finding that footage, eh Rabbit? I know you’ve been searching desperately because you’d dearly love to stick it to me on this, even though you act like you don’t care.
Perhaps you’re gonna have to first convince the Arab world that the hijackers were mis-identified or were never there. (according to Donde Grande’s remote control theory)
Pride
“What petrifies the disbelievers is that the 19 Martyrs knew for so long that on September 11, 2001 they would, by the Permission of Allah, meet death. It terrifies them to their very core. They find it incomprehensible that men could live for so long with an objective to meet death and not snap under the pressure. Islamic History is rich with the oaths of the Mujahideen to fight to the death, yet most of these have been made just moments before the battle. Each of the 19 Martyrs made a vow to meet death on September 11 2001; they did this not a few minutes before the attack, not a day before, not even a week before, but a considerable time before the attack. This makes the oath of the 19 Martyrs, a glorious oath amongst the most noble oaths.”......
........”Let it be known in the Heavens and Earth that on Tuesday September 11, 2001, these 19 Lions of Islam: Roared.
“Verily, Allah has purchased of the believers their lives and their properties for (the price) that theirs shall be the Paradise. They fight in Allah’s Cause, so they kill (others) and are killed. It is a promise in truth which is binding on Him in the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel) and the Qur’an. And who is truer to his Covenant then Allah? Then rejoice in the bargain which you have concluded. That is the supreme success.” [Quran 9:111]
It’s in the Koran!
Lions, Rabbits, Witches and Frogs. Starting to sound like another installment in the Chronicles of Narnia.
(and bats!)
Posted by Natalie on Feb 4, 2006 at 4:02 PM
Who the hell is Col. Donde Grande and can you give the link to this source, please?
Posted by Pistol Pete on Feb 4, 2006 at 5:09 PM
He’s a friend of Rabbit’s. See the link above… “Here it is”
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 5:43 AM
Posted by Natalie on Feb 4, 2006 at 5:37 PM
Why does the posting of a link to a story make the guy a friend? Desperate Shill.
Any way not today Josephine, Rabbit is going sailing.
.................................^^.....................................
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 8:25 PM
.....................................if you haven’t yet woken up the fact that the world is wackier than Narnia and Wonderland combined, there ain’t no hope for you Bat.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 8:26 PM
Well, since you’re defending DU, Nat, you’re probably not worried about silly things like souls.
How time flies. It’s been a year with this computer and I just now opened a nuclear folder. Cluck. Cluck.
When one considers that the VA didn’t officially recognize health problems caused by Agent Orange until 1989, it isn’t surprizing to see that a General is downplaying DU now. In fact, that’s tantamount to saying that it is a military issue and responsibility. If they could only learn to drag their feet, stall, and stone-wall going to war as well as they hold out on acknowledging the devastation done to our soldiers’ health and the health of foreign peoples we make ill and kill with our biological, chemical, and radioactive weaponry—-well, we’d have money all over the place and less illness and longer lives! We wouldn’t have victims strewn all over the globe. Perhaps we could think about not poisoning nations as a way of going that extra mile to keep generations of people from hating out guts. It’s not our freedoms that they hate, Nat—-it’s our guts. They hate our guts.
Tell you what, Nat. Make this a challenge for us. Instead of one or more of us going around looking up information for you to ignore, why don’t you ask questions about DU? Throw some out for all of us. Try to make us believe that you are open to persuasion and not just playing silly little soul-less games. Consider it a challenge.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 4, 2006 at 9:09 PM
Yo, Rabbit. What I miss is the liveliness of nature. When I was a child, there was a huge kingdom of insects, caterpillars, butterflies, moths, beetles, bottleflies, fireflies, dragonflies, pill bugs, lady bugs, and more; and then there were different kinds of little bitty tree toads, assortments of larger frogs, horned toads, garden snakes, bullfrogs…I mean the place was alive! And at night there were way more stars than you could ever count. There were trees, wild and cultivated. Flowers in the gardens and in the fields. Pecans and peaches. Johnson grass and honeysuckle.
The world was much more alive then, and it wasn’t just because I was a child. This spring, I’ll be thrilled to find earthworms, and ladybugs. Hope to see honey bees this year. Maybe I should order some insects. I have a catalog of insect eggs. Been thinking about getting a big pot of pampus grass for butterflies.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 5, 2006 at 2:10 AM
I’m just selfishly yacking at you guys.
Looked at permaculture by the way, Rabbit. I’ve read about it before. If I had property I’d do it, but still, I’d want a greenhouse, and indoor plants, and a pond, and container gardens, and an acre of lavendar, and some xeroscaping, and a luscious bit of rye grass. And a degree in horticulture and all relevant licences and certifications—- I could live the rest of my life on six acres of land and be happy as a clam.
A girl can dream, can’t she? Unless the climate changes radically in this zone, organic gardening is a cinch.
It’s been raining sideways for two months now. The winds are wicked good to listen to when warm and dry in the house. I am so looking forward to spring.
No matter if the human race lasts another millenium, or if it ends this October, when it’s time to plant, it’s time to plant.
If we get through this year without nuclear war or economic devastation, I’ll be most thankful.
Really, though Rabbit, you can’t resist that tree climbing yard-ape,yes master combination. Am I right?
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 5, 2006 at 2:35 AM
Mrs Rabbit and many other sensible and alert people here, watch 24. Always with the mental caveat that they are watching Americans doing things the way Americans do things—in the movies. ..... The idea that things really are as insanely violent and destuctive with car chases, shootings and people hanging off helicopters all over the place, usually comes as a shock for them all the same when visiting the USA for real. (Actually I have no idea if this is normal but am giving you the benefit of the doubt. Also have heard from some who have visited the US and it was the impression.
However if any attempt was made by a political faction to score off a fictitious telemovie like this ...........like I said, laughed off the stage.
Then again; those Big Brother and lame Australian Idol takeoffs (together with the phone companies) are making truckloads of money.
People actually seem to take that crap seriously, so who can say until they try it. I guess it is something to watch for.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 5, 2006 at 6:52 PM
Rabbit can see that the nasty Bat, is trying to make something out of the suggestion that the Israelis used some Nukes on Iraq.
Funny that it is the sort of thing she would normally fight tooth and claw to deny, but if it can in any way be used to vindicate her beloved BABY..Depleted Urnanium…then she’ll use it.
Too bad for you, that the reasoning you employ is considered to be false logic by “normal” people.
The fact that some Radiation in Iraq may be due to Israeli Nukes, does not eliminate the remainder of which is due to the use of Depleted Uranium by the US. The amounts and it’s lethality have been covered else where.
More importantly though is the standard DU Shill trick of trying to stick to the Radiation as being the main danger of Depleted Uranium. This is not, and has never been claimed to be the case.
The main danger from Depleted Uranium projectiles and bombs, comes not from the primary radiation of the Uranium. It is at least depleted to the extent that the U235 has been removed more or less. The U237 is however the main type found and it is not depleted. However, it is not the main concern. It is not what is making the veterans sick and their spouses and their children. It is not what is responsible for the massive numbers of birth deformities and genetic damage resulting in dreadful illness and deaths among the Iraqi, which will accelerate now over the next decade until the result will without any doubt, be virtual genocide, complete destruction of the Iraqi people.
This is, and Natalie the great SHILL knows it; caused by Ceramic Uranium Oxide Vapours and dust. It is what becomes of the Depleted Uranium when it is in a bomb. At least 60% of it becomes this deadly chemical poison when it is used as projectiles, bullets for example. It is airborne and soluble in water, for example the lungs. You need but a very tiny amount in your system before it begins to alter the body’s DNA structure, causing first and foremost damage to the gametes, the sex cells. Your children will be born grossly deformed, if they are born at all.
50% of returning soldiers children are being born with the expected deformities.
You have NO IDEA how horrible this is going to be,. The shocker to me is that I am sure, you are going to set in motion even more horrific evil before the one in Iraq has come fully of age.
Before even the true monstrosity which is now Iraq’s future, for at least the next couple of billion years, is unfolded, the next and probably worse act will be well underway.
I don’t know what to say. The truth is here, the results of more and more medical tests and surveys are confirming everything which was predicted. The simple and unvarnished truth is that the Pentagon has ALWAYS known that using Uranium as a Dirty Bomb, was a viable option for mass killings. It was known in 1945 to be the perfect genocidal weapon with the exception of a full Nuclear Explosion, and better in some ways. Much cheaper and easier to deploy, more of the actual Uranium becomes deadly particulates and gas.
AND it has economic and environmental advantages. Disposing cheaply of all that dirty leftover Uranium waste fromn the US Nuclear Power industry.
Not that this post was intended to go off topic, but since the Natty loves DU so much, it is always a good thing to shove some up her nose when she gets horny for it. Any mention of DU in any forum anywhere gets the Vampire panting by the way.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 5, 2006 at 7:19 PM
Next step, prisoners working on mid-eastern oil wells and pipelines until their life sentence prematurely ends?
Like these articles, say, there are many man made radioactive isotopes—-including Plutonium—-present in “depleted uranium”. The word “depleted” only refers to the fact that the substance is no longer useful for producing nuclear energy. The fact remains that depleted uranium is both a radiological hazard, and a heavy metal that can be stored in our bones where it displaces useful metals and does damage to stem cells.
<i>Could it be that depleted uranium munitions are the latest in the line of the Pentagon’s
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 5, 2006 at 8:43 PM
When I say “our” in the above post, I’m referring specifically to humans though it’s probably true for most life forms. No prions, though—- radiation doesn’t kill them.
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 5, 2006 at 8:45 PM
Back to that shortly, but here is an excellent analysis of the WTC’s collapse by a Finnish Military Expert. This the best most picture perfect analysis I’ve seen. These are the best stills showing where the PROOF is, right in front of the eyes, that these buildings were demolished with explosives.
The whole site is good, and nothing I’ve seen before.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 6, 2006 at 12:40 AM
Natty will probably crawl back under her rock for a while again now.
Realising that her DU Starchild is suffering by exposure here now, and due to several recent postings about 911 which are individually more enlightening than all her sources combined. She will wisely keep a low profile, until either the thread moves on, or it stays quiet for long enough she hopes we’re all gone.
Seen it all before.
Of course Rabbit writes this so she will deliberately pop in sooner to show the rabbit is wrong about something.
This we shall call the Vampire two step.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 6, 2006 at 1:05 AM
I have to confess, Rabbit the whole DU issue makes me morbidly sad. Soon, I hope to get active in an orderly way—-on the web. Perhaps there’s a shilling for free for disarmament course on the web somewhere, and I can start posting on nuclear issues on a lot of sites after getting up to date and organized. Or perhaps I’ll do it on my own. I think the web is a seriously good place to talk about these issues. One really good nuke post a day? On several sites? Is that anti-nuke spam?
I’ll be more resilient and positive when I’m gardening.
You seem to get people’s number, Rabbit why do so many people think and/or say that it is a waste of time to discuss important issues on the web? Have they never learned anything on the web?
My experience is that talking about nuclear issues does <not> lessen the pain, but the principle doesn’t change, and librium is available. I’ll contemplate this for two weeks before making a decision.
DU is horrifying. I want to jump out of my skin, sometimes, I am beside myself with grief and I feel guilty. I call my condition BPM, or Being Properly Mortified.
Will surf for guidance this week. Anything comes up, in that vein, will you let me know Rabbit, Lumens, frog…?
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 6, 2006 at 2:37 AM
Uuum…............“Don’t Worry Be Happy”?
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 6, 2006 at 3:05 AM
Making sure that Shills don’t get a free ride, blurting their rubbish without proper challenges and the Actual Truth is stated, illustrated and compounded over and over at least as often as they tell their lies.
This is our small corner of the world.
Take what we learn and tell others. Pray in your heart for “Help” from a higher power. God is OK as a starter, but it’s best to leave a caveat that you’ll accept any benevolent help that is offering in his stead.
Rabbit has it on good authority that if enough sentience is concentrated on this one prayer, help isn’t too far away.
Unfortunately it needs to be something like half the sentience available on the planet at the moment.
Some wicked jokes are already occurring to Rabbit based on this premise.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 6, 2006 at 3:12 AM
A quick replay of some Nat in Action.
“”“Frog said:
“Give us a link to that Loizeaux Interview. IF you are consistent you must
allow us to judge on the owner of the paper in question.”
NATTY FROM WONDERLAND’S NON- ANSWER ===
What possible relevance could there be in the source of my quotes? Why
should it even matter from where they emanate? (feb3,1227h)”“”
GRIFFIN FOOTNOTE 20; ” Incredibly, after explaining how precisely explosives must be set to ensure that a building comes straight down, Loizeaux said that upon seeing the fires in the Twin Towers, he knew that the towers were
Posted by frog on Feb 6, 2006 at 10:11 AM
Wiley,
I was going to recommend Helen Caldicott for furver reading on DU when i re-read and saw your first quote was from her !! I have her first book , 1979 , and she hasn’t stopped since.
“Nil illegitimis carborundum”—dog latin for ” Don’t let the bastards grind you down” ! Of course this stuff will, momentarily, but only that. Ditzy-nervous-sad- morbidity happens to most of us from time to time.
A small google led me to stuff on various Nato ministries of defence getting uptight on “their” groundtroops being affected by DU after that set-up invasion of Kosovo. Will have a re-look and save some before it goes down the memory-hole. Felicity Arbuthnot only appears in the marginal sites, I think, but her reporting has the ring of truth.
Rabbit
the 24SERIES plus political ads starting to look really like TIA / Full Spectrum Dominance. I do hope 95% of Oz Will fall off couches when it happens, but ... .we’ll see.
Donn de Grand Pre a mystery horse. Checking ! (‘Donde Grande—Natty—get the name right ! )
Help from a Higher Power. As one of Oliver Cromwell’s generals is supposed to have said ; ” PRAY TO GOD, AND KEEP YOUR FUCKING GUNPOWDER DRY, YOU ‘ORRIBLE EXCUSES FOR SOLDIERS, YOU ! “.
For me that means saving stuff I saw online, then saving again to cd’s . And then putting on my old clunker that is not ‘connected’.
Must go ! Got some trolltrawling and shillslapping on the highlytopsecret agenda.
Posted by frog on Feb 6, 2006 at 4:32 PM
The Witch said:
“Tell you what, Nat. Make this a challenge for us. Instead of one or more of us going around looking up information for you to ignore, why don
Posted by Natalie on Feb 6, 2006 at 8:19 PM
NAT the recidivist non - answerer. Asked you a simple polite question twice. Your non-answer to me seems to be that since all sources of information are unreliable, none should be sourced unless YOU, in your wisdom should choose so to demand.
I’d love to know which demo experts thought that the WTC collapses didn’t resemble demolitions. Hadn’t come across that angle before, anywhere. Looked pretty neat from here.
Reckon you may be right on the “removal” angle. If griffin is wrong on that, it is a very small part of what he wrote.
Your last para . Did CDI not clear up after Murrah ?
Posted by frog on Feb 6, 2006 at 8:52 PM
My favourite of the “Muhammed cartoons” is
STOP, STOP, We"ve run out of virgins.
Posted by frog on Feb 6, 2006 at 9:42 PM
Mine too. The most offensive to be reprinted were not from the Jyllands Posten. Jones has a good analysis of it.
Helping the Neo-con agenda
Did some one hear the Bat flap by? Rabbit thought he heard a high pitched squeaking and a smell of blood…..................the rabbit looks…..................^^............................. but sees no Bat.
The rabbit sees no bats…..................none at all.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 7, 2006 at 12:58 AM
I heard the bat flap. She appears to want to play my game and she is asking questions. I’m tired, need to wash my hair, brush my teeth, set my alarm. That’s all so compelling. Nat will have to wait until tomorrow night or Wednesday. I’ll get prepared and stock up on the Cheez Whiz.
Thanks for making me laugh Rabbit and frog and Nat—-in your own batty little funny way…
Posted by wileywitch on Feb 7, 2006 at 1:22 AM
The Frog is really very nice and interesting isn’t he Wiley?
Rabbit always had a soft spot for frogs. Married one once.
Pity the French and the occassional other barbarians eat frogs. Mrs Rabbit once ate some frogs just to shock Rabbit. He has never completely forgiven her and she knows it.
Bats are amusing. A few times they came inside our house when we were on the farm One came into the house and lived a few days, flapping about at nights and curled up, upside down in a corner under a beam all day.
Finally the cat caught it and ate it.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 7, 2006 at 5:26 AM
frog was a misnomer nom de guerre to catch hardass froghating yanks of the nuke-em-all variety ; failed here !
Globalised deepfrozen froglegs from China now in supermarkets here, but I only tried them a bit 25yrs ago, not a staple.
rabbit I’m reading John taylor Gatto with delight !! (wiley knows already)
I remember my shudders before sending my kids to skool, knowing that their creativity was going to be stunted by that prisonfarmfactory ; My then frogwife thought I was a bit nuts. Luckily palliative actions at home, such as no TV and books and bikes and trees and talk helped them to get by . Will remind the one who is now a teecher how she was bored to scream at 12, suggested some survival philosophies .
A goodfriend skoolinspector has arrived/ is arriving ?, at similar conclusions to JTG, .so not bored here out in the sticks.
I often have flittery bats at twilight, jinking all over the place, divebombing, just like our dear Natty. There may be some in a hole just above my bed, do bats actually squeak or is it all hypersonic ?
JTG makes a healthy change, but/and is highly complementary to what we strive to discuss here. I used to teach a bit, but the powerstructure bored me. Like 911, get them to learn things for themselves ?
If people don’t spend the time, fair game to say “Sorry, my dear, but if you ain’t looked, and thunk, how do you Know ‘xyz’ ? “
Posted by frog on Feb 7, 2006 at 7:05 AM
“NAT the recidivist non - answerer. Asked you a simple polite question twice. Your non-answer to me seems to be that since all sources of information are unreliable, none should be sourced unless YOU, in your wisdom should choose so to demand.”
I don’t why you would think that I think that all sources of information are unreliable. However, I have given specific reasons why certain sources that I’ve criticized are worthy of such. I’ve pointed out instances of the deliberate manufacturing of an opinion by way of selective quoting.
Sorry, Frog. I didn’t mean to be impolite in not giving you my source, but I couldn’t help but use the simple fact that you were curious in order to illustrate that indeed the quality of sources might matter. I don’t necessarily think that you don’t understand this, but Rabbit and many others in the “truth” movement don’t seem to. I think it matters that Prof. Jones cites “American Free Press” for a few selective sentences uttered by Loizeaux that serves to imply something about his thinking that is not true. “American Free Press” has an agenda that necessitates the re-write/ignoring of history and the kinds of cherry-picking that served Jones’ purposes.
My source for the quotes was an interview in “New Scientist Magazine.”
“Baltimore blasters”
24 July 2004
Liz Else
Magazine issue 2457
You can pay the small fee in order to access the entire interview, but my previously posted excerpt accurately illustrated his mindset about the collapses. “New Scientist” appears to be a fairly benign collection of science news and views, but you’re free to investigate it. The important thing in my mind is that this is a complete interview. Of course the only way to confirm that for sure would be to ask Loizeaux.
Preview
“I
Posted by Natalie on Feb 7, 2006 at 2:11 PM
Once again, Nat, your accusations of cherry-picking do not stand up to close examination. Where does Jones quote of Loizeaux’s statement on how he would go about taking down the towers imply that Loizeaux’s opinion is that they were taken down in such a way? The inference is entirely of your own imagining, and totally unwarranted. The same flawed reasoning you have used repeatedly in reference to Fireman Bill. You really need a class in basic logical reasoning, Nat.
Posted by luminous beauty on Feb 7, 2006 at 2:56 PM
Well to be accurate, most bats Rabbit has seen don’t make any “human” audible sound, except scratching around in the tree bark if that counts.
We do have Flying Foxes, and Fruit Bats, which are quite large and they sometimes make a small squeaky noise. But mostly even when thousands of them fly overhead of an evening as they do on their daily migration out from the caves and gullies where they hang out during the day, they are eerily silent.
The same cannot be said of Vampire Bats, the Possessed kind, which having once been human can still communicate using the language. The undead nature of such creatures means that they can be quite ancient and thus their language and comprehension skills oftentend to be stilted.
As it happens the Rabbit deliberately salted his post with the claim of half the returning vet’s babies being born with deformities. The figure is high but actually I couldn’t recall the exact detail and didn’t want to spoil a good rant, with the added spice of being able to select the ground for a Bat wacking.
Also the simplified description of the actual radioactive portion of the DU horror. Wiley, who knows what she is talking about, just as many you have argued with since your apparent first contact with the subject four months ago, posted some interesting details Rabbit had not come across before.
Especially the NASTY business of some of the DU obviously being SPENT FUEL from Nuclear Power Generation.
The Neptunium 235 explains to the informed, the rapidity of onset of many of the cancers and other debilitations which are the result of exposure to the DU killing fields.
A half life of 404 days. WHOA…...that is to be compared with billions of years for the more comon U237. The difference is how fast it emits that radiation. For the Satans seed, Neptunium 235 it would be like class 1 laser light in the eyeball compared to watching a single candle flame from a meter away in darkness, which is all U237 would be.
Rabbit shall be back presently with a nice little Gift for the Bat., regarding the actual figures of baby deformities and maybe a slide show of some of those deformities, which she has earned before. She is excited about the figure Rabbit suggested and she may not be dissapointed yet, we shall see. But you can feel good at least that such a figure is certainly destined to be the norm for people in Iraq within a year or so, if it isn’t already.
It’s the actual amount, the precise figure of death and destruction Natty is always so interested in, rather than any direct discussion of morality versus reality. It is in the actual figures, the depictions of carnage that she is able to engage her mind and she will haggle endlessly about a hundred dead babies here or there, as if deliberately causing the deaths of a few thousand more or less babies and innocents is the difference between moral rectitude and base evil.
She can relate to the blood and death, it is what she seeks, but discussions of morality can only be had in a vacuum.
Natalie first came to us, on a thread which was based upon one story of one US marine who had returnmed home from Iraq only to father a child who was born with the classic DU deformities. Just to get that into perspective. She denied that was true then, when she first “met” the subject of DU apparently.
She did this by attacking the author of the article, the scientists involved and the credibility of the marine. The medical evidence was called into question as being fabricated….on and on. She did this as well as denied thousands more references on similar grounds and means for months.
Nat is a Bat that glows in the dark.
Stick her on a shiny pole and plant her in the park.
All the drunks and junkies can use the light to see.
and on the pole around her feet, the bums can have a pee.
The best is while they’re standing there basking in her gaze.
These dregs and begs can get a dose of deadly gamma rays.
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 7, 2006 at 7:15 PM
SAVE 53% OFFTHE NEWSSTAND PRICE!
Reader Comments
bold?...BOLD!
20 reasons to question the official story of 9/11
Experts Claim Official 9/11 Story is a Hoax
David , it just happened. Nuffing to do with me, gov.
Bonjour, luminous one!
Techno encyclopaedic rabbit, we sure made lotsa bro on them thar USD’s. So far markets have been liquid enough to swap in and out of the things, but the day may come…. ,
We recently saw the Chinese and Canadians diversifying some of their reserves out of the Almighty One. I believe the canucks sold gold for Euros ?
Arras is foreign parts to me, I"m near cherbourg. All my farming neighbours of that age were in Algeria. I’m told one will never talk about it, he was in the paras. Metric system sounds like that Napoleon man.
I’m still technically a brit, 30years out, but my grandchildren are frogs. My brit brother-in -law and I even talk together in frog without noticing, so am integrated I spose. Having lived half me life in each country I larf at the stereotypes brits and frogs have of each other, and stick up for whichever is being slandered by the other.
Anyone for Freedom Fries ? Wasn’t that guy one of the Abramoff Gang ?
david
the poll at the end of the first link rather silly, i didn’t learn anything new, but don’t pretend to know everything .
Still, a Good Site for beginners to start from !!
http://marcosolo.journalspace.com/
tried to cutandpaste jebbush quote from this, and failed.
Its right at the bottom of page.
techno-imbeciles like me abstain , please ?
http://select.nytimes.com/search/restricted/article?res=F00C1FFE355F0C728EDDA00894D9404482
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA11.victims.html
http://www.eionews.addr.com/psyops/news/passenger_list_puzzle.htm
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA77.victims.html
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/ua175.victims.html
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/ua93.victims.html
Wonder if this is going to be translated into screams?
A few more links about the hijackers. I signed up for a trial of some “select” hooey at New York Times, so that I could get articles from the “paper of record”. What a lousy record we have.
The eio link is an interesting one for people who like puzzles. The CNN links are on the eio site. CNN links are passenger lists for the hijacked aircraft.
Am on pens and needles over our impending nuclear strike. Can’t sleep well. Ordered sedatives. Good God! They’re out of their minds!
Yep. Screaming like a Banshee.
Mwa ha ha…...............................^^..................................
The rabbit has struck. Rabbit magic…
Yes it is an electron revolution.
And the rabbit is their leader.
Beware Nat the Bat, the forces of good are comming out
Despite your Spite and your slavening bite
The right from the left is here for the fight
Electrons do Rabbit’s bidding. Turn Natty’s spite inward so it eats her wizened heart. The queen of DU DEATH, and excuses for death dealers.
Witch do you like the rabbit’s spells?
care of frog,
“The truth is useless. You have to understand this right now. You can’t deposit the truth in a bank. You can’t buy groceries with the truth. You can’t pay rent with the truth. The truth is a useless commodity that will hang around your neck like an albatross all the way to the homeless shelter. And if you think that the million or so people in this country that are really interested in the truth about their government can support people who would tell them the truth, you got another thing coming. Because the million or so people in this country that are truly interested in the truth don’t have any money.”- Jeb Bush (Florida governor, brother of George W. Bush)
And ain’t that the truth? What do we have? O
They certainly are glib with their real ideas and intentions. It just makes you hate them that much more. It also makes the Idiot Sheeple even bigger idiots.
Ok now, Rabbit has hopefully got the ear of the revolting electrons. They have spoken, they even can no longer go on supporting such lies as the official story is.
Now dear little electrons who know the truth and the government lies, please go back quietly and Rabbit will continue to represent your case and if you are needed again you will be called. Please go skinny again….........................................^^...............................
Testing
oh oh
They are too angry
The elctrons are revolting, they have taken control. Natty and Minny Mind will be eaten by them, like Nano-viruses when or if we ever see them again.
Be afraid.
BE VERY AFRAID.
Maybe the font is in bold because moles have poor eyesight.
If electrons start revolting——the only thing we can be certain of, is that the market would be flooded with self-help books about how it’s your fault, and the twelve steps to turning your bold electrons into capital.
</b>
bold is getting boring
Hmmm ... maybe we should send word to Seamus?
luminous,
You seem to be O.K. with someone using as a reference, material quoted on a site run by a Holocaust revisionist. It doesn’t seem to raise the slightest bit of doubt in your mind as to the reliability or completeness of the information contained on a site who’s publisher has no problem whitewashing and making up history as it pertains to the Holocaust.
It would seem that Jones has no problem either, or perhaps he is unaware of the true nature and agenda of “American Free Press”. (such a nice, innocent sounding name)
The truth of Loizeaux’s feelings and observations that day are below, and I will add these to my list of quotes you will likely never see on 9/11 “truth” websites. Well, maybe selected bits and pieces here and there.
When you watched 9/11, did you imagine that the towers would come down like that?
“I did a report on the World Trade Center when I was at college and I knew exactly how it was built. I understood the concept. When I saw the first plane hit, my mind first went to: “Oh my god, what’s happened? Is it a plane, a private plane?” But I was watching along with most of the western world when the second plane hit. And everything changed. When I saw what hit, that it was an airliner, that it was loaded with jet fuel, I remembered the long clear span configuration from the central core to the outer skin of the World Trade Center from the report I did. And we had just taken down two 40-storey structures in New York.
I still had some cellphone numbers so when the second plane hit I said: “Start calling all the cellphones, tell them that the building is going to come down.” It was frenetic, nobody could get through even with speed dialling. And I just sat there, just sat there. Of course, building number 7, which is where the emergency management headquarters was, was on fire. I’d been in that office two months before. And I sat there watching, I picked up the phone and I called a couple of people on the National Research Council Committee involved in assessing the impact of explosives. They said: “What do you think this is, that they’re going to fail, they’re both going to fail?” The expression around was they’re going to pancake down, almost vertically. And they did. It was the only way they could fail. It was inevitable. And it was horrific.”
Could they have been built in such a way that they would have withstood the impact?
“Bad question - they did withstand the impact. The correct question is could they have been built to withstand the consequences, the fire?”
Well - could they?
“I’ll defer to the reports coming out, but I will say - is society willing to pay for it? It’s far cheaper to take the battle to terrorists than let them bring it to us.”
I guess it’s easy to see why Jones linked us to AFP. They were a convenient source of just the information Jones wanted us to know about.
It’s obvious that Loizveaux didn’t suspect bombs in the buildings; his gut feeling based on his experience with demolitions and his knowledge of the WTC was that the towers would fall essentially for the same basic reasons that Bazant, Zhou, FEMA, and NIST later confirmed. Obviously everyone had varying degrees of data and information, and there are disagreements on the precise mechanism of collapse. But nowhere, anywhere do any of these professional people qualified to make informed judgments on building collapse find any reason to suspect bombs in the buildings.
Again I ask you, why is it do you suppose that Jones’ eagerly anticipated “peer reviewed” paper has not been accepted by, or perhaps not even submitted to, a legitimate scientific, engineering or even a physics journal? Why is it only being used to advance a “scientific Marxist agenda”?
Does this further example of Jones altering the reality of another’s feelings and beliefs by way of selective quoting make even a tiny dent in your armor of admiration for him?
Does anybody have any real evidence for six or more of the hijackers being still alive?
Define “real”.
http://www.schoolhistory.co.uk/revision/germany.shtml
Do you have a problem with revision, Natalie. It’s a perfectly acceptable pursuit, especially when new documentation is found, or when one or more prior claims are proven to be questionable.
Surely you don’t think it’s sensible to reject an entire news source on the basis of your prejudice?
Perhaps you think the BBC and the Telegraph are part of a conspiracy?
test
test
test
<u>test</u>
Rabbit broke the thread with html voodoo hoodoo from his cut and paste article. Probably changed the “style” or something.
If I knew how to “dold”—-
Oh, I know how it is though, Pistol Pete—- I have HTMLADHD. It’s not what everyone thinks it is, it’s a communist plot.
Rabbit isn’t communist. Though I hear he casts a furry spell.
The looniest of all the 911 Conspiracy Theories!
Look at the link and then everybody take turns posting a piece of it until we get the whole , not too long under the nose of the Shill.
Sorry about the Bold Electrons, Rabbit thought he had control of the herd their for a bit, but this was a brief illusion. Thjey are mad as hell, that is the truth and they are screaming NATALIE we cannot take your Lying Shilling Spinning Spew. They like the rabbit are getting bored with you.
As once before it begins to feel unclean just being on a thread with you.
Unclean Unclean.
Here is the first bit of the Loony Conspiracist.
Next please?
More about these loony tunes and their wacky theories and methods of deluding themselves.
Sound familiar to anyone? Nobody we can recognise around here by any chance?
Can you or can you not see the electrons themselves are communicating, the font is gone weird, you are under attack from the very forces of nature, the universal balance has been exceeded. You are now scheduled for destruction.
Your doom is upon you earthlings. Those who stink in the eyes of your creators. Those with their misbegotten twisted souls and their sinful ways, their lying cheating thieving and murdering, raping, pillaging and supporters for death and death bringers.
IT IS YOU
“</b>”//
************#</#>
Nat the flappy bat, the lover of poison and murder, who stabs and hacks at the truth with claws grown dull from overuse. Your teeth too, are not sharp, your mind is grown dull with the drugs that they put in the koolaid you drink daily.
You are their vampire, they own you, you are doomed for it is you and your kind, the scum who hide behind you who are being “RECALLED”. The big one, recalled into the big galactic waste disposal unit. Your souls, such as is left of them, will be forfeit. Forfeit to the crown so to speak.
Your carcasses even will be gone from this latest sojourn in the world which you only rent. The rent is due, and it comes down to a third.
A third of the souls are theirs for the harvest.
It could not be taken until full maturity, an investment so to speak had been made, on behalf of, not us, but another.
All souls had their chance to follow a path, given enough freedom and the tools to discern, they were individually free to develop, learn and remember. This is remembering not just once, on the earth or other systems but between sojourns taking this accumalated memory, collection of experiences and individual responses, this “Karma” is what you have today. It is by another means a tool a marker or brand, which will allow them to choose those who are to be taken.
One third.
It is no point discussing it, it is in all your holy books, it is a bargain, and it was made before your rise anyway. Whilst in a sense it is mankind who must pay, it is not really so, for it is only for the chosen one third to BE the price. The world will not take ill of their loss.
Look up, you will see them in the heavens. If not today tomorrow. Coming soon to a sky near you. They are currently mapping you all, making selections basically. Samples have been taken, are being taken. The great harvest has not yet begun, but it is probably not scheduled. They are waiting for a sign which will come from among us, and even Rabbit doesn’t know what that is.
get ready for it Natty and Minny Mind, if the electrons have not freaked you out, as they intended, and you are still nibbling at the dges like a frightened mouse. You Natty are a sure bet, Minny mind may yet, depending on certain other features, whcih we know nothing of. The mind and soul is not their only interest.
Lumen
Thankyou for posting the Jeb Bush Quote for me. Would like to find original source, did have it, then not filed . Help ?
Read, And re-read, all of you. Like the WhiteHouse NEOCON who said “WE MAKE REALITY”, the clock is ticking. We are in a race.
Wiley
Note how Natty reposts her original question, without reading “telegraph, BBC”. Even tho telegraph is Hollinger, still lotsa good stuff in it. I found the 500+ Firemen’s Oral Histories for FREE in the NYT on a click above here.
Your eionews link is good. But please don’t post too many links without commentary, timeconsuming. i only opened one out of five…..........Far better to share one, and let the rest of us “examine” it .
Continued from the link of Rabbit, above.
Asking any of these basic questions to a conspiracy theorist is likely to cause a sudden leap to the claim that we know that they were on board because they left a credit card trail for the tickets they had purchased and cars they had rented. So if they used credit cards that identified them, how does that reconcile with the claim that they used false IDs to get on to the plane? But by this time , the fruit loop is in full swing, as the conspiracy theorist tries to stay one jump ahead of this annoying and awkward rational analysis. They will allege that the hijackers’ passports were found at the crash scenes. “So there!” they exalt triumphantly, their fanatical faces lighting up with that deranged look of one who has just a revelation of questionable sanity.
Hmm? So they got on board with false IDs but took their real passports with them? However, by this time the fruit loop has been completely circumnavigated,and the conspiracy theorist exclaims impatiently, “who said anything about false IDs? We know what seats they were sitting in! Their presence is well documented!” And so the whole loop starts again. “Well, why aren’t they on the passenger lists?” “You numbskull! They assumed the identities of other passengers!” And so on…
Finally, out of sheer fascination with this circular method of creative delusion, the rational sceptic will allow them to get away with this loop, in order to move on to the next question, and see what further delights await us in the unraveling of this marvelously stupid story.
This source will be dismissed too.
I’ll try to do better, Frog. Thanks for the reminder of articles on other topics at NYT.
WILEY, I misspoke a bit. Too.
NATTY
Give us a link to that Loizeaux Interview. IF you are consistent you must allow us to judge on the owner of the paper in question.
Unlike your goodself we marxist revolutionary morons love, really LOVE, to seriously examine anything which may challenge our preconceptions.
i must confess i thoroughly enjoy your shotgun approach to all this .
BIZNESS AS USUAL NATTY
checking me electronic prowess—pride before the inevitable…
NATTY
BTW I"m also a “”“REVISIONIST”“”, even a “”“HOLOCAUST REVISIONIST”“”. Why on earth have History Departments in Universities if they ain’t REVISING somefing or other ? Eh ?
BTW your great authority Monsieur Loizeaux, may not be all that great. News to folow.
Rabbit too would like the source for the Jeb Bush Quote.
Continuing the piece about the wacky ones and their conspiracy theory.
HEY GANGSTERS AND GANGSTERESSES, NETIZENS AND NETIZENNES, Citoyens/Citoyennes, this may be somewhere on my old clunkercomputer, but I haven’t found it yet. Ask a friend ?
are of frog,
“The truth is useless. You have to understand this right now. You can
must be “dilapidated ” early schooling strikes back.
Spoken by Jeb Bush in conversation with Retired Naval Intelligence Officer, Al Martin, and Cited in Bushwhacked, by Uri Dowbenko, September, 2002
It’s also quoted in this article that pretty well sums up my feelings: Freedom to Fascism - A Bumpy Ride
[url=“http://tinyurl.com/8p59c”]
- Fourteen Characteristics of Fascism -
[/url]
It broke!
<a >-Fourteen Characteristics of Fascism-</a>
My bad on that one
-Fourteen Characteristics of Fascism-
That Henry A Wallace not a bad cat at all. Noticed him before, will revisit archives. He had some intello /moral power, totally absent de nos jours.
Fuckitslaterthanithoughtmustzonkthebloodysunwillbeupinacoupleofhours; Pistolero, must GO!
ps almartinraw another coolcat , why hasn’t he been siucided,? some good recipe somewhere…..........and godbless him.
The Fruit-Loop! This is great, Rarebit!
look at this
easy error
Hope these links work.
Seriously, we can only wonder if this was a “friendly fire” type error, or a twisted warning shot. The brass won’t take the heat for anything, and I don’t think the troops care much anymore. Most of these guys are on their third tour, and they can probably tell that things are only getting worse.
So I guess no real evidence, then.
Real would mean something that would cause an average person of average intelligence to sit up and think….Wow! This is amazing! Something that would make your average news reporter tingle all over and start shaking because he had found compelling evidence that six (or more!) of the hijackers listed in the commission report are still alive, and he/she was about to break a huge, huge story.
Real would mean something that would cause an average person of average
intelligence to sit up and think….Wow! This is amazing!
So in other words, she wouldn’t know real if it came up and bit her in the arse?
So why is anyone even bothering to talk to her?
Oh, Natalie, you’re such a bore; but I see how you work. Real is what you want to hear, the way you want to hear it.
You are a victim of the fruit loop. In the fruit loop the BBC and the Independent are part of a vast conspiracy.
Pistol Pete is new here, so maybe it’s understandable that he doesn’t see why we bother to argue with your fruit loopiness. He’ll come around—-post some more of your loopy fruit, so he’ll fall in love.
Months ago Natty had this brilliant idea to specify the precise form of the proof of life of the alleged 911 hijackers.
Video evidence she demanded.
Rabbit who has had about a year of sparring with the ignorant trollop, was at a stage of refusal to cater to her silly whims on the justification that she had ignored about 90% of the facts which damaged her case totally to hone in on a few minor issues as if they made any difference in the overall scheme of things. Which they don’t. Does the silly bitch realise that whether or not the hijackers existed is actually imaterial to the overall contention that the government was complicit, the buildings were brought down with explosives and a missile hit the pentagon, not a plane.
(thanks for the last detail, Nat, by denying it so strenuously. Rabbit who was previously sceptical had a closer look at the Missile hitting the Pentagon theory and it seems to be what happened. Thanks Nat like I said you are worth your weight in gold, the cause loves you. SHILL.
Ignoring the spiteful screeching for a video, which as Rabbit pointed out proves nothing and could as easily be discounted by her, Rabbit said NO. He will not even look for one. It is not the Nat that calls the shots. She has nothing, no case, no credibility, and no profile. A complete fly in the soup, she has no place and should not even be there. Scoop her out and chuck her in the bin. Dirty old fly. Flappy Bat.
So ever since she has assumed that the demand for a video was the way to go. If we cannot produce a video of any of the hijackers alive and weel after 911, then everything we have posted to date is forfeit. The WHOLE governmnet story is suddenly credible and everything just falls into place.
GUYS SHE IS ONTO US!
She has found our weakness.
Without a video of a live Hijacker the buildings were destroyed by a bit of Kero in the time some people take for lunch, after all.
The government knew nothing of it, and could have done nothing to prevent it after all.
All the hundreds of witnesses who saw explosions and other anomalies will be proven to be mistaken or making it up, if we cannot find a video of a Hijacker alive after 911.
Guess we might as well give up and admit the Fruit Loop had it right all along eh folks?
More Milk to soften the fruit loop?
Feel free to but in anytime the story is not describing your theory perfectly won’t you Vampire…...
Even the electrons loathe your lies. They have never behaved so boldly before notice….........
NITTY NATTY
Oh and Ronnie DiFrancesdo of Eurobrokers who initially went UP to 91 from the 84th floor of WTC2, and then decided to get out. He walked carefully down thru the RAGING INFERNO , and only met a mysterious “FIREBALL ” going out at the moment of demolition. Real burns, real explosion., but not for you ?
Average people of average intelligence haven’t been tingling all over and saying WOW what a great story , when yet another weird story breaks.
Average people have on average an average tendency to suspend disbelief, to stick their average heads in the sand.
SOME people thought or rather felt that 2 was going to come down. The accountant Stan Praimnath from Fuji Bank did, like your famous anonymous helicopter pilot.
The rather mysterious Mr Loizeaux did because he says he studied
the structures in college, and found a fatal design flaw.
Post that LINk, NATTY , I"m tingling again !
Natalie,
Now that you have given us such a definitely definitive definition of ‘reality’ (or was that ‘truthiness’?), perhaps you could be persuaded to bless us with an equally profound explanation of meaning of the term ‘pathetic fallacy’?
If it happened in a Bruce Willis movie, it’s good enough for me! Twelve years of public education I tell ya’!
What about this lack of “journalism” then? Well, gee…I don’t know how to counter that unless you take into account the well documented “anti-journalistic” approach of the news barons such as Rupert Nurdoch who’s most famous news channel (or at least the one that people know that he owns), Fox News, has gone out of it’s way to suppress news stories and promote a “neocon” political agenda such as the suppression of the dangers of the growth hormone (Posilac
Oops! Typos again!
Rupert Murdoch
Man, that dude owns a lot of media!
pete, and others!
At first sight off at a tangent, found this guy on public education, the page opened almost incidental. One can read the book online, very civilised.
John Taylor Gatto
Part of a wandering ongoing reflexion
Hey frog, I recommend Gatto, too. He expressed everything I didn’t like about school, although I did very well in school. It was painful to see so many kids with valuable talents and different kinds of intelligence be convinced that they’re dumb. A lot of problems with the U.S., I think, stem more from people believing that they’re stupid and that they can’t do anything about it, than from people actually being stupid.
A lot of things could be turned around with one generation of real educating, and excellent baby care (attachment parenting).
Rupert the Dirty Digger, as PrivateEye baptised him so long ago. Before the net it was required reading in the City for exposing scandals.
Good Wiki article, thanks. Footnotes 2&3 too.
This is for you, frog. It would not surprise me if you wondered just exactly what our government did besides bombing Afghanistan and Iraq, to protect us after the alleged Pakistani and Saudi Arabian terrorists attacked us. Well here it is:
Oy, I screwed it up. Here is the first half of the article.
Good Wiki article, thanks. Footnotes 2&3 too
Glad you liked it. The man has definately used the power of the press to make and break govermental policies and change political opinion.
<i><blockquote>WASHINGTON, DC
God forbid I get it on the first try.
I see we’ve lost our bold default. But what’s with the changing fonts and type points inside the blockquotes? And thanks to wiley for showing the way to <u>underlining</u>.
Wiley, sorta guessed you would be ‘there’ already. You were definitely thought of in “others”!
Just found Gatto, will read later. The dumbing down of edu systems to produce just bored consuming cogs goes with the rest, media etc. One of my kids teaches in car-burning Zone just outside Paris, but she’s an exceptional one, loves the kids but strong. Has to be. I’ll send her the link too !
Well, we certainly live in mind-stretching times, meet a lotta bright and genuine people . Thankyou Tim Berners-Lee for inventing this, and for not being a money- and power-grubbing bastard.
“”” For several years now, we’ve been living in a period of reaction in every domain. There is no reason to think that books are to be spared from this reaction. People are in the process of fabricating for us a literary space, as well as judicial, economic, and political spaces, which are completely reactionary, prefabricated, and overwhelming/crushing….’ This is, he said, ‘much worse than a censorship,‘and then he added, ‘but this dry spell will not necessarily last.’ Perhaps, perhaps…..” “”“
This is from an oldish interview by Direland (good site,,,) with a french philosopher Gilles Deleuze. I’ve learned a lot about France from that yank Doug Ireland, and I’ve been here a long time !
The increasing success of “political” film and books is quite fascinating. Of course films over-simpliy, but do then send me to google. Enjoyable is not the right word for “Good Night and Good Luck”, but I’m glad I went a few kms to see it in english.
John LeCarr
Hi all.
Rabbit read about Margaret, head of Qantus, The Oz biggest Airline, before getting here. Funny stuff this Airport security.
Aren’t the font changes pretty? It shows that the electrons are happier. They are making up for all the anger and rioting of earlier by doing happy dances. Still the fact that they are still being so vocal is a sign they have not laid down their arms, so to speak.
They are really pissed with the Liars, that’s the truth.
Pete, we work around and around, but not in useless circles, I pray ! We spend a lotta time reminding our individual selves of the iniquities of those we oppose.
Well the human being usually takes time to get off its arse, so we surely spend too much time ‘n energy conversing with fellow-believers . Me included. Well, batteries need charging, and convictions need checking.
I read a story somewhere about a guy at the car-wash who broached 911 with a fellow-washer. The old guy said “I know”, sadly, twice, took the leaflet and went home.
Probably I could count on my fingers the number of people i have personally talked to about this subject last year.
Some were completely incredulous. They had thought I was a sensible bloke, sound on diesel injector pumps ,education policy, solar heating, the invasion of Iraq (btw—all against here in Normandie, non-party), but on 911 they thought i was completely Cuckoo. My fault. Revising tactics. New tactics still to be tried out. Usually I now keep quiet when I could potentially open my big mouth.
Its like hunting. You don’t shoot until you’re sure you won’t get a “gamewarden or a cow”, as Tom Lehrer put it.
Other people trust me enough to absorb it, and just nod, look at me seriously, twice, to check if I"m serious, Ah Huh. OK .
This thing is so big. Even now I sometimes have doubts about my judgement. Its a helluva job to separate the 911 wheat from the chaff, unsurprising becos they have yards of $ to spend, and we are poor. Unlike our dearest Natters, I sometimes wonder if I AM going Cuckoo, but not for fucking long !.
In a better organised world, even the financial crimes and corruptions would be sufficient to send down a goodly proportion of your (and mine) Congress and administration. Including GWB.
So for some subjects a little LIHOP may be prescribed. A gentle intro….......... but then the only possible course is that of self-education, which brings us back to GATTO .
Frog
The Rabbit shares your sense of surrealism, as do many of us. The whole shebang is just so Fucking godamned crazy.
The abject denial is what amazes me. The completely reversed logic, and it is no further away that my family, many of whom are Mormons. They support Bush even from here in Oz with the same fanaticism as the sort of morons here on the net.
Rabbit tries to use this surreallism as inspiration rather than let it get him down. Never has surreal imagery made more sense and some of the most extraordinary cpmparisons are daily fare for those of us awake to watch it all unfold.
The grandest wildest show in the world. The world, right here on the screen, disntegrating, descending into utter chaos and destruction all at 49.3kbps. Faster on broadband.
How much more surreal can you get, Frog, in Frogland, Rabbit in Oz, Lumens in “Shangri La”, and Dave in Canada. Natty from some big corporation owned by Rendon group, ostensibly employed by the government to bullshit to us.
Minny Mind somewhere out in space perhaps, or Kansas, Our litttle Dorothy and that explains how she came to be among us.
We are able to show things to each other, look at the same things and information, watch the planet going kapow buzzoing gock tweeedle Boom…, and even discuss it like we were at the movies together. Man, this is SURREAL, from the conception to the enaction, to the (this) reaction.
Rabbit is so at home it is, like,............ Wonderland.
BTW Frog, I speak about this kind of stuff, easily and naturally, with an average of twenty people a week. Often just a few well placed sentences, or even a phrase repeated a few times in order to plant a seed which is designed to grow under it’s own power later.
Working alone, in a small Rock n Roll moulding factory, making and selling Kayaks. The passing trade amounts to hundreds of casual laid back sort of wanderings in of people, into Rabbit’s little factory.
Here in Oz, about a third seem well informed about 911, and know the truth or much of it. Another third are receptive and interested enough to take notice because they are so pissed off with many things and have figured out for themselves that many things are wrong and so they are as said receptive to the truth, and them I do work with.
The remainder get the seed planted in their minds, such as they have them. Many delivery people too, and they are good for spreading the word.
I guess it’s final then. None of you have any proof, real or otherwise, that six (or more!) of the hijackers pictured in the 9/11 commission report are still alive. Not one of them has seen fit to seek out a camera or a reporter in order to clear his name. Not one of them care that they have been falsely accused of participating in mass murder, and the very fact that they are alive and breathing would be obvious proof of their innocence. Imagine that.
Yes, I know. There’s all those reports from the BBC and CNN a few days after the attacks that talk about some confusion as to the identities of the hijackers, but it would seem that as soon as pictures came out….poof!.... away went any controversy. Except, of course, in the minds of David Griffin and his fellow travelers in that bizarre corner of the world known as “THERMITEVILLE.” There, the controversy oddly remains.
THE ZOMBIE TERRORISTS
The manner in which banal circumstances mutate into shadowy mysteries under such conditions is evident in an odd story that caused Mzoudi’s attorney Rosenthal to engage in some speculation in court: the news that at least six of the alleged hijackers were supposedly alive and their voices were being broadcast live through various media outlets several days after the attacks…...
.....Just how shaky this line of argumentation is becomes evident in a statement just three lines farther down the page. “We,” write the authors, “did not contact and personally interview them, nor have they been interviewed by anyone else recently.” The authors continue to state that it is quite possible that the undead are now in fact dead. In the authors’ opinions, if these men are alive, it must be perfectly understandable that someone who “is being accused of several thousand acts of murder” is likely to be in hiding “and unavailable for interviews.”.......
.......But there is one wrinkle. The BBC journalist responsible for the story only recalls this supposed sensation after having been told the date on which the story aired. “No, we did not have any videotape or photographs of the individuals in question at that time,” he says, and tells us that the report was based on articles in Arab newspapers, such as the Arab News, an English-language Saudi newspaper.
The operator at the call center has the number for the Arab News on speed dial. We make a call to Jeddah, Saudi Arabia. A few seconds later, Managing Editor John Bradley is on the line. When we tell Bradley our story, he snorts and says: “That’s ridiculous! People here stopped talking about that a long time ago.”
Bradley tells us that at the time his reporters did not speak directly with the so-called “survivors,” but instead combined reports from other Arab papers. These reports, says Bradley, appeared at a time when the only public information about the attackers was a list of names that had been published by the FBI on September 14th. The FBI did not release photographs until four days after the cited reports, on September 27th.
The photographs quickly resolved the nonsense about surviving terrorists. According to Bradley, “all of this is attributable to the chaos that prevailed during the first few days following the attack. What we’re dealing with are coincidentally identical names.” In Saudi Arabia, says Bradley, the names of two of the allegedly surviving attackers, Said al-Ghamdi and Walid al-Shari, are “as common as John Smith in the United States or Great Britain.”.......
.......When we ask Samman to take another look at the FBI’s list of photographs, he is more than happy to oblige, and tells us: “The Ghamdi on the photo is not the pilot with whom I spoke.”
absurd
The trick is, if you can, to look at the person’s aura, from this, or any interpretation of this you are familiar with, it is quite easy to see a receptive soul. If they are it remains only to find out where they stand in relation to any one of several key issues.
^^....Freedom and privacy, ie: new snooping laws and security acts.
^^....The Wars in the Middle East.
^^....The Warontera.
Then it’s easy squeezy to fill in any missing links for them or share some “fellowshipping”, to borrow the Xtians jargon, if as increasingly seems to be the case they already know.
Oh look the Bat is Back, it must have time warped or something and doesn’t know it isn’t calling the shots, and that we have moved on from the examination of her strange conspiracy, and even stranger insistence upon sticking to this theory despite it having been disproven on many levels..
It is you our twisty little eel, who owes others what you have not provided.
Bonjour lapin, froggy again late to snooze, but he is a masochistically inclined shade-dweller.
Just imagine if margaret Jackson CEO of Qantas had been a Lebanese-Aussie. Plastic hand-cuffs ? The GOON SQUAD is an inhuman beast, and growing.
And now we have Holocaust Day, as if the Goons only existed THEN.
I’ve decided, god knows how long it will hold, to leave aside the pentagon. Your DNA stuff looks good (by which we mean BAD, natch) so reckon I’m probably being idle.
On a lighter OZnote, ten years in April since froggy was up Murchison County way amputating lambstails. Surely a horrible Ozterm for the op, but he’s forgot it . Froggy’s uncle assured him that the Blackfellas were different, no sense of humour like us. And then he worked with them, as they gently took the piss out of the “Ole Doc”, slyly checking me out.
I think Seamus, or maybe Salim is messing with us.
What’s next? Everything comes out in Arabic?
Seriously guys,
Fix your comment board. Make the preview button work so it actually shows the results of the HTML. Provide HTML tools like other blog sites do. Put a navigational function on the last page so we can go back from there.
I would think a user friendly comment board would serve to keep people coming to your site. Fixing it is in everybody’s best interest.
Actually Nat, the fact is that the proof which is missing, completely, is that any middle eastern men at all were even on those flights. No DNA, NO video of them getting onboard, no credible witness to say they saw any such, NO names on any of the passenger lists, and NO evidence except a few obviously planted items which only raise more questions, since they are the passports of people alive. The passports, were shown worldwide. The owners of some of those passports came forward and were identified.
The incredible thing about your stance is that it is very rare. The only people who can still believe that at least five and possibly nine of those alleged hijackers, were not involved, by the passport evidence, WHICH IS THE ONLY EVIDENCE, are that laughable crowd who believe Iraq was behind 911.
You include the Flat Earth Society as honourable members just for their contribution to science.
That of course includes anyone who believes Bush, he just tried that one again I believe.
No Natty, the electrons are revolting, just not in the way you are.
AND Natty, since you are a shill like interloper and nobody likes you anyway, your opinion about how the notice boards look is immaterial.
Everybody else just gets along without having to control every little detail merely watching the parade and commenting upon it. You keep on peeping for help from teh grown-ups, I’ll bet you were a drag to play with as a kid.
Besides it’s cute sometimes.
Rabbit,
frogsoldiers not there so rather less urgent public interest here. I notice in myself ; expat brit, ex royal artillery, a deeper concern. A sense of shame that MY fucking country is doing things, presenting itself to the world, in such a way. Well, it happened in my time,too, but I wasn’t awake then !
Rabbit feels shame for Oz. Once like most Aussies he was mildly proud of his kind and sensible easy going land.
Now it is a shame and dishonour to be a white Australian. We are a warmongering nation. A warmongerers bootlicking faggot nation.
Many of us doubt that John Howard is the natural father of his wife Janet’s kids. We find it hard to imagine him being unfaithful to George.
Since that post befroe was a bit garbled Rabbit shall tidy it a bit.
The only ones who don’t believe that some of those alleged hijackers are alive, from the evidence presented, are the same idiots who would try and say Iraq was behind 911.
This is what Bush the chimp spouted again in his address I believe. He has told so many lies he has forgotten which ones were current.
Natty is of course up with current lies, and knows they were not Iraqi isn’t that so Nat?
Come prove that you know the alleged hijackers were not Iraqi please, and tell us so that we may know you are at least that much human.
(Won’t it be funny if she has now been told, since Bush’s latest speech, that this is the official line again, she’ll have to come on here and push it to us.)
Natty, will pass Spiegel article to our german department. A cursory glance noted two funnies.
“The Iran Contra deal fell apart and its key actors were exposed “. Yeah! One of them became the POTUS. The others were pardoned, presidentially.
Northwoods etc. ” All those supposed conspiracies EXIST but they all failed”. Kennedy just died of heartfailure a little later, after refusing Northwoods.
Rabbit says:
“The passports, were shown worldwide. The owners of some of those passports came forward and were identified.”
OK, Rabbit, walk us through it. Show us (me) how the people came forward and were identified. Show me you have something other than a few confused reports that were understandably generated shortly after 9/11, based on the simple fact that there are nine gazillion people with the same names as the hijackers.
Show me something that would move an administration hater like Seymour Hersh or Robert Fisk to break the incredible blockbuster news that would embarrass Bush like nothing else would, thereby becoming a veritable rockstar in the media.
Pretend like you really, really have to put your best foot forward and present your case to the world. Make it solid and easy to grasp. Lay it down in black and white.
Frog said:
“Give us a link to that Loizeaux Interview. IF you are consistent you must allow us to judge on the owner of the paper in question.”
What possible relevance could there be in the source of my quotes? Why should it even matter from where they emanate?
Ya’ know what? I kind of find it interesting that in every spiteful little bit of “truthfulness” it tries to get people to believe is riddled with actual half truths. Here’s a little bit that “the bat” forgot to mention in her march for “truth:”
<blockquote>After all, didn’t Bush and Blair deceive their fellow citizens, the United Nations, and the rest of the world with falsified or exaggerated threat scenarios to make it easier to send their soldiers to Iraq? What about Vietnam, the Iran Contra affair, and US support for Bin Laden and the Taliban when they were fighting the Soviet army in Afghanistan?
And what about plans such as “Operation Northwoods” - a conspiracy plot hatched in 1962 by the US high command? Under this plan, a passenger aircraft flying over the Caribbean was to be replaced by a remote-controlled, identical aircraft. The aircraft would be exploded and the Cubans would be accused of having shot down the plane. Was this conspiracy also a figment of someone’s imagination?
All of these supposed conspiracies did exist, but they all failed. “Northwoods” was eliminated by Kennedy, the Iran Contra deal fell apart and its key actors were exposed, and the fact that the Americans provided assistance to Afghan guerillas simply highlighted an ongoing dilemma in the often disastrous principle of American foreign policy, a policy based on the principle that my enemy’s enemy is my friend.</bockquote>
Notice something interesting here? It explains how some real conspiracies were foiled, but fails to touch on such things as Bush and Blair deception over the Iraq war?
Heck maybe Nat is right and planes really did hit the towers, the pentagon, and just vaporized on impact thusly foiling and serious investigation of the wreckage and most laws of physics, but nobody has yet explained how it got past all our fail-safes. Hell, let’s face it, the US is paranoid and we had a tight freaking set of checks to make sure that planes weren’t hijacked that easily. Maybe they thought they were smarter than these remarkable terrorists and could foil them by supplying them with fake planes just like the FBI thought they’d foil these terrorists with “fake” powder on this fateful day:
FBI foreknowledge in 1993 WTC Bombing
(scroll to the bottom of the article for the FBI details)
So, let us just say that terrorists planned it and got past all our checks because there was jelly from a doughnut on all the radar screens that very minute, and there really is no “conspiracy.” Hmmmm…. That means that every GD person in charge of our security had their head so far up their arse that they should be in a mental hospital drooling on themselves. Did we put Jerry freaking Lewis in charge of our air defense or what?! WTF is wrong with this woman?!! She thinks we should shove our nose up GWB’s arse and tell him his bullshit smells like roses?!! It’s BS, she knows it, and she keeps trying to feed it to people!! And I thought Monsanto was full of twisted freaks of nature.
Yeah, the world went into shock and a whole bunch of greedy bastages profited on those deaths. Those people who would rather go SPLAT on the street than be burned to death. GWB acheived his TRIFECTA and American soldiers and billions of tax dollars (not paid by HIS pals) are being used to achieve his vision in Iraq! HIS agenda!! NeoCons may call themselves “conservative,” but they are just sociopaths who found a party and a system to twist and distort.
The baaaa bat can kiss my chrome plated arse…
Heh, forgot my “l” on the blockquote.
Frog said:
“i must confess i thoroughly enjoy your…... approach…..”
Why, Thank You, Frog. I sensed your intellect and knew you would come around to my way of thinking. I knew I could convince you that this bombs in the buildings stuff is just a bunch of cannabis enhanced wishful thinking.
<blockquote>After all, didn
P. Pete proclaims:
“Yeah, the world went into shock and a whole bunch of greedy bastages profited on those deaths. Those people who would rather go SPLAT on the street than be burned to death. GWB acheived his TRIFECTA and American soldiers and billions of tax dollars (not paid by HIS pals) are being used to achieve his vision in Iraq! HIS agenda!! NeoCons may call themselves
Thou art projecting, Natalie. You must look inside of yourself to find what is genuine.
La chauve-souris!
That’s so cute. In French.
Nat walking you through it all at least a dozen times, in a similar vein to the article Wiley and I have been posting, has been the order of the day for , oh six months or so now.
It isn’t that she hasn’t heard it all before her approach has been the same the whole time, and ayone who wants to see just how extreme this can get is advised to visit an old thread about her first love, Depleted Uranium. Radioactive Wounds of War.
The obvious denial, smoke and mirrors and character assasination via innuendo has been constant throughout.
Trust Rabbit she is still running in top gear.
We have a saying here in Oz which describes Natty.
Full of Shit.
She must be joking about Froggy or anyone seeing anything her way? Ignorant and shameless shill.
La Chauve-Souris? The bald mouse?
Wack the nasty thing anyway.
LIke I said, luminous…..
The mind is a terrible thing. And so is TV’s effect on it.
I still haven’t heard from you regarding your thoughts on the significance (or lack thereof) of why Prof. Jones’ paper has not been accepted/submitted for publication in any legitimate scientific/engineering/physics journal/publication.
How about projecting upon us your explanation for this?
I looked inside and asked myself this very basic question. I answered my question. Can you answer it?
The mind is a terrible thing
Paranoia will destroya
Stop the hate. Hate won’t stop hate
You’re stalling, Rabbit. I’m looking for something real, something tangible, not gobbltygoop. Try again.
Rabbit doesn’t get the joke? Surely, he gets the joke. He’s just playing dumb.
The real piece of evidence missing is not <u>more</u> evidence that some of the alleged hijackers are alive, but <u>any</u> evidence they were on the planes at all.
Some video of any of them at the airports would be nice.
Don’t play stupid pinhead games with us you wicked creature, it is your case which is lagging, you owe some sort of evidence beyond opinions and assertions without substance. Pretending you are not already six feet deep in your case is just more sick denial. Amusing to everybody, except the one who pretends amusement only, but who is really connected to this issue for the end of the LIE will mean the end of the world it has built itself. A world of pathetic delusional little lies, and all designed to help it from ever having to admit to the biggest lie of all.
<blockquote>
Avoiding the hard questions
ROBERT STEINBACK
I was 8 years old when President John Kennedy was shot to death in Dallas in 1963. If grace favors me, I’ll be 62 when documents related to the assassination are released to the public, and 84 when the Warren Commission’s investigative files into the tragedy are finally opened.
That’s a long time to wait for a chance to evaluate the purported truth.
It’s a blot on the presumed sophistication of the people of the United States that any aspect of an event so dramatic and shocking should be kept from us. Perhaps it’s true, to abuse the line from A Few Good Men yet again, that we can’t handle the truth. But there cannot be genuine resolution as long as such critical information remains concealed.
Transformed by 9/11
Since Kennedy’s assassination, Americans have lurched between demanding to know and plugging their ears: The Pentagon Papers, My Lai, the King assassination, Watergate, Iran-contra, the savings-and-loan debacle, Monicagate. Lately, however, it would seem the public’s verdict is in: Don’t tell us. Keep us in the dark. We don’t want to know.
This is the worst possible time for probe-ophobia to grip us. Our nation was irretrievably transformed by 9/11—and yet there remain troubling questions about what really happened before, during and after that day. Rather than demanding a full and fearless vetting to hone in on the truth and silence the conjecture about 9/11, many Americans remain unwilling to peer into the microscope.
An online cottage industry of theorists, theory debunkers and debunker debunkers has flourished since 9/11. Sometimes the flimsy theories are easy to spot—come on, if the four passenger jets didn’t crash where it appears they did, where did they go? More often, though, the cases aren’t so obvious.
A group of experts and academicians ‘devoted to applying the principles of scientific reasoning to the available evidence, `letting the chips fall where they may,’ ‘’ last week accused the government of covering up evidence that the three destroyed New York City buildings were brought down that day by controlled demolition rather than structural failure. The group, called Scholars for 9/11 Truth, has a website, www.st911.org.
Unanswered questions
The reflexive first reaction is incredulity—how, one asks, could anyone even contemplate, never mind actually do such a barbaric thing? But before you shut your mind, check the resum
Pete’s quick w/ the blockquotes, and they’re relevant, too. Kudos to Pete.
ITT’s webmaster is apparently on vacation.
You’re prevaricating Rabbit is not stalling and you have never done anything different.
Nat your projecting is quaint, but as arrows against others are useless, for we feel not the prick of arrows destined for their owners head alone.
Nat?! Do you have a cold? It seems like your voice has changed. Hmmmm.
“Some video of any of them at the airports would be nice.”
Oh, so now you’re asking for video? When I do it it’s a sin, when you do it…..oh yeah…...the exemption.
Maybe my memory’s faulty, but I thought I remembered lots and lots of video of the hijackers at the airport. Perhaps I imagined all that.
CNN’s in on it!
“An online cottage industry of theorists, theory debunkers and debunker debunkers has flourished since 9/11. Sometimes the flimsy theories are easy to spot
Don’t bother as if you would, Bat. This should answer it for you.
<a href=“http://www.prisonplanet.com/fbi_denies_mix_up_of_911_terrorists.htm”>FBI Director Mueller acknowledged in 2002 there was no
No cold wiley, feeling fine, thanks…...........no, not really.
I just learned that my own mother in law believes that Japan is controlling the weather by way of some kind of device they use. Via Art Bell et all, it seems.
I think I might be in the last stages of denial. Struggling to cling to by belief that stuff usually just happens, and not that there’s always some dark nefarious group of former CEO’s and neocons maniplating the world to their advantage.
It’s getting harder and harder. My own Mother in law!
they’re relevant, too
Oh, I’m all beside myself with delight over its approval
Truthfully, I’m not sure I’d trust it to judge the color of a coat of paint.
Kudos to
Pete.
Ewwwwww…GET em off, somebody!!
Natalie you have always been asked for things to prove your mad assertions but have never given anything.
We on the other hand have provided enough to sink a Navy of doubters for everything relevant.
You have been told from the start that a video of living alleged hijackers is a spurious demand of yours and whether or not such is on the internet, is of no interest, for there is enough proof for most people. That includes the hundred or more scholars directly involved in the last few articles’ postings. It also includes various high ranking FBI people. Which you are conveniently ignoring whilst shrieking weirdly for something nobody ever promised and nobody cares less about really, least of all you. Should anybody else ever get around to feeding you this morsel, you will discard it like everything else which shows the lie.
Well just because you ignore it doesn’t make it go away.
Natalie, your falseness about the Pentagon Missile and the Pods, which are not of interest to me and you are a lying piece of crap for suggesting otherwise, is misplaced.
It is an opinion piece, and doens’t prove or disprove anything, it shows that a large group of very qualified scholars and eminent in their own right, believe the WTC’s were brought down with demolition charges, for this is something which can be established scientifically at this stage and has been so. That you ignorant twit, is the whole Crux of the article.
Your selective quote was expected and Rabbit left that bit in especially to see you pull it, knowing you would never have known otherwise if he’d left it out, for you don’t read any source contrary to your lies.
It means nothing merely saying that the theories of such things lack the same absolute provability of the demolition theories.
Let us look at a more relevant quote than your attempted strawman red herring.
’‘I am a professional philosopher who has spent 35 years teaching logic, critical thinking and scientific reasoning,’’ group co-founder and University of Minnesota professor James H. Fetzer told me. ``When I come to 9/11, it’s not hard for me to determine what is going on. This is a scientific question. And it is so elementary that I don’t think you can find a single physicist who could disagree with the idea that this was a controlled demolition.’‘
Since you’re such a dumb twat Rabbit includes the rest of that article, not that these people are saying all this.
<blockquote>The group asks, for example,
Oops meant <u>NOTE</u> that these people are saying this. This being what follows.
Wackata wackata wack. Wacking the evil old bat. Ugly of soul and puny of mind, Bat needs a reminder to open it’s mind. Dumber than dirt or lying with skill. Is the Bat for real or is it a SHILL.?
Pistol Pete
Condolences on the Nat’s approval. You must have said something really fucked up to earn that.
Just imagine being stuck for months alone on a thread with this creature…..If you can…..........
respect the rabbit, for he has done this.
It was very bad. The stink, the blood, the screaming and gnashing of teeth. All it does is lie and hide, hide and lie, all as if the world is an apple pie.
Oh yes we do know all about the false video footage which was aired on CNN among other propaganda agencies.
More about live alleged hijackers.
There is no reason in the world why there should necessarily be any video footage of any of these guys, although there probably is, anyone who cares can search among the hundreds of references on the last link.
There is every reason in the world why there should be some evidence via passenger records or airport security cameras to show them getting on.
That is the world of difference between the two claims.
Dim and false Bat.
Oh, Rabbit, that thought is too awful to contain. I will wack the side of my head to dislodge it—-
UUURGG—-
one more time—-
Smack!
O.K. Don’t want to have nightmares. Come to think of it, a couple of days ago I was coming out of sleep and having a speaking dream. No images. Just words. And I was going around and around——stuck in a game of “he said, I said”, “I said, he said, I said”, “he said, I said, he said…” On and on like that. It was horrible. It was like being on a thread with Nat.
Cringe.
You’re particularly lyrical lately, Rabbit. Having fun?
Ah has anybody dropped this site into the mix?
It is a bomb under the 911 lie. A beautifully referenced and presented collection of what is known who said what and who they are.
Isn’t it incredible that all the “Truth deniars”, the Fruit Loops, can do is run around in circles, compared with something like this, they aren’t even in the game
Rabbit always hops for fun, dear Wiley.
I’m with Pat and Abe, Natalie. Who are you with?
<b><i>there
Though I never believed the official story for one minute, I decided to conduct a test. I tried to believe the official story. 19 hijackers? Right! Koran at the titty bar? Check! Flight manual in the trunk? You better believe it! Invisible planes? Sure! Why not? Black boxes didn
Wiley.
Witch..
Snap out of it. You are rational, you can recognise the difference between night and day, black and white. You know that gravity is an old but reliable constant.
Wiley? Are you OK yet?
AND it is Aum. The sound of creation. The natural source of the perfect timbre and vibration of the eternal Aum, is the Didegridoo. Quite possibly the oldest musical instrument in the world, discounting the tapping sticks.
Rabbit used to play the Didgeridoo, but has never learned circular breathing yet.
Lumens, you know what their problem is, we all do. Fear. Absolute cold terror of what the consequences of accepting the truth entails.
Let’s face it. At this stage, we mostly know things are too bad to ever be changed by anything less that counterviolence. At least we have had years to accustom ourselves to the gradually worsening state of democracy (sic), the pre-eminence of the mighty dollar and the corrupt and insane conspiracists. The poor dittoheads who cannot bear to face the truth, are in a position of having to make the jump from complete faith in the benevolence of their governments, to complete distrust and enmity with an insane and satanic force. These morons are terriified of the truth for it means they are no longer secure, and for cowards, security is everything. It doesn’t mean real security, just the perception of same. Like kids who hide under the blankets from the Bogey man.
MOOO. Mooo. Ahem. What?! Where am I?
Is that you Rabbit? Rabbit?
If we can just hang on til things break apart enough for alternatives to be worth it, then I think we can wise up. Maybe. One well trained generation would make great waves too. And—-hey, if we can’t hang on for ten or so years, then we probably can’t hang on, period. I know it may sound strange, but U.S. culture is in gridlock, understood in some quarters as a clusterf*ck.
School is a racket.
War is a racket.
Farming is a racket.
Real estate is a racket.
Taxes are more tribute and bomb money than anything else.
The media exists to sell us things we don’t need and lie to us in the guise of giving us “news”.
ETC. The “job” isn’t just a carrot, it’s survival. It’s really perverse when a person or family’s survival rests on an adult’s ability to stay gainfully employed at a doggy spa, but this happens. We Americans are so removed from fundamental survival issues that “working for food” is the lowest of the low. A little hunger instructs.
Americans are scared Rabbit. Our society makes us and keeps us terribly dependent and insecure. It’s not just a state of mind, it’s reality and it’s the result of media and 12 years of compulsory miseducation. Street urchins have more sense than the average did-everything by the book (they can’t read) American.
It’s not that we’re particularly bad people, but we’ve been trained with every psychological and social trick in the book. We are hypnotized by a massive social engineering machine that uses media that is a few steps ahead of our individual evolution to make us consumers and workers that can be replaced with a machine.
Crony Capitalism can only be maintained through indoctrination.
Many Americans were raised by a television. That’s sad.
I can’t take credit for not being so brainwashed. It wasn’t a choice, per se, it was just that I found it very hard to sit still for that long and I was what people on my mother’s side of the family referred to as “a yard-ape”.
Yeh.
Rabbit was just an individual, try and make him do what he doesn’t want to do, and see where that gets you!
No friends mostly and most kids picked on the rabbit in the school yard, so he became independant, and self reliant.
And I bloody well like it that way. Looking back on the sheeple who ostracised the odd rabbit, he is left with a feeling mostly of mixed gratitude and pity for the ninnies.
I guess I have to admit, that I’ve never met anyone as wacked in the head. Totally in denial as the “afflicted” of your countrymen. But there are yet many Aussies who are extremely screwed in the head, we have plenty of dittoheads and sheeple.
We are members of the empire with nothing but a slightly more correct form of English and a less outrageous accent than the Grand Poobars of cultural excellence themselves.
Thanks to John Wayne the Brady Bunch and Coca-Cola.
Oh and Barbara Eden.
Rabbit and Wiley would have found something to do in the yard, while the house monkeys watched the swill.
Rabbit was an excellent Doctor at one time and can thank a couple of imaginative and clever Nurses for his early successes in medicine. These successes have given meaning to at least the first half of his existence.
They still recall a wistfull smile or two from time to time.
Sorry for being a bit fresh dear Witch.
It was the thought of Barbara Eden in her Bikini and fluffy things, I think.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,For the Bat….............................................................................
Here it is. Rabbit has been keeping an alert eye open for this story for a half year now.
Promised the Nasty Natty Batty that her hide would feel the heat, of the story which is told showing generals on the beat. Speaking truths which trash the lies and show that Monsters rule the skies. Natty is a lying Shill and her posts sprout only lies.
Come on Natty.
Lob into this thread and ask about videos of alleged hijackers as if the whole bullshit circus hangs on that one tenuous thread.
You are a shit for brains shill and you have done your dash for good around here. Don’t hesitate to come on and roll in your own shit though, it’s what we expect of a canine creature of your gender.
More truth which cans your whole world of artificial reality….. Shill.
Wade through the amount of bone jarring truth about the state of Journalism.
Oh and don’t forget stupid Bat. If you crap on the source in an ad-hominem fashion, or falsely, Rabbit will just cut and paste the info to show what a lying sow you are.
Best just to ignore it then eh?
Oh my, Rabbit. Your concerns over depleted uranium may be unfounded, at least according to Col. Donde Grande. And he hasn’t been wrong on a single thing yet!
AJ: How did the military ever get convinced to use depleted uranium in areas where there is going to be troops?
DGP: To put what Alex?
AJ: Well, yeah, the military gets treated like dog meat. You’ve got the depleted uranium, Colonel, where they spray the depleted uranium everywhere where the troops breathe it at 1900 times safe levels. How can the Pentagon put up with that?
DGP: Well, the DU rounds are over-played, first of all. They aren’t that potent and secondarily, we must consider that weapons of mass destruction have already been used by some of the opposition in the period February of 1991. Weapons of mass destruction, including low-yield nuclear weapons.
AJ: Okay, can you break that down for us?
DGP: Well, I break it down in the time frame that we had satellite images of rounds or missiles being fired from the Negev desert toward Baghdad. That’s 600 miles distance. And six or eight of the rounds came in. That was February of 1991.
AJ: Are you saying that the Israelis used miniaturized nuclear weapons?
DGP: Yes sir. That’s what I’m saying, in plain English.
AJ: Well I remember, I know they bragged that they had a lot of really sophisticated miniaturized nuclear weapons, of the little mini-frogs, or whatever. But and I know there were these giant mushroom clouds on the news. They’d say, “Oh, that’s not a nuke. That’s just a weapons depot.” But you are saying that it is common knowledge at the Pentagon that Israel was firing nuclear weapons at Iraq?
DGP: That is correct.
AJ: Oh, so that’s where all this high-level radiation is emanating from?
DGP: That is correct. And I have verification of that. I think it’s in book 2. And I think it will stand up in most scrutiny.
He’s got verification, Rabbit. It’s in book 2. You can order it for 30 dollars plus postage and handling. It will stand up in most scrutiny.
No luck on finding that footage, eh Rabbit? I know you’ve been searching desperately because you’d dearly love to stick it to me on this, even though you act like you don’t care.
Perhaps you’re gonna have to first convince the Arab world that the hijackers were mis-identified or were never there. (according to Donde Grande’s remote control theory)
Pride
“What petrifies the disbelievers is that the 19 Martyrs knew for so long that on September 11, 2001 they would, by the Permission of Allah, meet death. It terrifies them to their very core. They find it incomprehensible that men could live for so long with an objective to meet death and not snap under the pressure. Islamic History is rich with the oaths of the Mujahideen to fight to the death, yet most of these have been made just moments before the battle. Each of the 19 Martyrs made a vow to meet death on September 11 2001; they did this not a few minutes before the attack, not a day before, not even a week before, but a considerable time before the attack. This makes the oath of the 19 Martyrs, a glorious oath amongst the most noble oaths.”......
........”Let it be known in the Heavens and Earth that on Tuesday September 11, 2001, these 19 Lions of Islam: Roared.
“Verily, Allah has purchased of the believers their lives and their properties for (the price) that theirs shall be the Paradise. They fight in Allah’s Cause, so they kill (others) and are killed. It is a promise in truth which is binding on Him in the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel) and the Qur’an. And who is truer to his Covenant then Allah? Then rejoice in the bargain which you have concluded. That is the supreme success.” [Quran 9:111]
It’s in the Koran!
Lions, Rabbits, Witches and Frogs. Starting to sound like another installment in the Chronicles of Narnia.
(and bats!)
Who the hell is Col. Donde Grande and can you give the link to this source, please?
He’s a friend of Rabbit’s. See the link above… “Here it is”
Posted by Rabbit on Feb 4, 2006 at 5:43 AM
Why does the posting of a link to a story make the guy a friend? Desperate Shill.
Any way not today Josephine, Rabbit is going sailing.
.................................^^.....................................
.....................................if you haven’t yet woken up the fact that the world is wackier than Narnia and Wonderland combined, there ain’t no hope for you Bat.
Well, since you’re defending DU, Nat, you’re probably not worried about silly things like souls.
How time flies. It’s been a year with this computer and I just now opened a nuclear folder. Cluck. Cluck.
When one considers that the VA didn’t officially recognize health problems caused by Agent Orange until 1989, it isn’t surprizing to see that a General is downplaying DU now. In fact, that’s tantamount to saying that it is a military issue and responsibility. If they could only learn to drag their feet, stall, and stone-wall going to war as well as they hold out on acknowledging the devastation done to our soldiers’ health and the health of foreign peoples we make ill and kill with our biological, chemical, and radioactive weaponry—-well, we’d have money all over the place and less illness and longer lives! We wouldn’t have victims strewn all over the globe. Perhaps we could think about not poisoning nations as a way of going that extra mile to keep generations of people from hating out guts. It’s not our freedoms that they hate, Nat—-it’s our guts. They hate our guts.
Tell you what, Nat. Make this a challenge for us. Instead of one or more of us going around looking up information for you to ignore, why don’t you ask questions about DU? Throw some out for all of us. Try to make us believe that you are open to persuasion and not just playing silly little soul-less games. Consider it a challenge.
Yo, Rabbit. What I miss is the liveliness of nature. When I was a child, there was a huge kingdom of insects, caterpillars, butterflies, moths, beetles, bottleflies, fireflies, dragonflies, pill bugs, lady bugs, and more; and then there were different kinds of little bitty tree toads, assortments of larger frogs, horned toads, garden snakes, bullfrogs…I mean the place was alive! And at night there were way more stars than you could ever count. There were trees, wild and cultivated. Flowers in the gardens and in the fields. Pecans and peaches. Johnson grass and honeysuckle.
The world was much more alive then, and it wasn’t just because I was a child. This spring, I’ll be thrilled to find earthworms, and ladybugs. Hope to see honey bees this year. Maybe I should order some insects. I have a catalog of insect eggs. Been thinking about getting a big pot of pampus grass for butterflies.
I’m just selfishly yacking at you guys.
Looked at permaculture by the way, Rabbit. I’ve read about it before. If I had property I’d do it, but still, I’d want a greenhouse, and indoor plants, and a pond, and container gardens, and an acre of lavendar, and some xeroscaping, and a luscious bit of rye grass. And a degree in horticulture and all relevant licences and certifications—- I could live the rest of my life on six acres of land and be happy as a clam.
A girl can dream, can’t she? Unless the climate changes radically in this zone, organic gardening is a cinch.
It’s been raining sideways for two months now. The winds are wicked good to listen to when warm and dry in the house. I am so looking forward to spring.
No matter if the human race lasts another millenium, or if it ends this October, when it’s time to plant, it’s time to plant.
If we get through this year without nuclear war or economic devastation, I’ll be most thankful.
Really, though Rabbit, you can’t resist that tree climbing yard-ape,yes master combination. Am I right?
Wiley is right.
Sorry to throw such a less than inspirational one into the mix, but tell me please, that nobody would do anything but laugh at something as blatantly staged as this!
In Oz, I swear that to do something like this would cause 95% of Australians to fall off the couch, they would laugh so much.
Mrs Rabbit and many other sensible and alert people here, watch 24. Always with the mental caveat that they are watching Americans doing things the way Americans do things—in the movies. ..... The idea that things really are as insanely violent and destuctive with car chases, shootings and people hanging off helicopters all over the place, usually comes as a shock for them all the same when visiting the USA for real. (Actually I have no idea if this is normal but am giving you the benefit of the doubt. Also have heard from some who have visited the US and it was the impression.
However if any attempt was made by a political faction to score off a fictitious telemovie like this ...........like I said, laughed off the stage.
Then again; those Big Brother and lame Australian Idol takeoffs (together with the phone companies) are making truckloads of money.
People actually seem to take that crap seriously, so who can say until they try it. I guess it is something to watch for.
Rabbit can see that the nasty Bat, is trying to make something out of the suggestion that the Israelis used some Nukes on Iraq.
Funny that it is the sort of thing she would normally fight tooth and claw to deny, but if it can in any way be used to vindicate her beloved BABY..Depleted Urnanium…then she’ll use it.
Too bad for you, that the reasoning you employ is considered to be false logic by “normal” people.
The fact that some Radiation in Iraq may be due to Israeli Nukes, does not eliminate the remainder of which is due to the use of Depleted Uranium by the US. The amounts and it’s lethality have been covered else where.
More importantly though is the standard DU Shill trick of trying to stick to the Radiation as being the main danger of Depleted Uranium. This is not, and has never been claimed to be the case.
The main danger from Depleted Uranium projectiles and bombs, comes not from the primary radiation of the Uranium. It is at least depleted to the extent that the U235 has been removed more or less. The U237 is however the main type found and it is not depleted. However, it is not the main concern. It is not what is making the veterans sick and their spouses and their children. It is not what is responsible for the massive numbers of birth deformities and genetic damage resulting in dreadful illness and deaths among the Iraqi, which will accelerate now over the next decade until the result will without any doubt, be virtual genocide, complete destruction of the Iraqi people.
This is, and Natalie the great SHILL knows it; caused by Ceramic Uranium Oxide Vapours and dust. It is what becomes of the Depleted Uranium when it is in a bomb. At least 60% of it becomes this deadly chemical poison when it is used as projectiles, bullets for example. It is airborne and soluble in water, for example the lungs. You need but a very tiny amount in your system before it begins to alter the body’s DNA structure, causing first and foremost damage to the gametes, the sex cells. Your children will be born grossly deformed, if they are born at all.
50% of returning soldiers children are being born with the expected deformities.
You have NO IDEA how horrible this is going to be,. The shocker to me is that I am sure, you are going to set in motion even more horrific evil before the one in Iraq has come fully of age.
Before even the true monstrosity which is now Iraq’s future, for at least the next couple of billion years, is unfolded, the next and probably worse act will be well underway.
I don’t know what to say. The truth is here, the results of more and more medical tests and surveys are confirming everything which was predicted. The simple and unvarnished truth is that the Pentagon has ALWAYS known that using Uranium as a Dirty Bomb, was a viable option for mass killings. It was known in 1945 to be the perfect genocidal weapon with the exception of a full Nuclear Explosion, and better in some ways. Much cheaper and easier to deploy, more of the actual Uranium becomes deadly particulates and gas.
AND it has economic and environmental advantages. Disposing cheaply of all that dirty leftover Uranium waste fromn the US Nuclear Power industry.
Not that this post was intended to go off topic, but since the Natty loves DU so much, it is always a good thing to shove some up her nose when she gets horny for it. Any mention of DU in any forum anywhere gets the Vampire panting by the way.
Next step, prisoners working on mid-eastern oil wells and pipelines until their life sentence prematurely ends?
Like these articles, say, there are many man made radioactive isotopes—-including Plutonium—-present in “depleted uranium”. The word “depleted” only refers to the fact that the substance is no longer useful for producing nuclear energy. The fact remains that depleted uranium is both a radiological hazard, and a heavy metal that can be stored in our bones where it displaces useful metals and does damage to stem cells.
<i>Could it be that depleted uranium munitions are the latest in the line of the Pentagon’s
When I say “our” in the above post, I’m referring specifically to humans though it’s probably true for most life forms. No prions, though—- radiation doesn’t kill them.
Back to that shortly, but here is an excellent analysis of the WTC’s collapse by a Finnish Military Expert. This the best most picture perfect analysis I’ve seen. These are the best stills showing where the PROOF is, right in front of the eyes, that these buildings were demolished with explosives.
The whole site is good, and nothing I’ve seen before.
Natty will probably crawl back under her rock for a while again now.
Realising that her DU Starchild is suffering by exposure here now, and due to several recent postings about 911 which are individually more enlightening than all her sources combined. She will wisely keep a low profile, until either the thread moves on, or it stays quiet for long enough she hopes we’re all gone.
Seen it all before.
Of course Rabbit writes this so she will deliberately pop in sooner to show the rabbit is wrong about something.
This we shall call the Vampire two step.
I have to confess, Rabbit the whole DU issue makes me morbidly sad. Soon, I hope to get active in an orderly way—-on the web. Perhaps there’s a shilling for free for disarmament course on the web somewhere, and I can start posting on nuclear issues on a lot of sites after getting up to date and organized. Or perhaps I’ll do it on my own. I think the web is a seriously good place to talk about these issues. One really good nuke post a day? On several sites? Is that anti-nuke spam?
I’ll be more resilient and positive when I’m gardening.
You seem to get people’s number, Rabbit why do so many people think and/or say that it is a waste of time to discuss important issues on the web? Have they never learned anything on the web?
My experience is that talking about nuclear issues does <not> lessen the pain, but the principle doesn’t change, and librium is available. I’ll contemplate this for two weeks before making a decision.
DU is horrifying. I want to jump out of my skin, sometimes, I am beside myself with grief and I feel guilty. I call my condition BPM, or Being Properly Mortified.
Will surf for guidance this week. Anything comes up, in that vein, will you let me know Rabbit, Lumens, frog…?
Uuum…............“Don’t Worry Be Happy”?
Making sure that Shills don’t get a free ride, blurting their rubbish without proper challenges and the Actual Truth is stated, illustrated and compounded over and over at least as often as they tell their lies.
This is our small corner of the world.
Take what we learn and tell others. Pray in your heart for “Help” from a higher power. God is OK as a starter, but it’s best to leave a caveat that you’ll accept any benevolent help that is offering in his stead.
Rabbit has it on good authority that if enough sentience is concentrated on this one prayer, help isn’t too far away.
Unfortunately it needs to be something like half the sentience available on the planet at the moment.
Some wicked jokes are already occurring to Rabbit based on this premise.
A quick replay of some Nat in Action.
“”“Frog said:
“Give us a link to that Loizeaux Interview. IF you are consistent you must
allow us to judge on the owner of the paper in question.”
NATTY FROM WONDERLAND’S NON- ANSWER ===
What possible relevance could there be in the source of my quotes? Why
should it even matter from where they emanate? (feb3,1227h)”“”
GRIFFIN FOOTNOTE 20; ” Incredibly, after explaining how precisely explosives must be set to ensure that a building comes straight down, Loizeaux said that upon seeing the fires in the Twin Towers, he knew that the towers were
Wiley,
I was going to recommend Helen Caldicott for furver reading on DU when i re-read and saw your first quote was from her !! I have her first book , 1979 , and she hasn’t stopped since.
“Nil illegitimis carborundum”—dog latin for ” Don’t let the bastards grind you down” ! Of course this stuff will, momentarily, but only that. Ditzy-nervous-sad- morbidity happens to most of us from time to time.
A small google led me to stuff on various Nato ministries of defence getting uptight on “their” groundtroops being affected by DU after that set-up invasion of Kosovo. Will have a re-look and save some before it goes down the memory-hole. Felicity Arbuthnot only appears in the marginal sites, I think, but her reporting has the ring of truth.
Rabbit
the 24SERIES plus political ads starting to look really like TIA / Full Spectrum Dominance. I do hope 95% of Oz Will fall off couches when it happens, but ... .we’ll see.
Donn de Grand Pre a mystery horse. Checking ! (‘Donde Grande—Natty—get the name right ! )
Help from a Higher Power. As one of Oliver Cromwell’s generals is supposed to have said ; ” PRAY TO GOD, AND KEEP YOUR FUCKING GUNPOWDER DRY, YOU ‘ORRIBLE EXCUSES FOR SOLDIERS, YOU ! “.
For me that means saving stuff I saw online, then saving again to cd’s . And then putting on my old clunker that is not ‘connected’.
Must go ! Got some trolltrawling and shillslapping on the highlytopsecret agenda.
The Witch said:
“Tell you what, Nat. Make this a challenge for us. Instead of one or more of us going around looking up information for you to ignore, why don
NAT the recidivist non - answerer. Asked you a simple polite question twice. Your non-answer to me seems to be that since all sources of information are unreliable, none should be sourced unless YOU, in your wisdom should choose so to demand.
I’d love to know which demo experts thought that the WTC collapses didn’t resemble demolitions. Hadn’t come across that angle before, anywhere. Looked pretty neat from here.
Reckon you may be right on the “removal” angle. If griffin is wrong on that, it is a very small part of what he wrote.
Your last para . Did CDI not clear up after Murrah ?
My favourite of the “Muhammed cartoons” is
STOP, STOP, We"ve run out of virgins.
Mine too. The most offensive to be reprinted were not from the Jyllands Posten. Jones has a good analysis of it.
Helping the Neo-con agenda
Did some one hear the Bat flap by? Rabbit thought he heard a high pitched squeaking and a smell of blood…..................the rabbit looks…..................^^............................. but sees no Bat.
The rabbit sees no bats…..................none at all.
I heard the bat flap. She appears to want to play my game and she is asking questions. I’m tired, need to wash my hair, brush my teeth, set my alarm. That’s all so compelling. Nat will have to wait until tomorrow night or Wednesday. I’ll get prepared and stock up on the Cheez Whiz.
Thanks for making me laugh Rabbit and frog and Nat—-in your own batty little funny way…
The Frog is really very nice and interesting isn’t he Wiley?
Rabbit always had a soft spot for frogs. Married one once.
Pity the French and the occassional other barbarians eat frogs. Mrs Rabbit once ate some frogs just to shock Rabbit. He has never completely forgiven her and she knows it.
Bats are amusing. A few times they came inside our house when we were on the farm One came into the house and lived a few days, flapping about at nights and curled up, upside down in a corner under a beam all day.
Finally the cat caught it and ate it.
frog was a misnomer nom de guerre to catch hardass froghating yanks of the nuke-em-all variety ; failed here !
Globalised deepfrozen froglegs from China now in supermarkets here, but I only tried them a bit 25yrs ago, not a staple.
rabbit I’m reading John taylor Gatto with delight !! (wiley knows already)
I remember my shudders before sending my kids to skool, knowing that their creativity was going to be stunted by that prisonfarmfactory ; My then frogwife thought I was a bit nuts. Luckily palliative actions at home, such as no TV and books and bikes and trees and talk helped them to get by . Will remind the one who is now a teecher how she was bored to scream at 12, suggested some survival philosophies .
A goodfriend skoolinspector has arrived/ is arriving ?, at similar conclusions to JTG, .so not bored here out in the sticks.
I often have flittery bats at twilight, jinking all over the place, divebombing, just like our dear Natty. There may be some in a hole just above my bed, do bats actually squeak or is it all hypersonic ?
JTG makes a healthy change, but/and is highly complementary to what we strive to discuss here. I used to teach a bit, but the powerstructure bored me. Like 911, get them to learn things for themselves ?
If people don’t spend the time, fair game to say “Sorry, my dear, but if you ain’t looked, and thunk, how do you Know ‘xyz’ ? “
“NAT the recidivist non - answerer. Asked you a simple polite question twice. Your non-answer to me seems to be that since all sources of information are unreliable, none should be sourced unless YOU, in your wisdom should choose so to demand.”
I don’t why you would think that I think that all sources of information are unreliable. However, I have given specific reasons why certain sources that I’ve criticized are worthy of such. I’ve pointed out instances of the deliberate manufacturing of an opinion by way of selective quoting.
Sorry, Frog. I didn’t mean to be impolite in not giving you my source, but I couldn’t help but use the simple fact that you were curious in order to illustrate that indeed the quality of sources might matter. I don’t necessarily think that you don’t understand this, but Rabbit and many others in the “truth” movement don’t seem to. I think it matters that Prof. Jones cites “American Free Press” for a few selective sentences uttered by Loizeaux that serves to imply something about his thinking that is not true. “American Free Press” has an agenda that necessitates the re-write/ignoring of history and the kinds of cherry-picking that served Jones’ purposes.
My source for the quotes was an interview in “New Scientist Magazine.”
“Baltimore blasters”
24 July 2004
Liz Else
Magazine issue 2457
You can pay the small fee in order to access the entire interview, but my previously posted excerpt accurately illustrated his mindset about the collapses. “New Scientist” appears to be a fairly benign collection of science news and views, but you’re free to investigate it. The important thing in my mind is that this is a complete interview. Of course the only way to confirm that for sure would be to ask Loizeaux.
Preview
“I
Once again, Nat, your accusations of cherry-picking do not stand up to close examination. Where does Jones quote of Loizeaux’s statement on how he would go about taking down the towers imply that Loizeaux’s opinion is that they were taken down in such a way? The inference is entirely of your own imagining, and totally unwarranted. The same flawed reasoning you have used repeatedly in reference to Fireman Bill. You really need a class in basic logical reasoning, Nat.
Well to be accurate, most bats Rabbit has seen don’t make any “human” audible sound, except scratching around in the tree bark if that counts.
We do have Flying Foxes, and Fruit Bats, which are quite large and they sometimes make a small squeaky noise. But mostly even when thousands of them fly overhead of an evening as they do on their daily migration out from the caves and gullies where they hang out during the day, they are eerily silent.
The same cannot be said of Vampire Bats, the Possessed kind, which having once been human can still communicate using the language. The undead nature of such creatures means that they can be quite ancient and thus their language and comprehension skills oftentend to be stilted.
As it happens the Rabbit deliberately salted his post with the claim of half the returning vet’s babies being born with deformities. The figure is high but actually I couldn’t recall the exact detail and didn’t want to spoil a good rant, with the added spice of being able to select the ground for a Bat wacking.
Also the simplified description of the actual radioactive portion of the DU horror. Wiley, who knows what she is talking about, just as many you have argued with since your apparent first contact with the subject four months ago, posted some interesting details Rabbit had not come across before.
Especially the NASTY business of some of the DU obviously being SPENT FUEL from Nuclear Power Generation.
The Neptunium 235 explains to the informed, the rapidity of onset of many of the cancers and other debilitations which are the result of exposure to the DU killing fields.
A half life of 404 days. WHOA…...that is to be compared with billions of years for the more comon U237. The difference is how fast it emits that radiation. For the Satans seed, Neptunium 235 it would be like class 1 laser light in the eyeball compared to watching a single candle flame from a meter away in darkness, which is all U237 would be.
Rabbit shall be back presently with a nice little Gift for the Bat., regarding the actual figures of baby deformities and maybe a slide show of some of those deformities, which she has earned before. She is excited about the figure Rabbit suggested and she may not be dissapointed yet, we shall see. But you can feel good at least that such a figure is certainly destined to be the norm for people in Iraq within a year or so, if it isn’t already.
It’s the actual amount, the precise figure of death and destruction Natty is always so interested in, rather than any direct discussion of morality versus reality. It is in the actual figures, the depictions of carnage that she is able to engage her mind and she will haggle endlessly about a hundred dead babies here or there, as if deliberately causing the deaths of a few thousand more or less babies and innocents is the difference between moral rectitude and base evil.
She can relate to the blood and death, it is what she seeks, but discussions of morality can only be had in a vacuum.
Natalie first came to us, on a thread which was based upon one story of one US marine who had returnmed home from Iraq only to father a child who was born with the classic DU deformities. Just to get that into perspective. She denied that was true then, when she first “met” the subject of DU apparently.
She did this by attacking the author of the article, the scientists involved and the credibility of the marine. The medical evidence was called into question as being fabricated….on and on. She did this as well as denied thousands more references on similar grounds and means for months.
Nat is a Bat that glows in the dark.
Stick her on a shiny pole and plant her in the park.
All the drunks and junkies can use the light to see.
and on the pole around her feet, the bums can have a pee.
The best is while they’re standing there basking in her gaze.
These dregs and begs can get a dose of deadly gamma rays.
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