Page 1 of 1 pages
A rather stupid article, it did not evaluate any of the charges to estimate their validity. It was typical right wing (liberal) propaganda.
And yes the left is always fractured, nothing new there but it doesn’t mean that Mr. Obrador didn’t win legitimately.
Today there was a tremendous rally in Mexico city and Obrador called for the beginnings of a revolution, something Mexico desperately needs.
Too bad revolution upsets right wing liberals.
Posted by Spinoza750 on Aug 1, 2006 at 12:23 AM
The kind of revolution Mexico needs is not the kind of “revolution” that Lopez Obrador is carrying out. This man, far from being a lefty, is absolutely crazy, obsessed with the idea of reaching the presidency no matter the means.
There is an absolut lack of coherence in his speech since he is calling the people to disobey the same laws he issued as a the major of Mexico City! I mean, how can someone be coherent by doing this?
Denise Dresser, quoted in this article, yesterday accepted that she made a mistake by giving her vote to Lopez Obrador, who know believes he is the owner of Mexico City’s most important avenue, the “Paseo de la Reforma” and has taken the city as a hostage.
He is calling to a “social resistance”, but this is nothing but a mask for his autoritarian behavior and of the fact that Mexico City’s government is absolutely weak and coward (but well, no wonder, since it depends of the same political party as LO, so it really -and only- serves him.)
I am not from the right-wing, but I think that first of all, anyone who pretends to rule our nation must be coherent, respectful and mentally healthy, and this is not Mr. LO.
Posted by Diaz on Aug 1, 2006 at 11:29 AM
OOPs another right winger falling out of the closet and more worried about traffic than social justice or honest elections. He is not even asking that all the votes be counted just the ones in the boxes. There is little doubt that he really won the election. What is refreshing is that he is standing up for his rights. Not like the idiot Gore. The dull witted Harvard graduate claimed victory too soon.
Posted by Spinoza750 on Aug 1, 2006 at 11:58 AM
This man, far from being a lefty
Yea, he is a social democrat which is far from being a lefty but it is a very big improvement over the PAN.
Posted by Spinoza750 on Aug 1, 2006 at 12:00 PM
I do not care to be called a right-winger or whatever, simply things are happening this way in Mexico.
Do not forget that the Federal Electoral Court will decide that of the recount for votes. And if that happens, there was at least one supporter of each party in every box office counting the votes too, so how could thousands of LO’s supporters were cheated there? They cheated themselves?
If you really could understand the concept of social justice, you could see all that is lost by this kind of autoritarian behaviors, thousands of people can’t reach their jobs, can’t do their daily living because of this, thousands of employers are not having the needed income to sustain their business and their employees.
Social justice is done by work and by respect to the laws, not by the words of a “messianic leader”.
Why LO doesn’t calls this election a fraud in all those places where his party won seats for Federal Congress?
Maybe I am a right-winger, but at least I am in my office working, working for me and for my nation, not there in Reforma Avenue, pissing the gardens, obtaining food from the taxpayers, stoping a city.
There is no moral sustain in a protest like this one.
Posted by Diaz on Aug 1, 2006 at 1:32 PM
Read this article, it is much fairer. The evidence is increasing that Obrador probably won by a reasonable number
http://www.alternet.org/story/39763/
Question, why is it that so called liberals are more concerned about fair play for conservatives then for people to the left of them? I am not refering to this case alone but in general—-liberals want to sell out in most cases. Why do they believe that conservatives are better then , have a higher moral ground then leftists? Why are they so resentful and fearful of people agitating in the street?
Now liberals claim they are the 1. guardians of civil liberties 2. are champions of the poor and want to see more equality and fair play in politics but they most always rationalize there position away. WHY?
Orbrador did win and is going to win or there will be violence, no doubt about it. People are getting fed up with liberals.
Posted by Spinoza750 on Aug 2, 2006 at 8:16 AM
Posted by Diaz on Aug 2, 2006 at 9:29 AM
Mr. Diaz, there is no text for your last post.
Posted by Spinoza750 on Aug 2, 2006 at 10:35 AM
Mitch Cohen points out that the results of the Mexican vote/revolution will have an impact on the USA polity as it is widely believed that elections elections here were stolen by the right. In fact it is the view of the left that the right had planned a world wide coup by electoral fraud. The complete article would not fit and I recommend you go to the url for the complete article.
Today’s commentary:
http://www.zmag.org/sustainers/content/2006-08/01cohen.cfm
==================================
ZNet Commentary
Mexico Rising: Follow the Yellow Brick Road August 01, 2006
By Mitchel Cohen
(Mexico City—July 30, 2006) The sea of yellow swept through the veins of Mexico City en route to the Zocalo on Sunday, the platelets returning to the heart. Yellow for clean elections; amarillo for democracy, as manifest in the candidacy of Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador who believes that his populist electoral victory in the presidential election three weeks ago was stolen from him and the working class and poor of Mexico who voted for him.
Unlike John Kerry, Obrador—the mayor of Mexico City—did not disappoint the perhaps 2 million people who completely filled the Zocalo and avenues in every direction for block after block after block. He has presented evidence of fraud at 70,000 polling places to the Supreme Court. And, as his voice echoed from loudspeakers everywhere, he called on his supporters to remain in the Zocalo (after apologizing to the thousands of street vendors who would be inconvenienced by the occupation), setting up dozens of large white tents—one for each Mexican state—for the vigil to use to organize itself and expand.
It was impossible to get to the giant central square (zocalo) until long after the rally had ended and the round-the-clock vigil had commenced with cultural festivities. Three members of the Brooklyn Greens—myself, Cathryn Swan, and Robert Gold—along with a grouping of Mexican comrades who helped with the translation, found a shady corner a few blocks away and listened to the crowd’s cheers as Obrador announced the occupation of the central square. (Being mayor certainly helps here in Mexico City, as the police were all smiles and supportive of the protests despite the negative media barrage that batters Obrador and his working class base on a daily basis.)
Earlier, we inched our way down Avenida Juarez, where artists had hung dozens of dramatic paintings and historic quotations about the need for democracy. A few days ago, right wing vandals slashed a number of the artworks, each around 12 feet wide. When the artists returned to repair them, they found that hundreds of people had already shown up to defend the art and people from the neighborhoods had carefully stitched each tattered canvas back together, rendering them even more dramatic.
While the amarillo waves washed down the streets, many focused not on Obrador himself but on the need for free elections, real democracy, an end to the corruption of all of the institutional political parties. Obrador has become the symbol of that movement, that hope. Not that he will be able to solve the momentous problems Mexico faces, particularly in the face of International Monetary Fund and U.S. economic pressures (which are intense). But, they feel that at least Obrador is honest and will clean house.
[ ]
A revolution is brewing in Mexico, one that for now is non-violent, powerful, and visible everywhere. Can the movement be co-opted? Will Obrador betray his base?
The Zapatistas understand that the revolution proceeds on many fronts. As of this Sunday, the revolution has taken a giant step forward. What will happen tomorrow is anyone’s guess. But, for now, these are very exciting times, and the hopes of a huge swath of humanity rides on the ability of the Mexican people to reclaim liberty, not only for themselves but for the rest of us as well.
Mitchel Cohen
(writing from Mexico City)
Brooklyn Greens / Green Party
Posted by Spinoza750 on Aug 2, 2006 at 10:44 AM
Hello Mr. Spinoza.
I think Mr. Cohen’s article clearly reflects that he does not really know the way Mexican politics works.
First, LO is not the mayor, he declined in order to be a candidate for the presidency (although as everybody knows, he still holds the authority since Mr. Encinas is just a marionette.)
Those rallies are not truly filled with supporters. This people were not there because of them, I mean, the truth is that the expenses are charged to others (of course, the taxpayers.) Many people attends to this events since they have free transportation, food and other resources, the party is paying for this. And of course, this reminds me of the old practices of the “Partido Revolucionario Institucional”. But well, going back to the other point, finally the taxpayers are paying for this since the Federal Electoral Institute supplies the parties of the necessary money to do their activities, and it is us, the taxpayers, who supply via-taxes this money.
If you consider that Mexico City is under PRD’s rule, you can imagine that enormous bureaucracy. As in the old days of the PRI, many employees of the government are obligated to attend these events even if they do not want to. The same happens with the unions that are close to LO, their members should attend these events as an obligation.
So never fantasize that all the people in these meetings are true supporters and this applies to all the parties as well, it is maybe one of the traditional ways of making politics in Mexico, so no never trust that much the numbers.
It is absolutely clear that Mr. Cohen does not know anything about the electoral system in Mexico, since the supposed evidence of the fraud were not presented to the Supreme Court, but to the Federal Electoral Court.
What if LO apologizes with the street vendors? First, most of those street vendors are not legally established in Mexico City’s downtown. Apologizes with the illegal vendors? “Sorry, you will not be able to evade the taxes for a while?” Anyways, an apologize? How can someone apologize for taking the others the right to work, to search for a living? I mean, who is going to sustain the in the meanwhile? Who is going to pay their bills?
Mr. Cohen is absolutely wrong by calling that this is a “non-violent” thing. Of course there is violence and it is reflected in many ways. Maybe he thinks that violence only involves blood-spilling. When you take others freedom under your control, when you not allow normal citizens to enter their offices, their works… When you threat, when you are creating fear, when you feed discord between the social classes, between X and Y and you ask X to not accept Y because he is not like you, aren’t you violent???
Mr. Cohen surely does not know anything about what he is trying to write about.
Anyways, that is the risk of writing about foreign issues. Your perspective will be enormously fed by your sources of information and it is clear that Mr. Cohen has not reached the best ones.
It is been a pleasure to read you Mr. Spinoza.
Posted by Diaz on Aug 3, 2006 at 9:55 AM
With all due respect to Mr. Diaz, my sources were my own eyes in Mexico City. Despite one or two very minor errors (such as the name of the institution to which the electoral complaints were submitted, as Mr. Diaz correctly points out), far from not “knowing anything about what he is trying to write about” it appears that my observations made almost 4 weeks ago were right on target.
One of the points I made in the article was the difference between the way Obrador has publicly challenged the election “results” and mobilized the populace vs. Gore’s and Kerry’s cave-in to the Rove machine in the U.S. One can agree or disagree with Obrador’s methods—and it seems to me that they have been remarkably peaceful to date despite Mr. Diaz’s assertions—but the mobilization of Mexico’s citizenry in three separate radical currents (Mexico City, Oaxaca and Chiapas) is pushing the entire country to an anti-neoliberal perspective, while the exact opposite occurred in the U.S. because of the failure of the Democratic Party to mobilize its base to contest the stolen elections here.
Mitchel Cohen
back in Brooklyn, NY
Posted by Mitchel Cohen on Aug 30, 2006 at 12:19 AM
Mr. Cohen, it is good to see you here.
By these times, the Federal Electoral Court has declared Calderon as elected president and so many things have happened in the meanwhile.
First, I am curious by the way you are trying to find similarities between the US last presidential elections; do you really consider that there is a basis for this? There is no similarity or at least a deep one between the PRD and the opposition to the ruling party and ideologies in the US. The truth is that most of the PRD
Posted by Diaz on Sep 5, 2006 at 7:16 PM
The following is a useful (good) discussion of the election/revolutionary situation in Mexico.
http://revcom.us/a/060/mexico-volcano-en.html
Basically the election was 50/50 with the powers that be manipulating the election so that the right winger would win. It is about time that people on the left speak up and not always acquiesce to their “betters”. Leftists really do have an inferiority complex and somehow always think that somehow the right is justified in taking power. This is especially true of those disgusting people called liberals.
Posted by Spinoza750 on Sep 5, 2006 at 10:59 PM
I just reread the article by Lutton and I do have to say she is truly the disgusting type of liberal/right winger I truly hate. There are certain liberals you just want to bash in their teeth. Do others get that visceral reaction?
Posted by Spinoza750 on Sep 5, 2006 at 11:07 PM
Hello Mr. Spinoza,
Not al leftists have that inferiority complex, indeed, PRD has won a lot of places too (states, important cities, in the federal congress.) Why Marcelo Ebrard is not celebrating his triumph in Mexico City? Maybe because if he did, this could mean to recognize the efectiveness of the Federal Electoral Institution and the Federal Electoral Court, something he can’t do since the argument of his colleague AMLO is quite the opposite.
Something that can be related to this is that AMLO’s strategy is that of a martyr, as if everyone was causing him pain, as if everyone is an enemy. By the way, why a politician should be surprised of having them?
Maybe due to social and even religious issues, Mexicans have a deep love with feelings and attitudes such as guilt, martyrdom, and leftists are not the exception.
Best regards!
-edm-
Posted by Diaz on Sep 6, 2006 at 1:36 PM
Mr. Diaz,
when an election is 50/50 it means there is no winner. Calderon did not win. The numbers were in the “margin of counting errors” and the Pan people had done some illegal maneuvers . I have read that most Mexicans (polled) believe ALMO won so why should he concede?
Posted by Spinoza750 on Sep 6, 2006 at 2:59 PM
By the Way did you read this article? Are there very many angry Mexicans as is argued?
http://revcom.us/a/060/mexico-volcano-en.html
Posted by Spinoza750 on Sep 6, 2006 at 3:03 PM
By the way did you read this article? Do many Mexicans agree with privatizing oil and gas?
http://revcom.us/a/060/mexico-volcano-en.html
Posted by Spinoza750 on Sep 6, 2006 at 3:06 PM
Page 1 of 1 pages
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Reader Comments
A rather stupid article, it did not evaluate any of the charges to estimate their validity. It was typical right wing (liberal) propaganda.
And yes the left is always fractured, nothing new there but it doesn’t mean that Mr. Obrador didn’t win legitimately.
Today there was a tremendous rally in Mexico city and Obrador called for the beginnings of a revolution, something Mexico desperately needs.
Too bad revolution upsets right wing liberals.
The kind of revolution Mexico needs is not the kind of “revolution” that Lopez Obrador is carrying out. This man, far from being a lefty, is absolutely crazy, obsessed with the idea of reaching the presidency no matter the means.
There is an absolut lack of coherence in his speech since he is calling the people to disobey the same laws he issued as a the major of Mexico City! I mean, how can someone be coherent by doing this?
Denise Dresser, quoted in this article, yesterday accepted that she made a mistake by giving her vote to Lopez Obrador, who know believes he is the owner of Mexico City’s most important avenue, the “Paseo de la Reforma” and has taken the city as a hostage.
He is calling to a “social resistance”, but this is nothing but a mask for his autoritarian behavior and of the fact that Mexico City’s government is absolutely weak and coward (but well, no wonder, since it depends of the same political party as LO, so it really -and only- serves him.)
I am not from the right-wing, but I think that first of all, anyone who pretends to rule our nation must be coherent, respectful and mentally healthy, and this is not Mr. LO.
OOPs another right winger falling out of the closet and more worried about traffic than social justice or honest elections. He is not even asking that all the votes be counted just the ones in the boxes. There is little doubt that he really won the election. What is refreshing is that he is standing up for his rights. Not like the idiot Gore. The dull witted Harvard graduate claimed victory too soon.
This man, far from being a lefty
Yea, he is a social democrat which is far from being a lefty but it is a very big improvement over the PAN.
I do not care to be called a right-winger or whatever, simply things are happening this way in Mexico.
Do not forget that the Federal Electoral Court will decide that of the recount for votes. And if that happens, there was at least one supporter of each party in every box office counting the votes too, so how could thousands of LO’s supporters were cheated there? They cheated themselves?
If you really could understand the concept of social justice, you could see all that is lost by this kind of autoritarian behaviors, thousands of people can’t reach their jobs, can’t do their daily living because of this, thousands of employers are not having the needed income to sustain their business and their employees.
Social justice is done by work and by respect to the laws, not by the words of a “messianic leader”.
Why LO doesn’t calls this election a fraud in all those places where his party won seats for Federal Congress?
Maybe I am a right-winger, but at least I am in my office working, working for me and for my nation, not there in Reforma Avenue, pissing the gardens, obtaining food from the taxpayers, stoping a city.
There is no moral sustain in a protest like this one.
Read this article, it is much fairer. The evidence is increasing that Obrador probably won by a reasonable number
http://www.alternet.org/story/39763/
Question, why is it that so called liberals are more concerned about fair play for conservatives then for people to the left of them? I am not refering to this case alone but in general—-liberals want to sell out in most cases. Why do they believe that conservatives are better then , have a higher moral ground then leftists? Why are they so resentful and fearful of people agitating in the street?
Now liberals claim they are the 1. guardians of civil liberties 2. are champions of the poor and want to see more equality and fair play in politics but they most always rationalize there position away. WHY?
Orbrador did win and is going to win or there will be violence, no doubt about it. People are getting fed up with liberals.
Mr. Diaz, there is no text for your last post.
Mitch Cohen points out that the results of the Mexican vote/revolution will have an impact on the USA polity as it is widely believed that elections elections here were stolen by the right. In fact it is the view of the left that the right had planned a world wide coup by electoral fraud. The complete article would not fit and I recommend you go to the url for the complete article.
Today’s commentary:
http://www.zmag.org/sustainers/content/2006-08/01cohen.cfm
==================================
ZNet Commentary
Mexico Rising: Follow the Yellow Brick Road August 01, 2006
By Mitchel Cohen
(Mexico City—July 30, 2006) The sea of yellow swept through the veins of Mexico City en route to the Zocalo on Sunday, the platelets returning to the heart. Yellow for clean elections; amarillo for democracy, as manifest in the candidacy of Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador who believes that his populist electoral victory in the presidential election three weeks ago was stolen from him and the working class and poor of Mexico who voted for him.
Unlike John Kerry, Obrador—the mayor of Mexico City—did not disappoint the perhaps 2 million people who completely filled the Zocalo and avenues in every direction for block after block after block. He has presented evidence of fraud at 70,000 polling places to the Supreme Court. And, as his voice echoed from loudspeakers everywhere, he called on his supporters to remain in the Zocalo (after apologizing to the thousands of street vendors who would be inconvenienced by the occupation), setting up dozens of large white tents—one for each Mexican state—for the vigil to use to organize itself and expand.
It was impossible to get to the giant central square (zocalo) until long after the rally had ended and the round-the-clock vigil had commenced with cultural festivities. Three members of the Brooklyn Greens—myself, Cathryn Swan, and Robert Gold—along with a grouping of Mexican comrades who helped with the translation, found a shady corner a few blocks away and listened to the crowd’s cheers as Obrador announced the occupation of the central square. (Being mayor certainly helps here in Mexico City, as the police were all smiles and supportive of the protests despite the negative media barrage that batters Obrador and his working class base on a daily basis.)
Earlier, we inched our way down Avenida Juarez, where artists had hung dozens of dramatic paintings and historic quotations about the need for democracy. A few days ago, right wing vandals slashed a number of the artworks, each around 12 feet wide. When the artists returned to repair them, they found that hundreds of people had already shown up to defend the art and people from the neighborhoods had carefully stitched each tattered canvas back together, rendering them even more dramatic.
While the amarillo waves washed down the streets, many focused not on Obrador himself but on the need for free elections, real democracy, an end to the corruption of all of the institutional political parties. Obrador has become the symbol of that movement, that hope. Not that he will be able to solve the momentous problems Mexico faces, particularly in the face of International Monetary Fund and U.S. economic pressures (which are intense). But, they feel that at least Obrador is honest and will clean house.
[ ]
A revolution is brewing in Mexico, one that for now is non-violent, powerful, and visible everywhere. Can the movement be co-opted? Will Obrador betray his base?
The Zapatistas understand that the revolution proceeds on many fronts. As of this Sunday, the revolution has taken a giant step forward. What will happen tomorrow is anyone’s guess. But, for now, these are very exciting times, and the hopes of a huge swath of humanity rides on the ability of the Mexican people to reclaim liberty, not only for themselves but for the rest of us as well.
Mitchel Cohen
(writing from Mexico City)
Brooklyn Greens / Green Party
Hello Mr. Spinoza.
I think Mr. Cohen’s article clearly reflects that he does not really know the way Mexican politics works.
First, LO is not the mayor, he declined in order to be a candidate for the presidency (although as everybody knows, he still holds the authority since Mr. Encinas is just a marionette.)
Those rallies are not truly filled with supporters. This people were not there because of them, I mean, the truth is that the expenses are charged to others (of course, the taxpayers.) Many people attends to this events since they have free transportation, food and other resources, the party is paying for this. And of course, this reminds me of the old practices of the “Partido Revolucionario Institucional”. But well, going back to the other point, finally the taxpayers are paying for this since the Federal Electoral Institute supplies the parties of the necessary money to do their activities, and it is us, the taxpayers, who supply via-taxes this money.
If you consider that Mexico City is under PRD’s rule, you can imagine that enormous bureaucracy. As in the old days of the PRI, many employees of the government are obligated to attend these events even if they do not want to. The same happens with the unions that are close to LO, their members should attend these events as an obligation.
So never fantasize that all the people in these meetings are true supporters and this applies to all the parties as well, it is maybe one of the traditional ways of making politics in Mexico, so no never trust that much the numbers.
It is absolutely clear that Mr. Cohen does not know anything about the electoral system in Mexico, since the supposed evidence of the fraud were not presented to the Supreme Court, but to the Federal Electoral Court.
What if LO apologizes with the street vendors? First, most of those street vendors are not legally established in Mexico City’s downtown. Apologizes with the illegal vendors? “Sorry, you will not be able to evade the taxes for a while?” Anyways, an apologize? How can someone apologize for taking the others the right to work, to search for a living? I mean, who is going to sustain the in the meanwhile? Who is going to pay their bills?
Mr. Cohen is absolutely wrong by calling that this is a “non-violent” thing. Of course there is violence and it is reflected in many ways. Maybe he thinks that violence only involves blood-spilling. When you take others freedom under your control, when you not allow normal citizens to enter their offices, their works… When you threat, when you are creating fear, when you feed discord between the social classes, between X and Y and you ask X to not accept Y because he is not like you, aren’t you violent???
Mr. Cohen surely does not know anything about what he is trying to write about.
Anyways, that is the risk of writing about foreign issues. Your perspective will be enormously fed by your sources of information and it is clear that Mr. Cohen has not reached the best ones.
It is been a pleasure to read you Mr. Spinoza.
With all due respect to Mr. Diaz, my sources were my own eyes in Mexico City. Despite one or two very minor errors (such as the name of the institution to which the electoral complaints were submitted, as Mr. Diaz correctly points out), far from not “knowing anything about what he is trying to write about” it appears that my observations made almost 4 weeks ago were right on target.
One of the points I made in the article was the difference between the way Obrador has publicly challenged the election “results” and mobilized the populace vs. Gore’s and Kerry’s cave-in to the Rove machine in the U.S. One can agree or disagree with Obrador’s methods—and it seems to me that they have been remarkably peaceful to date despite Mr. Diaz’s assertions—but the mobilization of Mexico’s citizenry in three separate radical currents (Mexico City, Oaxaca and Chiapas) is pushing the entire country to an anti-neoliberal perspective, while the exact opposite occurred in the U.S. because of the failure of the Democratic Party to mobilize its base to contest the stolen elections here.
Mitchel Cohen
back in Brooklyn, NY
Mr. Cohen, it is good to see you here.
By these times, the Federal Electoral Court has declared Calderon as elected president and so many things have happened in the meanwhile.
First, I am curious by the way you are trying to find similarities between the US last presidential elections; do you really consider that there is a basis for this? There is no similarity or at least a deep one between the PRD and the opposition to the ruling party and ideologies in the US. The truth is that most of the PRD
The following is a useful (good) discussion of the election/revolutionary situation in Mexico.
http://revcom.us/a/060/mexico-volcano-en.html
Basically the election was 50/50 with the powers that be manipulating the election so that the right winger would win. It is about time that people on the left speak up and not always acquiesce to their “betters”. Leftists really do have an inferiority complex and somehow always think that somehow the right is justified in taking power. This is especially true of those disgusting people called liberals.
I just reread the article by Lutton and I do have to say she is truly the disgusting type of liberal/right winger I truly hate. There are certain liberals you just want to bash in their teeth. Do others get that visceral reaction?
Hello Mr. Spinoza,
Not al leftists have that inferiority complex, indeed, PRD has won a lot of places too (states, important cities, in the federal congress.) Why Marcelo Ebrard is not celebrating his triumph in Mexico City? Maybe because if he did, this could mean to recognize the efectiveness of the Federal Electoral Institution and the Federal Electoral Court, something he can’t do since the argument of his colleague AMLO is quite the opposite.
Something that can be related to this is that AMLO’s strategy is that of a martyr, as if everyone was causing him pain, as if everyone is an enemy. By the way, why a politician should be surprised of having them?
Maybe due to social and even religious issues, Mexicans have a deep love with feelings and attitudes such as guilt, martyrdom, and leftists are not the exception.
Best regards!
-edm-
Mr. Diaz,
when an election is 50/50 it means there is no winner. Calderon did not win. The numbers were in the “margin of counting errors” and the Pan people had done some illegal maneuvers . I have read that most Mexicans (polled) believe ALMO won so why should he concede?
By the Way did you read this article? Are there very many angry Mexicans as is argued?
http://revcom.us/a/060/mexico-volcano-en.html
By the way did you read this article? Do many Mexicans agree with privatizing oil and gas?
http://revcom.us/a/060/mexico-volcano-en.html
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