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Reader Comments (126)Page 1 of 1 pagesI’d like to see more research on the estate. tax. Here in California any dump of a house can run 500K so many more people besides plutocrats can get hung up on estate taxes, etc.
There’s a certain smarmy inevitability in the author’s tone.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 18, 2006 at 6:26 PM What do you mean by ‘smarmy inevitability,’ other than the fact that you don’t like what the author has to say?
Posted by Brendan on Dec 18, 2006 at 7:29 PM Mike,
The Estate Tax is ONLY for the Rich. If you’re not a multi-millionaire don’t worry…or as we say in Chicago…fughettaboutitt!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 18, 2006 at 8:03 PM Guys, assertions aren’t proof. If you own more than an outhouse in the
Bay Area you might be technically a millionaire but your nowhere near
rich. Again, I need to see hard stats on whose affected by this, not someone’s glib reassurance.
As far as the author’s tone goes, it is smarmy but I never said that I
disagreed with his premise but needed moreinformation.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 19, 2006 at 12:05 AM Mike just google Estate Tax and you’ll get zillions of explainations. The state of California, since Proposition 13 in the late 1970s, has been notorious for real estate appreciation rates that are so high that they run so far ahead of the incomes of the owners that people can’t afford to live in a house or dispose of their property once they die. Also, estate means your total net worth not just a physical piece of land or real estate. There are also so many allowable deductions when calculating the tax. The IRS website assures us that only the richest 2% of all Americans today are effected. Even after the deductions the top rates have been drastically lowered. Mike, I’d shit a blue monkey if you owed anything at all were you to die today!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 19, 2006 at 10:20 PM About Prop 13 I give thanks for it every day. Right now my wife
and I pay 3K in property taxes for a small place with a larger yard.
If not for Prop 13 we’d be paying 10 or 20K a year in property taxes
and the “services” we get from the city of Oakland in return aren’t
worth shit on a good day. While we are not wealthy I don’t know
what we’d owe if one of us died.
But thanks for the google ref, I’ll look it up.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 20, 2006 at 12:51 AM Well, blondmike, perhaps the reason the services you get from Oakland aren’t worth shit is because you’re not paying 10 to 20K in property taxes! I understand the impetus behind Prop 13—a boom in housing costs like what we’ve seen in the last few years makes it look like, without Prop 13, the government would just get a “windfall.” But property values directly affect the cost to governments. Most of government spending doesn’t go to raw materials or energy, because they’re not making stuff. Most government spending goes to personnel. Personnel demand higher wages when the cost of housing goes up. If you don’t raise the wages, the people you get working for the government end up being the ones who don’t have anywhere else to go. The talented ones are going to find jobs in private industry, where the pay is better!
I work for the State of California, in higher education. In the last few years, the only people we can consider hiring in assistant professor positions are ones who already own homes in California, or maybe some other high-priced market. We can’t hire a genius right out of grad school or a post-doc in Kansas, because we’d have to admit that they’ll never own a house on the salary we can offer them. So the pool of people we can hire is small—we are not competitive.
Now, nobody really wants to weep about higher education, but the same dynamic is occurring at the kindergarten level. At the fire station. At the county traffic engineer’s office. No wonder the services aren’t worth shit! Nobody wants to be hired to do them, because it’s a virtual vow of poverty!
California will never have the stature it once had until Prop 13 is modified or struck down. You have wealth in your property. You can access that wealth through refinancing—or have you already refinanced to buy a new SUV? If people lived through the California boom in the 1970’s without Prop 13, maybe people would have realized that they need to plan for property appreciation; refinancing for taxes would be par for the course. Borrow $50,000 on the equity of your home and invest it, using the proceeds to offset increases in taxes.
I’ll admit I like paying taxes on my $400,000 home as if it were only worth $190,000. But it’s not fair; not fair to the community and not fair to people who are moving to California now.
Prop 13 is probably with us for the long term, but a lot could be done to ease the problems it causes. What if your property value was allowed to increase at 4% a year, rather than just 2%? You’d still be protected from sudden jumps in the housing market, but your obligations would increase at a rate somewhat closer to the real increase in your property values.
Posted by mschmidt on Dec 20, 2006 at 2:16 AM Now, for the main topic of the article: here’s an example of how we are like servants. I’m in higher education. In the last 15-20 years, the buzzword in higher education is “assessment.” Now, professors have been handing out grades since time immemorial, but “assessment” is different. Sort of. You can give 25% of your class As but now you have to prove to the state or the accrediting agency that they actually deserved those As. Sounds sensible, in some ways—who wants grade inflation to devalue a college degree? But I deeply suspect that’s not the real reason for the “assessment” trend—the real reason is that the anti-tax advocates resent having to pay for higher education. If the professors can’t prove their “effectiveness,” well, quit paying them! Never mind that a lot of the most valuable effects of higher education are hard to “prove” in a simple test.* Never mind that devoting more time to “assessment” takes away from the work of education. Just give us some assessment, or you’ll be disaccredited!
You’ll perhaps recognize that the same thing is happening in the lower grades, too, with the “No Child Left Untested” approach to education reform. Teachers and professors are now mere servants, mere waiters, of the rich taxpayers who fund the anti-tax crusades. How can we help you, sir? How can we prove to you we are worthy of educating your future servants? Please, sir, some of our students had learning disabilities, but we are willing to take the blame! Hit us, sir! Thank you, sir!
* I actually used to be a great fan of assessment as I am in a discipline, chemistry, which is pretty amenable to the use of standardized tests. But after 15 years, I’m feeling resentful when external reviewers suggest I spend an extra hour of my class time administering questions designed for two-semester courses of study to my students who only get one semester of the subject. Why should I spend the time seeing if students can “guess” the right answer to questions about subjects I haven’t covered? If I can see “assessment” degrading education in a discipline like chemistry, how much more must it trivialize something as broad and complex as history?
Posted by mschmidt on Dec 20, 2006 at 2:31 AM Excuse me, but on a great deal of empirical evidence I not only do
not see the workers in the Oakland City Govt getting better by getting
more but I see them as grossly overpaid. My wife who was recently
robbed with two guns at her head found out that the OPD was no
longer doing fingerprints and managed to get a big media stink
raised about it.
How dare you give me idiotic, gratuitous advice on what loans I
should take out so people like you can retain your tax paid position !
You exactly personify the mentality that led to Prop 13 and believe me
it will not be repealed. Black homeowners support it as much as
Asians, Latins and whites in Oakland. This tax is regressive and a
direct threat to most peoples’ most valuable possession, their homes.
If the public sector can’t cut it on the 70-80K STARTING salaries we
give to cops and all sorts of other lousy bureaucrats who sit on their
big fat behinds all day in places like Oakland City Gov, then their
“services” should be privatized. Where the hell people like you think
most can afford 10-20K in property taxes a year get your economics
from I’d like to know. Not from reality.
People should take out costly loans every year to pay taxes ???????
You are insane. No wonder the Right has been so successful that
even in Berzerkeley people are waking up and turning down tax increases. California is way over the top in bonded indebtedness
too. And no I don’t want my property tax increase rate doubled, it would be more money down the same stinky rat hole.
If YOU want to pay our taxes, we have no objection.
And by the way if Prop 13 were repealed California would be even less
housing affordable than it is now. Someone from Kansas wants to
pay 10-20K in property taxes ????????? Dream on.
California’s big welfare state bubble had to burst. People like you
shot down Reagan’s Prop 1 attempt to limit income taxes in 1973.
Prop 13 was badly needed.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 20, 2006 at 3:06 AM Please explain how a tax on wealth in the form of property is regressive.
Posted by mschmidt on Dec 20, 2006 at 3:10 AM Also, how will privatization improve efficiency? Privatization means less public oversight. Most people I know who have worked in both private and government settings say that there really isn’t much of a difference—people are incompetent all over. The stories of waste, mismanagement, laziness and stupidity are pretty much indistinguishable whether they come from government workers or employees of private firms. Enron was not a government agency! Tyco is not a government agency!
Posted by mschmidt on Dec 20, 2006 at 3:15 AM I recently discovered two different threads on the Internet that combined might shine more light and less heat on the subject.
The one here speaks most eloquently about the real disparity of wealth in this country, and how even the highest paid person who’s day is actually accomplishing something, is a serf compared to those just a few points above him. If you make more money than 99% of those poor sops below you, you still make less than 10% of the average of those above.
And now for something completely different… sort of… Chris Anderson has written and expanded on a bit of mathematics called a power curve and how it often shows up in economics, and differs a great deal from peoples assumptions about what that curve might look like.
He then looks at how the math works when you focus your marketing to the low but very long end of the curve, and adds a lot of math to deal with it.
Well his power curves are L-curves or vice versa and here he is with a set of math techniques to deal with it.
But instead of increasing the numbers at the lower end, and the kinds of things that cause drop offs, suddenly it is the drop offs in the number of poor people down that long tail that you want! And he has studied what kinds of things can affect that.
That whole prospect of putting those two Ideas together seems straight forward enough, and I think it can shed light on the discussion.
As a f’rinstance If housing prices are high, a person no matter the job needs more money per lifestyle than someone who lived where housing was inexpensive. So hiring a batch of those folk would take higher taxes than if they came with less need.
But holding the taxes fixed as all property increases in value, until the house is sold, doesn’t so much raise taxes as shift the burden heavily to new home buyers. If the burden were shared, the taxes could be lower because the long residents would be paying their full share.
For a given budget, the tax would be the same, regardless of house price inflation, presuming all neighborhoods went up in the same percentage points. and there by cost less than the same budget in a city where housing was more affordable.
Posted by FreeDem on Dec 20, 2006 at 5:26 AM Please visit renegadewaiter.wordpress.com for one waiter’s perspective.
Regards, Renegade Waiter
Posted by renegadewaiter on Dec 20, 2006 at 7:01 AM Yikes.
All you overburdened, underpaid, over-educated remnants of a recessive meritorious gentry make my poor, proletarian heart swell with sorrow. Time to break out the violins and play a mournful dirge to your shattered dreams of unrequited affluence.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 20, 2006 at 7:49 AM It’s regressive because it attacks a person’s home, the most sacred
possession all of us have. A progressive income tax can be punishing but normally you don’t lose your home if you can’t pay it. Under the property tax you do. Which is why in the most backward southern states
it is the main form of revenue along with the sales tax.
Enron was a corporation that thrived on government business because
it dealt with utilities all over the country. Normally private enterprise is
much more efficient and the reason they often can’t get rid of poorly
performing employees is federal laws. If your a white male, your gone.
If your female or black it takes an act of god to terminate you.
If government was really more efficient then the USSR would still be
here and we’d be long gone instead of vive-versa. Why is China trying
to privatize everything in sight if it makes no difference ?
On public oversight, have you ever tried to get some government agency
to adhere to the law ? Good luck !
Posted by blondemike on Dec 20, 2006 at 5:10 PM “All you overburdened, underpaid, over-educated remnants of a recessive meritorious gentry make my poor, proletarian heart swell with sorrow. Time to break out the violins and play a mournful dirge to your shattered dreams of unrequited affluence.”
The idea of unrequited affluence is an interesting one; if “unrequited love” is when you love someone, and they don’t love you back, is “unrequited affluence” when you’re wealthy, but you don’t get anything back for all your wealth? Well, that’s sort of the point of the article, isn’t it?
Based on what blondemike has written about his tax obligations with and without Prop 13, by my calculations, blondemike could well have $700,000 or more in home equity. But he can’t use it, because his home is sacred. How’s that for unrequited affluence? I suspect that, like many of us, it’s not so much the sacredness of the home as the sacredness of the job that keeps him from moving to another area where housing is cheaper. Give the people better social security (not just retirement, but health care, too) and people would be less worried about keeping the position they have now. I think that’s another aspect of what the article is talking about.
The fact that you included “over-educated” in your sympathies, Major Major, suggests that I am included in your condolences, and I thank you for them. Please don’t think, though, that I am complaining of being underpaid, as I was able to purchase a house in the nineties, and am now quite happily affluent. My point was rather that governments hiring talented workers for all positions (including the proletarian ones!) is hindered by taxation that’s not in line with housing costs.
Posted by mschmidt on Dec 20, 2006 at 6:24 PM I am sympathetic with the particular bind that property taxes put on homeowners in a rising market; after sleeping on the issue I do think it may be better to keep property-tax-limiting laws in place and focus on raising taxes on more liquid wealth. I’d hate to see the intriguing idea of raising taxes to make people happier lost in the discussion of the fairness of Prop 13.
Posted by mschmidt on Dec 20, 2006 at 6:33 PM One thing that my wife has long advocated is the equalization of school
tax monies which come from property taxes. This way the ghetto schools get the same funding as Piedmont or Montclair.
Might help.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 20, 2006 at 8:40 PM Not quite. It’s more like feeling entitled to the income to which you’ve become accustomed. If you need further instruction, consult any one of Suze Orman’s televised lectures. Anne Richards once compared George Bush to someone who was born on third base and thinks he hit a home run. Lots of other people got him to the plate, including the people who struck out.
I don’t own a million dollar dump in Oakland. My highest valued asset is a ten year old Toyota that’s slowly rusting out around me. But if you need to know the primary reason why Reagan and his conservative clan hijacked the government, just check out the comments on this thread, where the affluent academically inclined complain about the property taxes and their inability to hire good help.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 21, 2006 at 12:02 AM My Toyota is 16 years old. Major, stop your poor mouthing or I’m busting
you back down to PFC.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 21, 2006 at 12:12 AM Major Major, you don’t make your points very clear by lumping together as your opponents two people who disagree on almost everything.
And just look where we are—three people, none of us all that wealthy, arguing amongst ourselves while the super-rich look on and laugh, take their tax breaks and gouge us all one more time.
Posted by mschmidt on Dec 21, 2006 at 12:30 AM mschmidt, for once we agree. To be honest I get a headache trying
to figure out the Major’s wordsalads.
You are right about the super-rich.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 21, 2006 at 12:53 AM Hey, what can I say? I’m having another bad day at work, what with the recently passed referendum on secondhand smoke, and the holidays are typically depressing to begin with. I doubt that the rich even know that we exist, or care, much less waste their precious laughter at our trivial disagreements. And, Mike, you should know better than anyone else that the majority of the traffic on the net is just an excuse for people to vent their anger and frustration. You’ve done it so often yourself. I’m sorry your old lady got mugged. I hope she’s well and the two of you recover from the trauma. In the interim, try not to shoot yourself, or anyone else.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 21, 2006 at 5:08 AM From what I see of Teamsters and nurses, I think Americans especially want someone to plan for them. It’s a little like alcoholics who want someone to stop them from drinking.
This is the huge gulf seperating elitist liberal intellectuals from the rest of America. Somehow I manage to earn the money without any help from them and yet they feel inclined to legally rob me. And then have the balls to tell me I am happier.
What is the fascination with what people earn? If the ultra rich are not making money from selling your organs or tricking your wife out, whats your beef?
Posted by texasindependent on Dec 21, 2006 at 5:58 AM Ok, Major, no problem.
Tex, the ultra rich ARE stealing from their workers, their stockholders
and their consumers.
The election results demolished that tatty old “liberal elite” thesis,
the real rightwing elite got whipped out of office.
I’m missing your point about the teamsters and the nurses.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 21, 2006 at 6:13 PM The teamsters and nurses line was from the article. I don’t know how to put it in quotations.
What is ultra rich? Paper wealth or real wealth? Bill Gates around 60 billion net worth on paper. The vast bulk in Microsoft stock. If Micrsoft went belly up (we can all dream) Bill would still have a few billion but would be considerably poorer. Whereas someone like Buffet around 35 billion in real property and various corporations is truly living the capitalist dream. How is that stealing? Using the system to gain profit is not only legal but praiseworthy.
The Bushes (300 million) while rich are not even close to Soros at 6 billion. Soros founded the Quantum Fund which is a hedge fund to offshore money in foreign currency to avoid income taxes. Really slick fund too bad a commie dreamt it up. Pardon me a liberal.
If you believe that elections change the power structure of this country you are not the radical I thought you were. The power behind the scene is not changeable.
Posted by texasindependent on Dec 22, 2006 at 4:12 AM The ultra-rich are the people who get their butts kissed by people like you and me. “Good morning, Sir (or Madam). How may we kiss your ass today? And thank you for the tip.” A nation of waiters put out for their customers. Put out, output, productivity. It’s a gratifying experience all around, as all of us are simultaneously waiters and customers. And the “wealth” we create, well, figure it out for yourself.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 22, 2006 at 3:36 PM How do you KNOW that the power behind the scenes is not changeable, Tex ? Typical conservative accept things as they are slave mentality.
They steal from their workers who have a huge part in creating the wealth, they steal from the stockholders through vastly overinflated
salaries and they steal from consumers through higher prices.
The ONLY good Soros did was in politics, not his financial swindles.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 22, 2006 at 6:02 PM Blondemike
The power is international banking. Where do you think the “ultra rich” get money? The Federal Reserve is neither Federal nor a ‘reserve”. If you are curious as to who is pulling the strings behind the scenes check out http://www.freedomtofascism.com. Aaron Russo although a commie has pulled together some very compelling evidence about the Fed. Although worlds apart politically I agree one hundred percent with his stated goals.Stop the polarization of America
Stop the domination of the Democratic and Republican parties over our political system
Shut down the Federal Reserve system
Return America’s gold to Fort Knox and have it audited
Have Congress and the IRS, in a public forum, reveal the law that requires Americans to pay a direct, unapportioned tax on their labor.
Make computerized voting illegal in all 50 states
Keep the internet free and out of the control of large institutions
Rescind the law called the Real ID Act so Americans never have to carry a National ID Card
Make it illegal to implant RFID chips in human beings
Educate juries to the fact that they have the right to determine the law as well as the facts of a case
Educate juries to the fact that they are not obligated to follow the instructions of a judge
Stop Globalization because it is the path to a one world government
Protect our borders
Restore the environment
Put an end to the Patriot Act
Sign up millions of Americans so we can accomplish our objectives.Once you accept the idea that “politics” is the magicians assistant distracting you from what is really happening the rest is easy.
Posted by texasindependent on Dec 23, 2006 at 4:40 AM First of all there is no such thing as one world government and there never was. National states are actually strengthened by globalization which is something they helped bring about. Sovereignty has always been a myth. It’s all about the hyper-mobility of capital. Secondly, the gold standard is bullshit. It didn’t stop the great depression and prolonged it once it occurred. All experts across the spectrum from Milton Friedman to JM Keynes to Paul Sweezy agree on this point. Every country that abandoned its gold standard after 1929 saw an almost immediate pick up in economic expansion. This is simply because the gold standard doesn’t reflect the actual conditions in the economy and is monetarily to restrictive to allow expansion with its excessive concern about maintaining gold price parity at the expense of productivity which can be a more effective tool against inflationary pressures. Gold is an arbitrary measure of stability and can easily be manipulated by altering the control of the gold supply as has been attempted. The military draft is bullshit. The US should NOT be a superpower. The world would be a healthier, more peaceful place without US imperialism!! There is also better uses for almost half a trillion in public funds than an obnoxious military budget (universal health insurence?) Finally, we have labor shortages that require immigrants legal or illegal. Let’s not go to the expense to prevent something that’s actually good for the economy. As far as security is concerned let’s stop giving people a real reason to hate us in the first place. It goes with jettisoning imperialism in favor of a multi-polar world. Most of the rest of your agenda I would certainly favor.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 24, 2006 at 2:08 AM Tex, I actually agree with most of your platform ! I’m astonished, it’s a
great libertarian platform. I saw Russo interviewed in the The New
American (JBS) most of which I agreed with though the JBS still pushes
that “holocaust” bullshit. i’m anti-fascist and anti-national socialist
but unlike the stinky Stalinist Chicago cabbie I’m pro-truth wherever
it falls. Of course World Government’s a serious threat and it doesn’t
help with that crooked baboon Kofi Annan pushing that pro-Israel
State lying holohoax propaganda. All those pieces are tied in together,
see the ihr.org website.
I agree with Chicago on opposing the draft and US imperialism which
would never have progressed to the state it is in except for our totally
unnecssary involvements in WW1 & 2. Bad wars both. If we rectified
Versailles no war over Danzig and Bohemia, no WW2, no 55 million
dead. But hysterical British, Zionist and Communist nuts like the
demented cabbie from Chicago got us in it by screaming “auntey
semenite” at everyone who opposed it.
Thanks, Tex.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 24, 2006 at 10:54 PM “If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them (around the banks), will deprive the people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered.”
Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826)“The real danger is the gradual erosion of individual liberties through automation, integration, and interconnection of many small, separate record-keeping systems, each of which alone may seem innocuous, even benevolent, and wholly justifiable.”
U. S. Privacy Study Commission, 1977“It is the sacred principles enshrined in the UN Charter to which we will henceforth pledge our allegiance.”
George Herbert Walker Bush, Speech at the UN, February 1, 1992“Behind the ostensible government sits enthroned an invisible government owing no allegiance and acknowledging no responsibility to the people.”
Theodore Roosevelt“The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media.”
William Colby (Former CIA Director)“The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed, and thus clamorous to be led to safety, by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.”
H.L. Mencken“The real rulers in Washington are invisible and exercise power from behind the scenes.”
Justice Felix Frankfurter (1882-1965) U.S. Supreme Court JusticeTwo things only the people actually desire: bread and circuses.
–Juvenal (AD 60?-140?)
Wake up Cabdriver. Globalization has destroyed what remained of sovereignty. The UN is the mechanism, Climate change and terrorism the catalyst, and you are the tool being used to implement one world government. Not facism not communism but a scientific oligarchy. Technology has evolved to the point where privacy and personal liberties are a moot point. Big Brother is literally watching you.
Posted by texasindependent on Dec 26, 2006 at 2:00 AM Remember back in the early 70s when we were supposed to have been in a leisure society by now?
In addition to the proposals in this article, I like Robert Reich’s notion of a wealth tax.
After all, disparity of wealth is much more fundamental than disparity of income.
Posted by robert beal on Dec 26, 2006 at 4:36 AM Tex, you are spot on again. Chicago is a braindead old Stalinist turd.
Hopeless, forget him.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 26, 2006 at 5:50 PM Disparity of wealth is a natural condition of the inequality of mankind.
There is no reason it should be taxed because lesser achievers are
envious. If you have proof that it’s ill-gotten that’s another matter.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 26, 2006 at 7:14 PM Where are you on the political compass?
And speaking of taxes, does Scotland mean Taxland? Who named it?
Posted by barkless1 on Dec 26, 2006 at 8:31 PM Libertarian. Not familiar with the etymological origins of Scotland.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 26, 2006 at 9:27 PM BM
Libertarians are racists and exploiters. You are both with your holocaust denial and pro-capitalist inequality.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 26, 2006 at 11:44 PM Oh, brother, Comrade Chicago pipes up again.
Ok read Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand, Capitalism
by George Reisman, Human Action by Ludwig
Von Mises, Man, Economy and State by Murray
N. Rothbard, all Jews too.
I’m on my 19th reading of Atlas.
I would think you’d be HAPPY to find out that 4-5
million Jews you always thought were killed were
not. Unbelievable ! You are a self-hating Jew and
a racist. Shame on you.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 27, 2006 at 12:55 AM I would be happy if indeed it were true. Even modern demographics shows its true. In 1939, about 12 million Europeans were Jews and the world Jewish population stood at about 18 million. Today there are only about 12 million Jews in the world. Low birth rates I don’t think so especially since the US Jewish population went from 4.2 million in 1945 to just over 6 million by 1970. Today, because of low birth rates and high intermarriage rates the US Jewish population is closer to just over 5 million. There is another 5 million in Israel and another million or so in Russia. Still another million is scattered around the world. If the holocaust never occurred there would be over 20 million Jews in the world today. Perhaps more.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 27, 2006 at 1:02 AM What, so there should be no taxes? How is government going to raise money? No government? RIch people buy insurance, insurance companies provide free ride to the public, like Spinrad’s “Child of Fortune”?
Posted by barkless1 on Dec 27, 2006 at 3:00 AM I may not agree with cabdriver’s politics but he is well researched, intelligent, and offers lucid explanations for his neo communist proposals. If we can stop him from serving as a tool for the New World Order I have great hopes for him.
Posted by texasindependent on Dec 27, 2006 at 6:30 AM Chicago, that 12 million figure is flatly wrong and I have
given you references which prove my statement. There
are at least 18 million Jews living even today. Most of the
Jews in the USSR and eastern Poland (under Soviet control)
were never in the hands of the Germans.
It’s well known that those false figures that you mindlessly give are
manipulated by Jewish organizations precisely to preserve this hoax.
Again, check out Rassinier, Sanning, Butz, Rudolf and others.
Tex, Chicago’s intelligence is not evident on this issue.
Chicago, either have the guts to check out the sources that you
mindlessly defame or stick it up your ass. Makes no difference
to me.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 27, 2006 at 6:29 PM You have not proven your statements with facts and neither have the HR morons. The idea that millions of Jews are living in the old Soviet Union is false. Why would Stalin and Truman collude together on such a perposterous thing when they stood to gain nothing from it. A certain number of Jews escaped to the Soviet Union but very few. Less than a million. Your references never proved their baseless assertions they just made them and you being stupid and sick were happy to believe them. That is your choice. But it is wrong. If you knew what you were talking about you would volunteer evidence. But you don’t do this at all. You just keep harping on the same old discredited books. What is their proof. Mostly quotes from each other!! And fudged data. You’re a moron for believing them.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 27, 2006 at 11:29 PM Look, cabbie moron, I NEVER claimed to prove anything with an
assertion or brief argument, even with a longer argument here, that
would be impossible which is why I gave refs that total many thousands
of pages so no one has to take anyone’s say-so for it.
I don’t know how many Jews at present live in the former USSR but
after 1945 there were many millions, over 80% of all Jews in the
USSR and eastern Poland were evacuated by the Soviets, among
other sources check out the works of Rassinier and Walter Sanning’s
more up to date The Dissolution of East European Jewry for a very
detailed statistical study.
You have NEVER checked out my references but have only attacked
in the crudest ad hominem manner like some scatological delinquent
out of Portnoy’s Complaint. Your establishment Holohoax scholars
keep quoting each other ! Talk about the pot calling the kettle black !
Rather than recapitulate their arguments, I refer to the sources directly.
Why reinvent the wheel and take the risk of a loss in translation ?
The evidence is in the sources, you need to get off lazy behind and
check them out.
Your ad hominems against me indict you, little man. Not me.
I know you wouldn’t have the guts to say this in person. Your
exactly what my wife calls a typical hysterical Jewish man.
You guys (with a few exceptions) are so obnoxious that your
women now date and marry Gentiles on a huge scale.
Don’t continue this, you either look up the sources or we agree
to disagree.
JS said you have vile smegma.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 28, 2006 at 1:17 AM Stop it, Mike. I’m sorry your wife was attacked, and you might be surprised to discover that most of the rest of us feel the same. I can only imagine how I might feel if I almost lost someone whom I loved as much as you obviously love your wife. I can do more than that, and tell you that I felt powerless and angry and guilty that I could do nothing to protect her. Give yourself a break, for a change.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 28, 2006 at 5:28 AM What does this pathetic asshole mean by taking his rage out on innocent people. Certainly it wasn’t Jewish people who attacked his wife. Why the sudden burst of Holocaust Denial? And he personally attacks me. I’m from Chicago!! I’ve never seen any of his friends or family and yet he attributes a vile remark about me from one of them. He is nuts. He and his vile, hatefilled remarks need to be removed from the entire blogsite. People deserve to be treated with respect. The things that he says have real consequences and the people that are propagating this hatred are in it for the long haul. They feel deeply threatened by the Jews and want to deny the Holocaust because they wrongly feel that this event gives us too much power. These folks want to malign all those millions who died just to give fascism a face lift. This is the movement they want to legitimate and promote. Many of these folks have a complex. This is clearly the case with Mike with regard to his response to his traumatic tragedy. He obviously feels insecure and inadequate by the way he attacks me and all Jews so personally. He must stop immediately or leave ITT for Good!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 28, 2006 at 5:40 AM He’s no more pathetic than you or anyone else, including that dickhead who says he knocked off the heels on his combat boots to qualify for military service. When you feel powerless to protect the people you most love you gladly invoke the scorn of everyone else if only to ignore your own inability to respond to the situation.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 28, 2006 at 1:14 PM Chicago, I only RESPONDED to your initial and ongoing attacks on me.
How could I attack all Jews ? Don’t know all Jews and many I do
know are holocaust revisionists. You keep using terms like
“denial” which have no meaning. If someone asserts the existence
of a god and I think their proof is inadequate or fallacious, does make
me a God denier ? It’s an anti-concept.
You actually brought up the subject and I responded. That you are
so unhinged by the good news that 4-5 million of your fellow Jews
may have survived suggests a profound personal disturbance.
You are a self-hating Jew. If I believed in psychiatry as a medical
concept, I’d say that you were severely mentalli ill.
Unfortunately you have already had the shock treatments, the brain
cell destroying drugs and the lobotomy so further referral will not be
helpful.
My friend here recognizes your hysterical writing style. Is it her fault
that your smegma is so vile ?
You have my deepest pity. I’m one of the Good Goys.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 28, 2006 at 5:43 PM Major, your comments are off the wall psychobabble.
The historical issue I’m debating with the idiot cabbie
from Chicago HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH OUR BEING
ATTACKED. I’ve had these views for 36 years and it only
came up here because cabbie attacked me first.
The only attack I’m responding to is cabbie’s attack on me.
You better look up the threads IN CONTEXT before you go
popping off with unsolicited. Psychobabble is to libs what
the god crap is to cons.
Spare us.
Posted by blondemike on Dec 28, 2006 at 5:47 PM Have it your way, Mike. You’re not helping anyone by generating the animosity of your friends. But if you’d rather be feared than respected then knock yourself out.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 28, 2006 at 6:45 PM Major, if THESE are my friends, god save me from my enemies,
as Al Smith used to say….......
Posted by blondemike on Dec 28, 2006 at 8:30 PM can’t see where shitcago cabbie has anything interesting to say here.
interesting discussion on the whole shoah business racket but a bit off
topic, gents. ever notice how in america today you have to repeat everything a dozen times ? blondemike has done so for the cabbie and others, now time to get back to the topic at hand. you can’t own a shack
for under a mil in oahu so this commie argument that only the rich are
affected by the estate tax is a bunch of hoo haa. the government has no
friggin’ right to any of my income except what i choose to give them for basic services, which they can’t even provide that decently. we are all going to have to live in gated communities with our private cops soon.
personally i think we should privatize the air, airwaves, the oceans, streets, roads and schools for starters. free lunch is over, comrades, your hatred of your betters is contemptible. the dems only have a mandate to end the war and end bush, not for any wildass commie tax schemes. most dems elected are blue dogs. not libs. homeless people will simply be outlawed for trepass and so would be ghetto punks driving big welfare cars for stickups would have to pay a toll to get out of their driveway. no prisons, you get either exiled or executed for the basic
crimes of rape, burglary, robbery, murder, fraud. everything else is legal.
Posted by hawaii jack on Dec 28, 2006 at 10:56 PM Yeah, Jackass. All dem colored criminals jes terarizing you in yo million dollar dump in Oahu. You might want to consider the cost of contructing a few mass crematoria. Nothing sinister. All those executions, you’ll just need to remove the dead bodies more efficiently. Your good buddy Mike will be happy to rationalize your doubts for you, but you don’t sound like someone who harbors too many of them.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 28, 2006 at 11:39 PM private, private so nice to hear from you. so are you like gacey, you kill large numbers of white boys and cremate them in your back yard ? doesn’t the smell get to you ? your last sentence is true.
Posted by hawaii jack on Dec 29, 2006 at 12:55 AM clever, clever. what army are you a major in ? Salvation Army ? sorry if i rubbed a sensitive spot, pally.
Posted by hawaii jack on Dec 29, 2006 at 1:34 AM BM,
It might interest you to know that Proposition13 is something on which I have great expertise. I Met both Howard Jarvis and Tom Hayden, a State of California legislator and key opponent of the resolution in Madison, Wi in 1978. At the time there was a tax revolt in the State of Wisconsin mostly based in the rural areas where farmers felt they were being soaked for lots of money with very little return in terms of services or needed infrastructure like roads and public lighting.
In a very real sense, and especially for the senior citizens, property taxes are regressive. There is nothing hard to grasp about this point and MSchmidt should understand it as well. It is not just a wealth tax like capital gains on securities which is closely tied to income and ability to pay. Real Estate markets are complex as times and urban spaces change rapidly while the imcomes of those who originally built homes remain the same. Many old people were taxed out of their homes and into state care facilities or other such facilities where the senior care and medical professions got all their life savings and capital gains from the sale of their main marketable asset. This is something senoirs abhor!! For many people in the volitile California real estate market property taxes became increasingly regressive and out of range of their ability to pay based on income. It was also unfair.
Yet the very design of the Proposition was flawed. As always the devil was in the details. New homebuyers pay two to three times that rate of taxes on property they own that is similar in square footage, lot size, and kind to that of their neighbors. This was a problem forseen at the outset. The other inequity is the one Hayden focused on the most. He decried Proposition 13 as a “the biggest run on the public till by large corporate interests mostly based outside the State of California ever in history.” In a sense he was correct. If a corporation owned a large pricey piece of real estate and was taken over or merged with another big company with the California property still deeded to the old corporation the new owners continue to pay on the old basis even though the property in fact changed hands. There is no new amendments to the proposition to account for this and millions in local municiple revenues are lost as a result. The largest winners were big business much of it based outside the state. The other problem is the loss of services once enjoyed by Californians. Though they paid high property taxes, they once got excellent services for the money. Prop. 13 has added to State Municiple Bond indebtedness and has not contained state and local spending but shifted it from homeowners and big property owners to the middle and lower classes who now bear the brunt of much taxation. Also users fees like Bus fares have increased. One of the truely negative effects that it has had is that it slowed the turnover of affordable housing in working class and middle class neighborhoods making home ownership tougher for many immigrants even when they would otherwise have the money. It seems similar to the effect of rent control in NYC where people stayed put until they died cuz they couldn’t afford to move based on being grandfathered in to certain financial conditions frozen to advantage. It could be said to be a transfer tax from poorer new home buyers to the old timers who hang on and is hardly in this sense progressive. The idea of making California’s property taxes less regressive is a good one. One must find a much better way to design the legislation for doing so.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 29, 2006 at 7:58 AM major, are you coming on to me, you old homo ? shitcago, i just finished intellectually demolishing you on another thread on the no business like shoah business theme. although from virginia i lived in california for years before moving to hawaii and i don’t need your condescending lecture on prop 13. think blondie died of boredom reading your endless asscrap so let me reply here. the one defect you corectly mention as to the tax imbalance between longtime owners and new ones was due to a compromise jarvis made because of the liberal hysteria generated by morons like you that the sky was falling if 13 passed. even so all cal homeowners have been big beneficiaries of 13 and have saved hundreds of thousands in property taxes, of course big biz has saved more but so what ? all biz taxes are passed on to the public and people with money are the ones who create jobs so why tax them excessively ? only an envious little mediocrity like you who wants to nationalize his betters (that’s everyone) wants 13 repealed. Cal bond indebtedness is due to moron pressure groups putting too many socialist ballot props on which are bankrupting the state. if the aliens are illegal they shouldn’t be owning homes in cal or anywhere else in the usa. privatize the schools and you eliminate the need for property taxes or most of them. every function of gov could be better run privately and we can entirely get rid of the parasitic public sector. that includes allowing gypsy cabs in shitcago so we don’t have to be at mercy of bandits like you. quick, call the webmaster, you’re losing another argument.
Posted by hawaii jack on Dec 29, 2006 at 6:59 PM Mike you’re a pathetic neo-Nazi. Your slang gives you away (“mudpeople?”) None of it really made sense until you said you were originally from Virginia. Damn its an awful big coincidence that nearly every damn neo-Nazi bigot of some kind or another can trace their roots back to the South. April Gaede who claims she’s from Bakersfield with her neo-Nazi twins who perform under the name of “Prussian Blue” (a pseudonym for the blue haze residue from cyanic acid used in gas chambers-a nice touch for two 12 year old girls) is really from One of the Carolinas. I refuse to believe this is a conicidence. There is something reactionary about southern political culture. Every damn fascist inclination gestates and finds acceptance down there. Why don’t you just go fuck yourself you KKK-Nazi.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 30, 2006 at 12:12 AM Get some help, Mike. Your Jekyll and Hyde routine is wearing thin.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 30, 2006 at 12:17 AM shitcago, i think blondie decided to move on to greener pastures after trying to reason with a total dullard like yourself. your regional generalizations are funny coming from a person who is always howling about “racism” or “anti-semitism.” your portnoy like scatological obscenities are proof that you can present no coherent argument on anything. you simply call out the same names and profanities that all of your commie holocaust denial friends on the left do. you can’t think, you can’t reason, you can’t argue, you can only emote. there are very few of your shabby ilk here in oahu, we are not a mud city like shitcago. apparently all of your many enemies are really the same person. sure, whatever you say, shitcago. anyone from the greatest cesspool in the land has no business making shabby generalizations about anyone else. and i guess the now 40% of americans who entertain doubts about the holohoax are “nazis” too ?
major, you can write two sntences, i’m impressed. were you born with two heads (but no brain) so your mommie gave you two first names ?
Posted by hawaii jack on Dec 30, 2006 at 2:50 AM Well, so far you’ve managed to reinforce the stereotypical caricature of a racist, antisemitic fascist. Mud city? Shitcago? Greatest cesspool in the land? It’s as if you’re inviting us to draw the obvious conclusion that you’re, well, a racist, antisemitic fascist. You know, someone who believes the white majority is being persecuted and oppressed by the black and Jewish minorities.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 30, 2006 at 4:00 AM Major, Major
I gave this badly psychologically damaged moron two great websites that answer not three but dozens of thoughtless, bogus claims by the Historical Revisionists (HR). One of them is www.hdot.org and another is the www.nizkorproject.org. They both have dozens of references and take on the specious claims of HR frauds one by one. One especially interesting myth debunked by Lipstadt herself is the claim that the Jewish community contrived the story in order to get money for Israel. Since the German reparations to Israel was based on the number of Jews which survived and made it to Palestine not the actual number killed it was in the interest of the Jewish Agency to inflate the number that survived and went to Palestine and elsewhere not the number killed. The number given was 500,000 which was the figure used for calculating the dollar value in German reparations to Israel. There are many other such myth debunkings.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 30, 2006 at 6:16 AM Aryan Mike and the Hawaiian Jerk are the same person. Mike discontinued his comments on Thursday, the 28th, which coincidentally is the same date that Jack initiated his own. Now Jack is gone, too, indicating that the two of them have been banned from the site. Interestingly, Hardesty used to be a contributing writer for Z magazine.
Posted by Major Major on Dec 31, 2006 at 12:38 AM The myth of the “Southern Man” is a Hollywood creation. As a “mud person” as Hawaii Jack so gently phrased the term ,the only person to ever ask me what lawn service I worked for was a Yankee Long Island Liberal.
The south has accepted the ridicule of our fellow Americans since Reconstruction. Portrayed as ignorant rednecks we reconstructed ourselves. The South has elected a greater percentage of Black and Hispanics to all levels of Government. We are a truly diverse population that manages to live together in relative peace and harmony. We have our poor white trash that suffers through generational poverty and has “learned” racism. The parents teach their children and so forth.But the racist few don’t really affect how Southern society functions. As a whole the realtionship between races is at the very least cordial. Our kids attend the same schools, we eat the same foods, we have the same accents. Simply disliking our politics is a silly reason to smear the South. Twenty million Yankee transplants can’t be wrong.
I suppose a beaner in a BMW really irritates the hidden Yankee racism they all share but they still call me Mr Beaner to my face.
Posted by texasindependent on Dec 31, 2006 at 1:51 AM TexanMan,
In the first place political beliefs are an exellent reason to “smear” people, as you say. In the second place the Latino culture in Texas and the white “redneck” culture of the deep south are two very different things. I’m not saying all southerners are reactionary and all northerners are progressive. There are exellent examples of anomalies in both regions. My personal favorite is C. Wright Mills. A Texan like yourself. Changed the whole way we think about sociology. Now some folks call him a left Weberian. Far as I kin reckon he preferred to be called a “plain Marxist” to distinguish himself from the elitist yankee variety. In any case you should be proud to claim him as part of your southern heritage. Didn’t dare teach in the south though. Nope. Tought at Columbia. And during the time when the students was a gittin reddy to go wild on the stablishmunt. Helluvu thang itwas. Columbia. them daze. Any how my good TexanMan I must depart. Meant no disrespect to yer kith n’ kin. I’m sure yer fine folks. Mighty fine folks down south. Mighty fine. Happy New Year.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Dec 31, 2006 at 4:03 AM Hey, assholes, I went away for five days. Hawaii Jack’s not
my chosen style but he’s done an excellent job of succinctly
rebutting all the imbeciles above, hey, I like “Shitcago.”
Captures the essence of the “man” and the city.
Shitcago, I gave you two websites that answer not only the two
you gave me but the myth. I have read your sites and I know
all the holes in their arguments, you’ve never examined mine
because you are too scared to. You just keep repeating your
same bullshit lies and childish names. There have been many
MILLIONS of people who have applied for and been given German
reparations. All of the “testimony” at Nuremberg, Dachau, Frankfurt,
Eichmann and Auschwitz trials was obtained under coercion. None
of the “witnesses” were allowed ever allowed to be critically
crossexamined as is normal in a real court. You have been given
the refs but here goes again: Theses and Dissertations Press
PO Box 257768, Chicago, IL 60625, “Dissecting The Holocaust” ed.
by Germar Rudolf. They have many books in their Holocaust Handbook
Series but this is the best introduction, 612 pages.
Happy reading. Jack can deal with you in the New Year.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 1, 2007 at 1:20 AM Hey Asshole,
Glad you actually think the Nazis were unfairly treated at Nuremberg. Witnesses were actually cross examined. The Nazis got better due process than they gave anyone else. They in fact were never coerced. How could they have been coerced? They received top grade legal representation. These sickos were guilty as hell. It is impossible to fake a genocide of this magnitude but it is easy to twist and misrepresent legitimate evidence and present it to uneducated crackers like yourself and be effective based on the low congnitive ability of your audience.
One example is the so called Leuchter Report which has no credibility with anyone familiar with the actual workings of Auschwitz. Zundel made a huge profit publishing Leuchter’s amaturish crap and was jailed in Canada for pushing hate literature. Rightly so!! See ya, loser boy.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 1, 2007 at 4:47 AM I think you captured the moment when you asked
“Do we enjoy making ourselves mentally ill?”
I think we doand thanks for encapsulating the current mind set.
Posted by minerva_jones on Jan 1, 2007 at 10:44 AM The Nazis got far worse treatment at Nuremberg than they meted
out and I never claimed that they were lillies of the field.
See Advance To Barbarism by F.J.P. Veale and Nuremberg:The
Final Battle by David Irving.
I am sorry that a self-hating Jew like you, Shitcago, has trouble
accepting the great news that 4-5 million European Jews thought
killed by the Germans were not.
Leuchter has huge credibilty, he designed the gas chambers in several
states before they switched to lethal injection and I challenge you to
actually read The Leuchter report wherein he PROVES that there were
no gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau, also check out the massive
volume, Dissecting The Holocaust, referenced above.
Their “legal” representation was NEVER permitted to challenge the
mass extermination premise of the trials, Nuremberg, Auschwitz,
Eichmann, Frankfurt, Dachau and they were NEVER permitted rigorous
cross-examination of the professional “witnesses” who were invariably
lying through their teeth. You probably think Mumia had top notch legal
reps too !
Tex, so your a friggin’ beaner ? Love it, thought you were the prototype
Texass Redneck…....learn something new once in a blue moon.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 1, 2007 at 10:34 PM BTW, Shitcago, I’m NOT from Virginia, sorry to ruin your stereotype
and keep shitting out those blue monkeys. Redhorse told me that
you’re face looks like Scorp’s hemorrhoids
Posted by blondemike on Jan 1, 2007 at 11:21 PM Shitcago, any guy that denies the massive Communist genocide of
hundreds of millions as well as the massive American genocide of
tens of millions, as you routinely do, has no basis for criticizing the
Krauts for 1-2 million Jewish deaths in WW2.
Pot, scrub thy ugly self !
Posted by blondemike on Jan 1, 2007 at 11:24 PM Bondemike
Yes a beaner. I have learned several new things.The Left is racism wrapped in a shiny package. All the talk of equality and social justice is somehow patting the ignorant mud people on the head while stealing their wallets keeping them under your thumb when election time rolls around.
Ignorance and intolerance are the hallmark of progressives. Any idea is great as long as it enriches progressives,destroys family values, and allows them to damage the United States.
California is the puckering bunghole of civilization and the Big Quake cannot come soon enough.
“Progressive”, “Marxist”, ” Obstreperous Maladjusted Asshole” ,and “Socialist” are interchangeable terms
When I wake in the morning and drive my BMW Z4 M Coupe from my house in a gated community to my office, I realize that progressives are poor pieces of dog feces with no future. .And I realize that I a poor beaner from the Rio Grande Valley wear suits that cost more than most Lefties make in a week and I will make more money while considering your steaming pile of a life and retarded issues while drinking my Starbucks than you can earn in a month And that makes me smile.
Posted by texasindependent on Jan 2, 2007 at 2:11 AM Hey Tex,
I can tell you’re from Texas by your arrogance. Your success deserves to be congratulated. You deserve much credit for your success but you recieved help from progressives. Subsidized student loans, education at a land grant college, free public education before that, and, of course, a European engineered car built by unionized workers with high morale who do their job right, and who work for a company who received government assistence (perhaps in the form of tax subsidies) for technological R&D which made German cars the best in the world. State/Corporate long term relationships to develope product markets and plan for long term profitability makes for better societies, with better cared for people and higher morale. Your better car and good job came from “socialist” ideas like state capitalist involvment in economic development and free public education. So respect “socialism” in the small measures in which you find it here and there.
You should know that I am a very big advocate for Mexican-Americans. I really don’t like the term “beaner” at all. The ones that I know work very hard. The new arrivals may remain poor but the children will go to college and fight hard for good jobs. Many are getting into the health care professions which is a growing industry. According to some reports the health care industry is growing toward 20% of our GDP. This is both because of the aging population and the fact that the industry is attracting more investment due to increased profitability (despite shrinking access to the poor and middle class).
Tex, I recently read an article by Paul Krugman who figures that 45% of the tax cuts went to the upper 4% of the income scale. In addition, it is this strata which has seen any real income growth over the past twenty years. All other strata have remained stable or decreased. The middle class is shrinking. People talk about raising the minimum wage which was a poverty wage when they last raised it to the level it is now. For all intents and purposes we have NO minimum wage because it is so low below the poverty line it isn’t even relevant and plays no role in setting pay scales anywhere.The top one percent controls a larger income share than it did in the 1920s before the depression. The idea that high wages cause unemployment is bullshit. In the 1960s we had lower unemployment than we do today and higher real wages. The distribution of wealth was far more equal. Today Walmarts CEO earns over $23 million annually and the average Walmart worker is said to gross about $18,000 annually-a poverty wage if this individual is trying to support a family of four. The ratio of Lee Scott’s salary to the average clerk is at least 150:1 and closer to 200:1 if you compare it to starting workers most of whom earn around $7.00/hour. What does Scott do with $23 million that he can’t do with $12 million or $10 million. And the Walmart ratio is suprisingly not as unequal as other companies with really big annual revenues like oil companies or others where the ratio is 300 or 400 to one. Our country is being bled by the rich. Now “W” wants to empty the public till to these guys and let the rest of us pay out of pocket for services the government once provided at an inflated cost. Profits are up way above inflation rates and occupy a bigger share of the GDP than ever in history. This economy will never be able to grow any more than 2% annually and then only on credit until this situation changes. Our global economic strategy is not real progress.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 2, 2007 at 4:18 PM tex, hey little bro, did the redneck texassans educate you ? i thought so because you seem like a latin version of scorp. true that many lefties like shitcago cabbie are racists but they did get totally unqualified baboons like you your affirmative action jobs and those balloon mortgages. the repo man was there over the weekend trying to take back the bmw. miss a few payments ? again, i’m glad you’re that wal-mart suit special but is that fully paid for too ? there’s a reason the halfway house that you live in has gates…...................... starbucks coffee is mud ! but i do agree that the dallas morning news makes a great umbrella. but it’s not blondie that keeps you people down or even shitcago cabbie, it’s you people that keep you people down. welcome to the great rightist ranks, little brown boy, we have coonservatives, we have kosher konservatives, now we have tacocons…..........i love it !
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 2, 2007 at 6:00 PM shitcago, you never did squat for mexicans or anyone else. shilling for aipac which totally runs congress by promoting the no business like shoah business crapola is not helping anyone including your fellow loinsmen. i’m glad to see you put the little brown bro in his place but what does this have to do with the two million illegal mexicans in shitcago alone ? we need a wall like israel’s building on confiscated
arab land. 12 million illegals should not be allowed to remain here.
tex, calif is bad but anyone who lives in a sewer like texass should not be throwing stones at other glass houses, both you turds are out to lunch.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 2, 2007 at 6:06 PM shitcago, your ferevent endorsement above of national socialist state corporate philosophy is interesting. now you can continue to endorse same without that “six million” albatross around your neck.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 2, 2007 at 8:26 PM I don’t know where you come up with 2 million illegal mexicans in Chicago when the entire population is only 3 million.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 4, 2007 at 4:46 PM Mike you are a pathetic little neo-Nazi. You’ve claimed elsewhere that Hitler was no threat. That’s news to most of the world, including most Germans. Without Hitler Stalin might have been overthrown before he could kill very many people and a Jewish state would never have been established as very few Jews had any interest in it and none did before Russian pogroms in the 1880s on through WWI aftermath.
The consequences in the pacific theatre were dire. Japanese colonialism brought communism to Korea and China as well as Indochina yet one must also credit oppressive social conditions. This is something fascists like yourself never admit to existing. I don’t know how you can say that they world had any prejudice against Germany. Everyone sat by and watched and even invested millions ‘till it was to late.The fact that you say it was actually the Jews and not the Nazis that were the real threat shows you ARE a neo-Nazi. Hardesty you are pathetic and all I can say is that you will always suffer the consequenced of being a moron. You will soon be banned from all blogs!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 4, 2007 at 5:10 PM Shitcago, this is Hawaii Jack, not BlondeMike and I just refuted you at length over on the tax revolt thread. You are like a little delinquent who gets so bent out of shape by having his myths exposed that he is reduced to pure ad hominems and trashy invective of the lowest caliber.
Stalin had already killed 30 million before Hitler ever came to power, if their was any first here it was the brutal Soviets under the mass murderers Lenin, Trotsky and Stalin who first set up concentration camps and killed their opponents on a mass scale unimaginable in Germany or any western country. The reason everyone “sat by” was precisely because no “holocaust” was happening, the sources were discredited Communist liars like you. Horrible things were happening but not what was much later claimed. Japan was bad but both Chiang and Mao were much worse, so much for the myth of a Good War.
You’re going to ban me from every site ? ! This sounds like something out of the Protocols ! Actually the way AIPAC runs Congress exceeds anything in the Protocols. Hitler was never bent on world conquest nor a threat to most of the world, see the vehemently anti-German A.J.P. Taylor’s 1961 The Origins Of The Second World War. Hitler was less expansionist than the Kaiser and more willing to negotiate than Weimar, he recognized French rule over Alsace-Lorraine in contrast to
Weimar.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 4, 2007 at 6:39 PM I would like to congratulate the State of Hawaii’s Mental Mealth and Mental Retardation Department for the fine work they have done with Jack. For someone of his obvious mental deficiencies to graduate from an oversize crayon to a keyboard is miraculous. As soon as cross burning becomes a Special Olympic sport we will see Jack in his finest crash helmet recieving a gold medal.
Cabdriver
I have found the only solution for dealing with racism is to laugh at the idiot spouting it.I appreciate socialism as an abstract. In reality it has been a colossal failure. I support your right to dream the impossible dream but will fight you tooth and nail when you try to implement it. Socialism is totalitarianism even in a form as benign as Canada or Sweden. Government is an unatural state for humans. What gives another human being the intrinsic right to dictate the terms of my life. Why substitute the relative low interference and low taxes of our present system for unbearable interference and taxes of your system? The Constitution lays out the responsibility for a Federal government and they are sparse and few. Somehow well intentioned folks such as yourself have created huge bureaucracies that violate the intent as well as the letter of Constitutional law. The tenth amendment ” The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”
The power of any oligarchy is in the bureaucracy.Lee Scott’s salary is the concern of the Board of Directors at Wal Mart. If citizens of Chicago felt that cabdrivers made to much money I would give them the same advice. Mind your own business let Lee Scott mind his. I don’t shop at Wal Mart. I would advise you to do the same.
OIl profits while pissing the world off has the same solution as any other problem. Use less oil. Buy a diesel and use cooking oil to fuel it. Support American farmers use ethanol. Our co-op has invested in a small ethanol plant to use corn waste and stalks to produce ethanol and bio-diesel. After five years of operation the plant has paid for itself and looks to be quite profitable in the future. The 90 percent reduction in fuel costs has enabled many ranchers and farmers here to actually invest in environmentally friendly procedures and products. I have substituted compost for chemical fertilizer on my hay fields. The initial costs are higher but the elimination of nitrates washing into the water table are worth it.
Keep on fighting the good fight Cabdriver.
Posted by texasindependent on Jan 5, 2007 at 5:08 AM Omigod ! Little texass beaner boy sucking off old Commie cabbie ! And
such a wit with a capital SH….............(see if you can figure that one out).
you might learn how to spell “receiving” along with many other words,
amigo.
Of course, your arguments are as nonexistent as the Shitcago Cabbie’s
and like him you come from a highly racist subgroup. I had thought that
maybe texass redneckism had rubbed off on you but your own peepul
are second to none in their racism.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 5, 2007 at 5:21 PM Texass, you’re the kind of dimbulb that would defend the golden parachute of the just ousted Home Depot CEO, 210 mil for failure.
This kind of ripoff is everyone’s business including the government, the shareholders, the employees and the consumers. No doubt that your part-time legislature down in Austin could care less since they are bought and paid for by Big Biz. You’re another good argument against affirmative action.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 5, 2007 at 5:28 PM Texas,
I actually agree with some of the comments you made at the very bottom of your post. Don’t agree with the rest. As Oliver Wendell Holmes once said, “Taxes are the price we all pay for civilization.” What makes you think our earnings come purely from our own efforts. I work hard to and face dangers. I know you and many others do to. I also don’t think those who don’t work by choice (whether rich or poor and there are many of both) deserve much of societies consideration. However, none of us live and work in a vacuum. The taxes we pay aren’t just for the palpable things that facilitate our lives like roads, bridges, other infrastructure, defense, etc. but for “social” infrastructure that makes society viable and livable. Conservatives never take into account the manner in which taxes boost the wealth of the rich by collectively absorbing the externalities caused by their exploititive system and socially spreading the costs of severe inequality. Some examples are a massive prison system, expensive environmental stewardship, wasteful use of non-renewable energy resources, excessively water intensive farming, the problems of urban sprawl, and health care issues that are avoidable like obesity and type II diabetes.
Scott’s salary in particular IS society’s concern. If he gave up even half of it (Why can’t he live on $12 million annually?) the rest of the Walmart “team” could live like people and not have to grovel before local government for health care and food stamps. We subsidize his salary in this sense. The entire structure of our economy was not created by “free markets” but corporate decisions that didn’t involve society. The Right sees only individuals. I say all systems are social in nature because the restructuring of society is the first necessity in creating new modes of domination and dependency whether capitalist, feudal, or slave. Enclosure is the historic basis or creating reliance of the masses on capitalism. More and more independant producers are made reliant on big capital for goods, work, and the source of livlihood. Look at the way just six big agribusiness firms want to create a total global dependance on a narrow core of firms for GM seeds in order to control the very basis of food production and the means of life. They have already destroyed the vast majority of the world’s natural and cultivated bio-diversity in the interests of enclosing human productive freedom in the interest of private control. Dictatorship doesn’t only come from governments but also corporate productive relations. Individual choice today is more ideology than reality.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 6, 2007 at 3:13 AM Thanks, Jack, for taking care of my intellectual lightwork here.
Shitcago Cabbie’s response all along has been as follows:
” I don’t know nothing about this holocaust revisionism and don’t want
to learn anything because I’ve already read the rebuttals which I was already 100% predisposed to agree with. These people are dangerous flatearthers who should be outlawed and gassed then electrocuted and banned after that. Whatever side I read first wins, there is no possibility
of either new knowledge or even new interpretations and only Jew-hating Nazis who are trying to kill all Jews and our friendly black brothers dare dissent from my edicts here.”Wow ! Impressive, cabbie and now you quote the lowest pragmatist-statist-collectivist anti-individual rights judicial hack of all time, Ollie Shit In His Pants Holmes ! You might read Murray Rothbard’s rebuttal to this clown’s You Can’t Shout Fire In a Crowded Theatre bullshit in
For A New Liberty.
Now about taxes and civilization I see a lot of taxes here in the Oak-Berk Zoo but very little civilization. Maybe you can enlighten us on this apparent contradiction.
And watch your truss, old boy !
Posted by blondemike on Jan 6, 2007 at 9:24 PM Hawaii Jack (Jack Barnes, ex-trotskyist who wrote pamphlets for Pathfinder Press on such issues as Cuba and the Russian Revolution?)aren’t we unstable?
Speaking of civilized, no who actually is doubts the fact that the holocaust occured. Why would they? The pictures alone are proof enough for most. Logically speaking it is hard to fake a genocide that big. Why would the big powers do it. They all appeased Germany with vast conquests and fed her direct investments helping to build up her war machine until the Nazis attacked friendly little Poland for no reason. Did you think Poland was a legitimate threat to Gernany?
Moron boy, everything these Holocaust denyers have claimed has been refuted. Claims about aerial photos not showing smoke from the open air burnings being photos of areas not even in Europe to other refutations have exposed these assholes as anti-semites with a pro-Nazi agenda. The Jooooz don’t have the power cowards like you and others attribute to them. You spew hate pure and simple. i went to the Castel Hill website btw. It is a pathetic little rant about “anti-German” defamation which no one buys anyhow. Say Nazi boy, how come the vast majority of German people today disagree with you and even support the anti-hate crime legislation making Holocaust Denial illegal. Hell, half of ‘em would bring back 90% top income bracket taxation before abrogating the laws against holocaust denial!! Most Germans are so ashamed of their Nazi past they’d support any kind of hate crime legislation as a way of denying their unsavory past. And I say GOOD for them!!
The Nazis are crackpots, (mike, jack, whoever?) who have no one’s best interest at heart and who address no one’s issues but the super rich who once put them in power but later regretted it.Could this be the reason for such universal opposition to them. The Holocaust has NEVER empowered Israel to do what it wants and denying it won’t disempower it. The crackpot Christian fundies don’t acknowledge the Holocaust or ANY Jewish suffering when pushing support for Israel only biblical prophesies. I know because I’ve actually spoken to such creatures. One of them actually referred (rather spitefully) to Israel as a Christian country. Kinda strange considering what the flag looks like!!Despite lipservice, the Holocaust is NOT the US motivation for support for Israel anyhow. It is domination of the Middle East. The Israeli army is like a surrogate US force in the region and is a large and effective force. Israel is bar none the most stable regime in the region including the Saudis who sit on top of 65% of the world’s known oil reserves and 25% of world production. With Israel and Saudi Arabia as the US’s best allies (only these two powers ever received f-16s and AWACs and other sophisticated airforce weapons systems which even the Shah didn’t receive) the US has the region militarily secured and the oil pumping freely with US petro-dollars recycled the world’s financial systems and remaining the only currency of the oil trade while US oil majors pocket untold billions and post record profits and stock prices. This is the plan. Your incessant whining denying anything won’t be listened to because it’s silly and counter to the truth. If people like Irving were right they wouldn’t lose court cases. Leuchter was considered corrupt and inept by officials of the Alabama state Penal system, all good oie’ boys. No Jooooz in that little ole’ network. Hardesty you’re pathetic. Get a life!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 7, 2007 at 2:53 PM Pictures are not an argument as the anti-abortion debate proves. The pictures in and of themselves prove only that people died, not how they died. Most people are morons and accept whomever brainwashes them first. Germany was never appeased as you can see from reading the greatest British historian of the 20th century, Alfred John Percival Taylor’s The Origins Of The Second World War. Every conquest Hitler made except for Prague was German territory stolen from Germany in
the infamous Versailles Treaty after WW1. The Rhineland, Austria, the German areas occupied by the Czechs, Danzig. There was no attempt at world conquest and no appeasement and most of Germany’s recovery was through Keynesian economics, they were the first to go off the gold standard, Hitler enacted immense social welfare programs, public health campaigns against smoking and cancer, national health insurance, gun control, in other words the whole progressive agenda. Nuremberg was his version of affirmative action. I don’t agree with his program but I’m not a statist like you are.
Most Germans have been brainwashed after 62 years of occupation, the holocaust denial are pure Stalinism and are not supported by most Germans, the very fact they have those totalitarian IS PROOF PER SE THAT THE HOLCAUST IS A LYING HOAX EVEN TO ITS VERY NAME.
Now document your assertions with something other than namecalling.
Every statement that you have made about “gas chambers” has been
disproven by the Rudolf Report, avaliable from VHO & IHR, and by a dozen books on Auschwitz by Germar Rudolf, Robert Faurisson, Carlo Mattogno, Arthur Butz, Walter Sanning and several others. You keep reiterating your mindless assertions as if they are settled fact and your response to the message is the ad hominem attack on the messenger.
What happened to the great Jewish IQ we all read about, any ghetto bum high on crack could make the same arguments that you do.
Leuchter was never proven either corrupt or inept by Alabama or any other state. He only became controversial years AFTER he published the Leuchter Report because crackpots like YOU carried on a vilification campaign remorselessly against him. My Jewish wife just rolls up in hysterics when
she reads your insane tirades, “a typical hysterical Jewish male” is one of the kinder things that she
has to say about you. She hates the K word but is almost tempted to use it to describe you. Tell me,
has the IHR put you up to make the worst possible case for the “holocaust” ? You must create at
least twenty new “anti-semites” in Chicago every day.
And no I’m not Jack, pal, lots of people here can’t stand you. Not limited to one person.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 7, 2007 at 8:41 PM When the holocaust goes, Israel goes. Significantly enough Abba Eban’s series on PBS on the history of the Jewish people did NOT even mention the “gas chambers” because they are a bigger hoax than Anne Frank’s “Diary.” Only a nut like you could imagine that the good news that “only” 1-2 million European Jews died in WW2 was horrible news and proof of “anti-semitism.” I NEVER said the National Socialists were good guys, I only said their body count is SIGNIFICANTLY less than that of either the Communists or the capitalists. There was no plan mass extermination, there were no gas chambers and while Jews DID die in WW2 nowhere near six million did. As Jacobo Timmerman once wrote, There’s No Business Like Shoah Business. You are not going to intimidate us, your prisons won’t stop us, your smears won’t stop us, the now overused & meaningless ‘anti-semite’ label won’t stop us any more than the hackneyed “Nazi” smear, the fact is that people like you are at your wit’s end and this big lie of big lies will not last even a quarter of this century.
Every time you pop off on this crap I’m going to be on you like a dog on doodoo. I bet you’re sorry you ever started this row. I had never intended on bringing this up, I was only correcting Scorp’s idiotic assertion that Crystal Night was the start of the “holocaust’” which is not even controversial. Then you charged like a bull in the proverbial china shop and after Irving’s incredible imprisonment I became less tolerant of the old inanities. Love to see tough you are in person, little Portnoy.
If you went to the VHO-Castle Hill website you would see a lot more than just Germans whining.
Why not download the thousands of pages of free books if you can’t afford to buy them ? Scared ?
Poland was much worse towards the Jews than Hitler and some Jewish leaders here thought the
Polish Junta had plans to exterminate Poland’s Jews before Germany. See When Peaceful Revision Failed by David L. Hoggan. Poland was not a threat to Germany but the Polish leaders insanely believed the UK-Franco guarantees to “save them.’” If Poland had negotiated there would have been NO World War Two.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 7, 2007 at 9:00 PM You really ARE insane and so is your stupid “wife” (its hard to believe your actually married even to this individual). First of all the holocaust is in fact settled truth. No one but crackpots disbelieves it. No believes that the Nazis were subjected to “show trials” at Nuremburg and, most importantly, everyone believes that gas was used at Auschwitz and probably eight other places. Fred Leuchter was stripped of his credentials. He describes himself as an engineer but in fact he was never actually trained in engineering. Apparently he studied history which you obviously have not. If you did, you would not have made the last and stupidest statement of your last post. In fact the Polish colonels who ran Poland in the final four years after Pilsudski’s death in 1935, REFUSED to sign a four power aggreement of mutual defense and security gaurantees against German aggression with France, the UK, and the USSR. The deal breaker was, you guessed it, the participation of the USSR whom the Poles invaded in 1920 in order to steal tons of land from the USSR (land which contained no Polish speaking people) when they were flat on their backs and starving and whom the Poles hated bitterly. The Germans had NO reason whatsoever to attack Poland except they were fascist aggressors against all of Europe (the germans of course) and there was nothing for the poles to negotiate. The Germans had no business asking for “the polish corridor” to east prussia which was little more than an excuse to attack the east all through history. This German version of “manifest destiny” or as they called it “the Drag nach osten” (drive toward the east) was pure imperialism and basically justified invasion and land grabs anywhere a few ethnic german communities lived. This is hardly legitimate. The poles did negotiate with germany but could hardly accept Hitler’s terms. Danzig was a trustee of the League of Nations. It had a Polish minority. The 16 counties or provinces of the entire polish corridor had a definite Polish majority. The Nazis wanted a rigged plebicite disallowing most poles from voting and allowing all germans to vote whether they lived in the corridor or not (Poles would have to show residence in the corridor from prior to 1919.) The Nazis wanted to exchange population sending out the polish majority to form contiguous german territory linking the reich to east prussia. They also wanted to cut poland off from the baltic sea. This would be tantamount to the impoverishment of polish society. Poland traded through the Gdansk port especially agricultural commodities like grains. Poland agreed to appease Germany with some baltic land and overland rights to east prussia but Hitler wanted the entire corridor. The Germans planned to attack poland no matter what. The neutralized the USSR with the non-aggression pact of 1939. The Germans also Nazified Danzig in 1938 city council elections in violation of international law.It was the Germans who refused to negotiate. They were warmongers throughout history. Read Carl Tighe’s brilliant book Gdansk 1990 Pluto Press. Its a great read. It would answer a lot of your questions about many issues during this period.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 8, 2007 at 10:12 AM First, the so-called “holocaust” is not established truth as the skeptics have proven in spades. You, Shitcago Crabbie, have not broght forth the slightest proof to document your idiot ASSertion. Zilch, nada, zero. Everyone knows that the Stalinist Show Trials at Nuremberg were a macabre farce and a disgrace to the western judicial system as the leading British historian A.J.P. Taylor noted many years ago, also see F.J. P. Veale’s masterly Advance To Barbarism for a full debunking of that extra-judicial fraud and David Irving’s Nuremberg: The Final Battle.
Fred Leuchter was never stripped of his credentials for any reason to do with his scientific work in setting up gas chambers for the several states that maintained them before they went to lethal injection. The critics couldn’t answer the central thesis of the Leuchter Report which PROVED that there were no gassings at Audschwitz and whatever problems existed with this report were corrected by the much more comprehensive Rudolf Report and you can download all 455 pages
in english as well as other lanuages on the VHO website. Just punch in holocaust revisionism on yahoo and it will come up. YOU have NEVER read either report and do not know what you are talking about. You are a scared little man who becomes totally hysterical when your favorite myths are debunked. As far as the Poles stealing tons of Soviet land this is wrong because Poland itself was absorbed by the Russian Empire for centuries and in order to create Poland they had to extract it from Russia-USSR which itself had gobbled up Poland many generations earlier. Of course, Poland wouldn’t trust the world’s greatest mass murderer Joseph Stalin with some “nonaggression” treaty, they had much more historical reason to distrust the Russians than even the Germans, not that they liked the Germans either. Hitler never nazified Danzig, it was always an all German city stolen by the Poles via Versailles after WW1. All historians now agree on divided responsibilty for both WW1 and WW2. The myth of eternal German aggressiveness is horseshit. The Krauts are bad but no worse than the Brits, the French, the Belgians (remember the phony atrocity stories from WW1 here) or your stinky tribe in Occupied Palestine and NOT just since 1948 either. The Polish Corridor was set up by expelling many Germans and by specifically including Danzig to give Poland a seaport to which they were not entitled. Again see Taylor’s The Origins Of The Second World War. There was nothing especially “Nazi” about the German position in 1939 on Danzig, it had been the exact position of the social democratic Weimar Republic. Nor did Hitler want the entire corridor, he only wanted an access road through the corridor to Danzig. I’ll skip the Germanophobe work you recommend because I don’t have any questions here, I know the story and Pluto is nothing but a Commie operation.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 8, 2007 at 5:44 PM Poland did not negotiate in good faith, see the monumental The Forced War by David L. Hoggan which is based on his great 1948 Harvard Ph.D thesis done under William L. Langer on how the Brits encouraged Colonel Beck NOT to negotiate and stall because they were going to guarantee Poland’s independence in the event of a German attack. Your nuttiness about massive “concessions” by the Poles is absurd. And the Germans weren’t looking for massive concessions, they had very specific, very limited demands that were unjustified as opposed to Stalin’s seizure of eastern Poland. In fact the only reason Hitler invaded the USSR was to beat Stalin to the punch as the book Stalin’s War documents. There has been quite a bit of revisionist in Germany on this subject by Ernst Nolte and other leading German historians, so far this hasn’t been outlawed by Stalinist “denial” laws put in by Jewish Fascists like yourself.
And why would POLES get to vote on self-determination for the GERMAN city of Danzig ? Even a moron like you should be able to figure out that one. Harry Elmer Barnes was repeatedly approached by Jews in the USA to write more about Polish Jewry before WW2 because many Jews believed, rightly or wrongly, that the Polish Colonels were planning to exterminate Poland’s much larger Jewish population and if you want to know what really happened to Polish Jewry, see Walter N. Sanning’s The Dissolution of East European Jewry, no, they were not gassed.
As far as calling BlondeMike’s wife stupid, you are the pot calling the kettle black. I don’t know her and neither do you. All you can do is regurgitate discredited Stalinist “history” and call people names. You need to look at the history of your tribe going back to ancient times. The Hebrews wiped out the Philistines, Canaanites, Assyrians, Phoenicians and much though not all of the Babylonians. The rest of us do not to listen to moral lectures from your tribesman. They are no better than anyone else and as Carter notes are fostering worse than apartheid in Occupied Palestine. Even assuming that Koestler is wrong in The Thirteenth Tribe when he claims that Ashkenazi Jews are not descended from the ancient Hewbrew tribes.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 8, 2007 at 6:06 PM By the way, I’m not “Jack Barnes” whoever the hell that may be and was never a Trotskyite because he was a mass murderer at Kronstadt and would have been even worse (!) than Stalin had he lived because of his world revolution crap and his even greater mania on forced industrialization and collectivization. Stalin had already murdered 30 million by the time Hitler came to power. One thing I do need to make clear to that racist tiny brain of yours, I’m not pro-German. They probably killed 30 million of each in the Thirty Years Protestant-Catholic Wars.
So I never said nor did Blondie that they weren’t capable of a holocaust but simply that they didn’t do it. At least as conventionally described.
That a million Jews probably died in WW2 was a great tragedy that no one can gainsay. That the conventional six million, gas chamber, centrally planned extermination lie is getting demolished is very healthy and way overdue. It will help liberate your people from their Massada complex and start to bring a semblance of normality which the Zionists promised but never delivered. You can whine and holler and shout and throw all the name calling tantrums that you wish but are dead in the water here and you know it. Some of us get tired of flushing your excrement but will do it until you cease and move on.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 8, 2007 at 6:18 PM The trusteeship set up for “Danzig” was as illegal as everything else in the Versailles Treaty and if the West had worked with Streseman to revise that awful treaty Hitler never would have come to power. Any Poles in Danzig were imported much like the “settlers” in Gaza and East Jerusalem today. Hitler was willing to forget about Alsace-Lorraine, something Weimar wasn’t. In 1870 the French started war with Prussia but got their asses whipped much as you started this debate with Blondie but got yours whipped good and hard.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 8, 2007 at 6:24 PM Shitcago, go to the ihr.org website today (1-8-7) and see Stalin’s Jews,
reprinted from ynetnrews.com site in Israel, edited by Sever Plocker.
They show that the greatest murderers of modern times were Jewish
when they served Stalin in the 20s, 30s and 40s. No disputing this history.
Mao did exceed them though.
Also check out an interview with Gotz Aly in Germany on his new book
on the welfare state origins of national socilaism. Aly is not a revisionist
which makes his book all that more unique. The Nation did a hatchet job
“review” by Evans but just what we all expect from the old popular front party liners…...........................sad.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 8, 2007 at 8:10 PM None of the so called sources you mentioned are legitimate scholarly history by legitimate scholars but hate propaganda by shitforbrains fascist liars like yourself. First the plebicite was for the political fare of the 16 counties of the Polish corridor not for the actual city of danzig itself. Danzig was a “free” city under LON trusteeship. This was not illegal as the city itself was in dispute due to its mixed population and its being geographically embedded in Polish territory. The entire Polish corridor was more than three quarters Polish. Colonel Beck who was Poland’s foreign minister did negotiate in good faith. He didn’t want to relinquish the corridor in return for worthless Nazi promises of territorial guarantees because that would be the end of Polish sovereignty and would lead to the encirclement of Poland. The Nazis demanded a massive population shift involving millions of people as well as the territory of the entire corridor. Poland would be cut off from the Baltic except for a tiny port built by the Poles at Gydinia north of danzig which would in any case be an island surrounded by german territory cut off from Poland itself. The Polish corridor was a red herring for Hitler and a smokescreen for a major land grab. When the final offer was made to the poles by Ribbontrop Hitler had already decided on War and in any case the offer was a ridiculous ultimatum denounced even by the reactionary Nazi sympathizer Neville Henderson. The poles negotiated in good faith but the germans did not. They Nazified Danzig and expelled over 10,000 of the 12,000 Jews of Danzig despite the fact that the Jewish community always solidly supported either free status for Danzig or German sovereignty. All opposed Polish control. By 1938 the Nuremberg restrictions were extended to the Jews of Danzig and by 1939 the few remaining Danzig Jews were rounded up and deported to death camps.
In the aftermath of WWI there were many population shifts on the European continent due to the refugee crisis, the collapse of the continental empires, rapid political change, and economic collapse in various places. The polish and jewish populations of Pomerania and Poznan as well as Danzig grew quickly. This is one reason why Danzig was in dispute.
The Nazi blitz against Poland was both unnecessary and unjustified. The UK and others knew it was coming and did nothing to stop it. Over 644,000 Poles were killed in the initial fighting until Poland’s early surrender. By the end of the war over six million polish citizens, half polish half jewish would be killed by the Nazis. The Nazis also deported over 1.5 million Poles east to the reich for forced labor. I guess you think that is ok. Hitler’s insanity wrecked Europe and opened the world up for more political instability and more destruction. Your claim that Stalin killed hundreds of millions of people is testimony to your mental illness. I don’t know what kind of a creature you are but pathetic would just about describe it. There are lots of neo-fascists coming out of the woodwork today who want to blame all kinds of people for their inadequacies and failings. I guess yer one of ‘em. How sad. But seriously, you need to study real history not fascist lies.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 9, 2007 at 7:40 AM First, prove your assertion about my sources. David L. Hoggan was awarded his Doctorate in European History under the aegis of Dr. William L. Langer for precisely his thesis on the untenability of the UK-Franco guarantee to the demented Polish Colonel Beck which stiffened
his resolve not to negotiate in good faith over the German held territory taken illegally by the Treaty of Versailles. Alfred John Percival Taylor is considered the leading British historian of the Twentieth Century and was a violent Germanophobe & leftist opponent of so-called “apeasement” during the late 1930s. For him to conclude that Germany was not responsible entirely for the war but there was plenty of blame to go around was astounding and the critics who challenged him in the
early 60s such as Hugh Trevor-Roper were cut to pieces in BBC debates with Taylor.
That you can stupidly write that these sources are illegitmate is an astounding indication of the low level of either your personal morality or actual intelligence.
Danzig was a German city illegally taken from Germany by the infamous Versailles Treaty. Poland did not negotiate in good faith as you can see from Hoggan’s The Forced War, a 1965 book which grew out of his doctoral thesis, Taylor’s The Origins Of The Second World War and see the liberal British-American scholar Francis Neilson’s The Tragedy of Europe, a massive five volume day by day diary of the Second World War published by C.C. Nelson in Appleton, WI. Neilson was an associate of Churchill’s in the old Liberal Party before WW2. He also wrote the highly scholarly The Churchill Legend in 1954, the first revisionist look at Churchill and has now been updated by David Irving’s massive two volume Churchill’s War. Both the Neilson and Irving works go heavily into the German-Polish crisis which was the catalyst for WW2, thanks largely to Churchill and the pro-war Tories & demented Stalinist Labourites. Danzig’s “free city” status was just the arbitrary given to it by the League of Nations under the Versailles Treaty, it doesn’t mean that it was freely governed according to the wishes of the inhabitants. The Germans had no interest in taking over the Polish populated territory of the Corridor, they merely wanted a road to Danzig, it was the Poles that wanted a rigged plebiscite. The Danzig Jews were not rounded up and sent to death camps nor did the GERMANS deport millions of Poles to the east, that was your idol Stalin who used the crisis to seize half of Poland. Nor was Hitler the sole reason for plunging Europe into chaos, Stalin, FDR, Churchill, Laval, Beck had as much or more blame. Now where did I write that Stalin killed “hundreds of millions” I wrote tens of millions, you moron. Probably 50 million total but Solzhenitsyn gives the total Soviet death toll under Communism as 100 million.
Mao killed at least 80 million. You can’t read anymore carefully than you can think.
Poland was not entitled to any sort of port on the Baltic. The population facts on the ground argued otherwise. So the murderous fascist Junta of Poland was going to be landlocked ? So what ?
So is most of eastern Europe.
“Real” history coming from lying old Communist Fronters like you ?
PULEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZEEEEEEE.
Whether Hitler’s blitzkreig was necessary or not is the only half-arguable point you made in your
silly propaganda tirade, he probably could have waited. That Danzig’s Jews preferred the Germans
to the Poles underscores the point that I made yesterday on the Polish Junta & their attitude toward
the Jews.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 9, 2007 at 6:04 PM Communist Fronters like you should have given more consideration to the consequences of another world war before you mindlessly egged one on. Poland went into Soviet slavery, China into Soviet slavery under Mao which got progressively worse leading to at least 80 million deaths
directly due to Communist policies and probably over 100 million. Half of the 80 million deaths were in the Great Leap Forward in 1958-62 and the current estimate of only three million deaths in the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution (1966-76) is absurdly low. At least as many died in that as the Great Leap Forward. The horrible decolonization after the war lead to tyrants and cannibals coming to power in most of Africa, radical Communists in Asia and half of Europe behind an Iron Curtain, the total state over here under the Welfare-Warfare State aegis which has been in place ever since. The disastrous rise of Black Power and identity politics which has destroyed the progressive cause in the USA and so forth. Definitely NOT a “good war.” By the way, the Congress in Chile asked the military to dissolve Allende’s government because he was leading them toward totalitarian tyranny a la Cuba. And you were one of the Ho Ho Ho Chi Minh crowd in 68 and Daley beat your asses but good ! Bravo for him !
Why don’t you stop hiding behind that cabbie moniker and reveal your real identity ?
You are a lowlife coward, no two ways about it. I should be paid for cleaning your public bowel
movements every morning.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 9, 2007 at 6:22 PM Shitcago, the huge shovel is here waiting for another load from those decrepit bowels of yours….....................................
David Irving wrote in Uprising ! that the Stalinist Hungarian Party hacks like you had faces that looked like hemorrhoids….........................
Maybe your hemorrhoids look like Scorp’s or Redhorse’s face…......
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 9, 2007 at 11:26 PM Shitcago, AIPAC does control Congress, they can get 95 Senators and 400 Representatives to sign ANY thing for Israel any day of the week. The oil companies do NOT benefit from our Israel First policy there and they were not the ones urging Bush to invade Iraq. AIPAC and the heavily
Jewish Neocon Zionist Racists were the ones. Israel is NOT a surrogate, that is the old bullshit Chomsky line which was totally demolished by his fellow Jew Jeff Blankfort in an essay & debate.
The costs of a quarter trillion in aid to Israel since 1967 largely and the loss of goodwill in the Arab world MORE than cancel any service that Israel allegedly renders the USA. There IS such a thing as massive Jewish power in this society and it is NOT being used for the benefit of 99% of all Americans. The absurd idea that only white males can be villains is itself deeply racist. Jews can be as bad or as good as anyone else. The definition of an anti-Jewish person used to correctly refer to people who Jews qua Jews. Now thanks to the ADL and left nuts like you it means anyone who is hated by some Jews. Or even many Jews. It’s an irrational definition. It’s also funny that people like you who apologize for THE HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS KILLED BY THE COMMUNISTS ALL OVER THE WORLD GET BENT OUT OF SHAPE IF ANYONE SUBTRACTS A FEW DIGITS FROM THE PHONY SIX MILLION FIGURE. Chomsky went to great lengths to whitewash Pol Pot’s murder of three million Cambodians and Ho’s murder of at least a million Vietnamese after 1954. Not to mention Mao’s murders of 100 million Chinese and Stalin’s murders of at least 50 million in the former USSR. I’m not denying the US support of murderous rightist regimes all over the world but I notice little shitbirds like you favor the murders by international socialists (Reds) but get bent out of shape at alleged murders by national socialists (Browns.) Something to do with WHOM the alleged victims were ? Hmmmm.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 10, 2007 at 7:24 PM Your sources have been delegitimized by most professional historians. Hoggan and Irving are self-professed anti-semites and pro-fascist. Poland never gave the Nazis an excuse to invade and occupy it, kill nearly 7 million of its citizens and deport over a million and a half east to the Reich for slave labor. As a libertarian I realize slave labor appeals to you which only means that you and your scum libertarian ilk are, in truth, only fascists. The transference of Danzig to league trusteeship was a compromise position between leaving it in German hands or giving it to Poland. You say Poland deserved no outlet to the sea. You are a racist. Of course they did. Gdansk was always in dispute. There are many places in Eastern Europe which have tremendous german communities. This is not an excuse to invade them and annex territory to the Reich. The far flung Volkdeutsch were never mistreated by their non-german neighbors or they would have left. In fact they tended to be more prosperous and have at least the same rights as their non-german neighbors. I don’t know any germanophobe historians. I guess that means historian that tells the truth about German fascism and aggression. The world sat by while germany spent almost seven years violating human rights, engaging in illegal aggression, murdering innocent people, and developing an ten million man army with which to bully her neighbors. All the while there was no anti-Nazi boycott, no reaction to Germany’s violations of the Versailles treaty anyhow or even other aspects of international law, no embargo of germany, complete appeasement of all Hitler’s demands, and utter UK encouragement of the Poles to accept Germany’s final offer on the Polish corridor even though it was outrages and even though the British well knew of Hitler’s likely plans to invade Poland regardless of Colonel Beck’s response. In addition, foreign US capital flowed like water into Nazi Germany before and althrough the War despite German aggression. Standard Oil even tried to sue the US government for damages to their fuel bunkers in Nazi Germany from allied air raids!! I’ll bet you would have awarded them the damages!! There was absolutely no excuse for germany’s massive and relentless campaign of murder, plunder, enslavement, and other criminality. They were racist like you and the ignorant writers who now misguide you.
On the pacific side the Japanese had been engaged in a three and a half decades long campaign of pillage, colonization, rape, and murder in the Pacific Rim. No objections from the allies there until pearl harbor. Teddy Roosevelt even resolved the 1905 Russo-Japanese War in favor of Japan giving Japan full and undisputed control of the entire Korean Peninsula. 1905 was the year that began the Japanese colonization of Korea. Teddy legitimated Japanese aggression. He got a fuckin’ Nobel Prize for his obscene efforts as well. What Japan did to the rest of Asia is well known!! Mao was a direct outgrowth of Japanese terror. So was Ho Chi Minh. French colonialism was quite brutal but it was Japan and their partners in crime Vichy which provoked the armed resistence of the Viet Minh. By the Way if anyones figures of casualties make no sense it is yours. If Stalin killed 100million people that would come to over one third of the Russian population at the time, highly implausible!!
Mike you are a fascist who hates equality and admires dictatorship of the strong over the weak. You are simply expressing your fascist inclinations. You are very sick. It is testimony to ITT’s low standards that they allow you to continue to post. The people in Oakland knew better. They kicked your sorry ass off the blog!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 11, 2007 at 6:11 PM You keep repeating your undocumented assertions. The compromise solution was a nonstarter because it was German territory that the League had no more authority to interfere in than the
successor UN did to create Israel in 1947. After WW2 over FIFTEEN MILLION GERMANS WERE EXPELLED FROM THEIR ANCESTRAL HOMELANDS BY THE CZECHS AND POLES AND OVER THREE MILLION DIED IN THE PROCESS AS WAS DOCUMENTED BY THE US INSTALLED BONN OCCUPATION GOVT IN 1960. SO MUCH FOR YOUR ASSERTION THAT THE GERMANS WERE NEVER MISTREATED BY THEIR NEIGHBORS AND SO MUCH FOR YOUR GENERAL RELIABILITY ON ANY MATTERS HISTORICAL. The Germans from 1933-39 (six years, not seven) were declared war upon by international Jewish organizations and constantly condemned for their anti-Jewish policies but were NOT guilty of mass murder while the Soviets under largely Jewish auspices in the NKVD were MURDERING TENS OF MILLIONS OF UKRAINIANS, CHECHENS, RUSSIANS, LATVIANS, ESTONIANS, LITHUNIANS, ETC. Better go cry that unique persecution of the Jews while the world stood silent BIG LIE someplace else. See Dr. James J. Martin’s two volume
American Liberalism and World Politics, 1931-41, for a factual review of the enormous ongoing condemnation of Germany versus the silence or worse over the much greater terror in the USSR.
You advance no reasons to back up your assertion that Poland deserved an outlet to the sea ? If they didn’t have an outlet to the sea and they didn’t, how could they deserve one ? I might as well
claim that I deserve a yacht. At whose expense ? Danzig was NEVER in dispute because it was always part of Germany. You give no reason again for your assertion that Hitler would have invaded Poland if the Danzig issue had been settled. The Brits obviously believed he would NOT have which is why they pressured Beck not to negotiate in good faith, see Taylor and Hoggan again here.
There was a HUGE anti-Nazi boycott in the 30s, again you brazenly lie at every turn. Nor was there massive US big business support for Hitler, that was debunked in a 1977 review by James J. Martin of Bircher Antony Sutton’s trashy Hitler and The Rise of Wall Street. I was never on a website in Oakland, moron. I live in Honululu. Hardesty already responded to this by showing that he was only removed from ONE private website run by a Demo Party hack who habitually blacklisted all of her enemies. And that goofy broad died right after that. And everyone in Oakland celebrated according to Mike. And I have no reason to disbelieve that as his credibilty seems good while yours is nonexistent.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 11, 2007 at 7:45 PM US capital NEVER flowed “like water” before WW2 and certainly not during WW2 as Martin, Turner & others have demonstrated. See Burton J. Klein’s Germany’s Economic Preparations For War which demonstrated that Germany recovery was a welfare state Keynesian recovery, NOT a primarily military one. Japan WAS SMALL POTATOES COMPARED TO WESTERN IMPERIALISM BEFORE WW2. See Ralph Townsend’s Asia Answers and Ways That Are Dark published before WW2. He was a US diplomat in China and totally debunks the good Chinese, bad Japanese myths
created by the usual Communist “anti-fascist” morons. Whatever atrocities the Japs perpetrated in China at Nanking, etc., were SMALL POTATOES COMPARED TO BOTH CHIANG AND MAO MUCH LARGER ATROCITIES BEFORE, DURING AND AFTER THE WAR. I wrote that historians now credit Stalin with 50 million deaths, not 100 million. MAO KILLED 100 MILLION. Solzhenitsyn claims over 100 million victims of communism in the USSR during its entire history. Apparently you can read no clearer than you can think. Mao has a hardened Communist long before ANY Japanese terror as was Ho, both were international Communist agents under Stalin’s thumb as early as the EARLY TWENTIES. You remind me of the leftists who try to blame Nixon for Pol Pot’s genocide of three million Cambodians. I don’t know Mike’s political philosophy but I am a libertarian and very
anti-fascist. I don’t “hate” equality because like “god” it doesn’t exist, the very concept makes no sense. You are like those hundreds of perjurers who testified against Demdanjuck in Israel AND THEY ALL TURNED OUT TO BE LYING PERJURERS. Nuremberg or OJ type liars. BTW, the “seven million” Poles killed by Nazis figures is as fraudulent as the six million hoax. Millions were killed on all sides, IT WAS A WORLD WAR, DUMBASS, AND GERMANY WAS FIGHTING ON THREE FRONTS. THE ALLIES KILLED MUCH MORE WHICH IS WHY THEY WON THE WAR. Spare me your
amateur psychobabble and try to remember WHO you are addressing, I’m JACK, not “Hardesty” or
Mike. They probably got weary of repeating themselves and left you to fester in your own slimey
shitpile. ITT lets you post so you’d better be more respectful, “Chicago Cabbie.” Next time I fly to the mainland and land at O’Hare I’ll be sure not to tip the cabbie.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 11, 2007 at 8:04 PM Japan never approached the levels of French or Dutch or British or Belgian brutality. Ho was a Japanese collaborator as was Sukarno. So was Diem. All Asians hailed the Japanese victories over the vicious western colonialists. At the time Japan invaded to ward off a much worse Communist takeover Hitler was arming Chiang. The German General Staff trained the Chinese Nationalist Army. So much for the international fascist conspiracy and during WW2 the Japs were neutral in Hitler’s battle against the USSR. The Soviets only declared on Japan AFTER the US dropped the first atomic bomb on Hiroshima and that was motivated by Soviet agents in the Truman Admin like Harry Dexter White (nee Weiss.) Germans committed their share of war crimes but no worse than the US or the USSR or the UK or Chiang. There would have been no plunder if there had been no WW2. And there would have been no world war without Chamberlain & Churchill’s insane guarantee to Poland which they knew was untenable when the made it. McCarthy, our greatest US Senator, exposed the US Army’s incredible torture atrocities at the farce called the Malmedy “Trials.” Any Nazi atrocity and there were plenty is more than matched by Soviet & Allied atrocities. The Nazis and the Japs WERE bad, WE WERE WORSE. Oh, I guess this wasn’t the history for the sheeple that you imbibed growing up, eh ? Too bad. No wonder no intelligent Jewish woman would touch you with the proverbial ten foot pole. I notice that you still evade 90% of the points that I do make. Probably just as well because I have to spend an enormous amount of time just rebutting the lies you do write. By the way the whole world Jewish community celebrated the Japanese victory over Russia in 1905. As did almost everyone else. I’m no TR fan but he was correct here. You are a real stupid ass.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 11, 2007 at 8:21 PM There are plenty of Germanophobe historians including plenty of trained seals in Occupied Germany since 1945. If you haven’t heard of Taylor then you are more ignorant than even I thought you were. Your “historians” are Zionist Racists and Communist hacks who ply the same old discredited “good war” tune except it wasn’t a good war as even leftist Jews like Zinn and Terkel now acknowledge. Read Finkelstein’s great book The Holocaust Industry. For starters. BTW, Hoover’s Secty of State, Stimson, tried as hard as he could to get US into a war with Japan over Manchuria in 1931 but Hoover was anti-war. Later Stimson became Secty of War in the FDR War Criminal Administration. The China Missionary Lobby tried to also get us in war with Japan so your history of Asia is as uninformed and plain wrong as your European history. You are the original Popular Front Stalinophile Stupid Ass.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 11, 2007 at 8:30 PM You are a stupid racist of monumental proportions. You act as if the Western colonial powers had nothing to do with the failure of decolonization in many cases. UK and France never stopped playing a major role in Africa and the Middle East. Many of these dictators got military and economic aid from the European community.You never prove your assertions you just name call people and throw out wildly unsubstantiated figures. You are sick and fascistic. All fascists like you are morons. Your answer to everything is to go into a completely irrelevant rant about how many people Stalin and Mao killed. You want to argue for saving Social Security? Nutcase goes into a rant about Stalin. You oppose tax cuts for the rich because they won’t help the economy and are inequitable? More shit about Stalin and his Gulags without any references to the possible relevance it has for US fiscal policy. Then we get the defense of Hitler’s foreign policy. It’s wearing thin. Hardesty, you are a pathetic shit with a small brain. Sad indeed.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 12, 2007 at 9:49 AM Jack what are you saying? Jewish women only date anti-semite fascists. Your history is all wrong by the way. So are the jerks you read. They are not respected historians. To blame german attack on Poland on UK/French pact that was all but defunct. No historian does that. Not even Ernst Nolte who is as right wing as you can get. The Malmedy trials were legit. the Nazis killed 84 disarmed US soldiers after they surrendered during the battle of the bulge. the nazis were much worse than the allies. you are just biased toward fascism like most libertarians. Hitler had NO legitimate claims and yet he was allowed to conquer all the territory Germany lost as a result of the Versailles treaty. Germany invaded every country of europe except switzerland, spain, and portugal. What was the excuse? Of course the US/UK allies had to stop him. He was the biggest threat to freedom ever in history. Stalin at least minded his own business.
Japan completely plundered the Pacific Rim. The US stood by and did nothing. You blame the allies for WWII as is the Noontide Press line. These people are fascist crackpots who will never get a teaching job. Irving is done. No one listens to him except lowlife wankers who read the Zundel website and the National Alliance blogs.
Lowlife, the reason that Hitler attacked Poland is because he was appeased to the hilt and didn’t expect any reaction from the West. Even the Brits stood by while all Hitler’s aggression took place. As every moron knows, the Brits advised the Poles to accept the last and most outrages offer of Ribbontrop knowing of Hitler’s plans in Aug. 1939 to attack Poland regardless of Beck’s response. Anyone who makes apologies for Hitler is ignorant of History. Fascism if too oppressive to be sustainable. Communism lasted for a long time because of its sustainability. It met Human needs and defended the nation against fascist pillage and aggression. Chalmers Johnson, in his brilliant “Peasant Nationalism and Communist Power” proves beyond all doubt that the Japanese invasion and occupation of China was the source of the Maoist military and hence political victory. In Vietnam this could also be said. Ho’s Chief General Vo Nguyen Giap was trained at the Wampoa Military Academy in China. Many US generals and military experts deem him one of the greatest military minds in History. he defeated the French at Dien Bien Phu and the US by 1975. He also helped in defeating Japan. For over three decades he planned and executed the defeats of three of the strongest, most advanced military powers in the industrial world. Fascism was never popular but communism was for a long time. I still hear praise for the old system. It was much better than the kind of exploitation that is going on now. Since 1989 there has been war and genocide in europe and the former soviet republics. There is also outmigration because of economic instability. Many of the old Russians pine for socialism. This is a fact. It is also true that many Chinese workers hate the current system of capitalist globalization in China. They to feel they have experienced very little benefit from China’s economic growth and from the more than half a trillion in direct foreign investment over the past 25 years. Your ideas about communism are wrong. Communism made great progress in many of these countries.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 12, 2007 at 10:21 AM According to Charles Higham who wrote “Trading with the Enemy” the US had about $475 million worth of direct investments in Nazi Germany when the US entered the War. This represented about 8% of total US direct foreign investment in 1941. It probably accounted for more than half of total FDI in Nazi Germany at the time. There were over a dozen US firms doing business there at the time. It helped sustain Hitler’s war drive. It also enriched US capitalists.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 12, 2007 at 10:58 AM Higham’s book is worthless, same old Popular Front sensationalism. The reason Hitler attacked Poland was their failure to negotiate in good faith. That “appeasement” bogey is a Communist invented anti-concept. See the chapter on Munich in Taylor’s Origins that I have previously referred you to. Japan did not completely plunder the Pacific Rim, our noble allies did that and I have already referred you to the Townsend books on the pre-war situation in eastern Asia. Asia Answers And Ways That Are Dark. The US actively conspired to start a world war in the Pacific because Hitler wasn’t taking FDR’s bait in the North Altantic, that is why he and the other traitor General Marshall set up Pearl Harbor, see the book of the same name by Georege Morgenstern. See Perpetual War For Perpetual Peace by Harry Elmer Barnes, see President Roosevelt and The Coming Of The War, 1941 by Charles Austin Beard. Porter Sargent’s Getting US Into War and Frederic Sanborn’s Design For War and John T. Flynn’s The Roosevelt Myth are all GREAT works and cover all the themes in your rants in addition to Taylor and Hoggan and Townsend. Communism WAS AN UTTER DISASTER IN EVERY COUNTRY IT HAS EVER BEEN TRIED IN. POVERTY, CENSORSHIP, OUTLAWING OF ALL POLITICAL DISSENT, CONCENTRATION CAMPS, POLITICAL PRISONS, INTERNAL PASSPORT, RATIONING, MASS REFUGEES, MASS EXTERMINATIONS ON A SCALE UNPRECEDENTED IN WORLD HISTORY AND PERPETUAL SLAVERY ARE COMMUNISM’S LEGACY EVERYWHERE AND ONLY A TWISTED DEMENTED PERSON LIKE YOU WHOSE LOINSMEN KILLED AT LEAST THIRTY MILLION RUSSIANS AS A PIECE IN ISRAEL RECENTLY DOCUMENTED ON STALIN’S JEWISH MASS MURDERERS WOULD TRY TO DEFEND THAT AWFUL TOTALITARIAN SYSTEM. Shitcago, you are a piece of shit and I’m ashamed of you. You invent BOGUS atrocities and IGNORE the real ones. The Malmedy Trials were Not legitimate because they were based on extreme torture and coerced, bogus confessions. No matter what the Germans did and the US Army COMMITTED GREATER ATROCITIES THAN MALMEDY MANY TIMES OVER, that torture is not permitted or even recognized as legal anywhere but shitty fascist Israel.
Jewish women HATE your ilk, they are intermarrying at rates from 50 to 80% and the “pure” Jewish race myth is going for assimilation and hooray for that ! Decolonization was a leftist fraud from the beginning promoted by leftists in the West with their colored folks front stooges. It could have been stopped anytime if leftists had not been in control of all western governments since that degenerate
FDR. Lying little faker. The rate of US investment in Germany was quite small as demonstrated by James J. Martin and Henry J. Turner, part of Stalin’s Popular Front mythology to link capitalism to fascism. Another BIG LEFT LIE. Most of Mao’s arms came from Stalin’s seizure of Manchuria and from captured Nationalist supplies. The Japs did hurt Chiang since Chiang did all the fighting while
Mao sat his cowardly ass in caves so in that sense only Japan helped Mao.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 12, 2007 at 5:52 PM Fascism was hugely popular in Italy and National Socialism was even much mre hugely popular in Germany & Austria. They LOVED Hitler as the left progressive savior from capitalism with his Keynesian economics welfare state program. The 1920 Nazi Platform read like FDR’s 1944 Demo Platform, Fascism is as much a left as a right program as a Israeli historian demonstrated. Franco was hugely popular after beating the Communist degenerates of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade who were ALL Stalinist swine who murdered anarchists in the back. The French were never defeated at
Dien Bien Phu, they were stabbed in the back by their leftist govt of that swine Mendes-France and Ike over here. They were outnumbered 20 to 1 and still held off for months. A piece of lowlife
Communist garbage like you wouldn’t understand the meaning of courage. Glad Dick Daley BEAT your stinky Ho Ho Ho Chi Minh asses but good in 1968, best that happened that year outside of a couple of very welcome eliminations of Comsymps. Every territorial claim of Hitler was IDENTICAL with Weimar and so recognized by most of the West. It was a traditional German foreign policy as Taylor demonstrates, nothing particularly Nazi qua Nazi about it but yet psychotics in your tribe and a few goyim numbskulls act like Hitler was monster number one WHEN HIS KILLINGS WERE NEXT TO NOTHING COMPARED TO MAO, STALIN, POL POT AND YOUR OTHER COMMIE HEROES. How do explain that total hypocrisy ? And a piece of decadent excrement like you is going to lecture me on intelligence, morality and sanity ?????????????? You better piss up a rope little boy Portnoy wacking off in your decrepit rattle trap gypsy cab ! I know in person you’d sing a different tune. COWARD. At 6:15am Hawaii time reading your nonsense can get one’s blood going.
Final point, Germany would NOT have been in any European country if the UK and France had not declared WAR on them for invading Poland and the ONLY reason they invaded Poland was because the UK & France & piece of shit FDR forbade the Poles to negotiate in good faith. Hitler very decently permitted the Brits to escape at Dunkirk, that was no “miracle.” I should be compensated for educating a stupid ass like you.
Again, ASSHOLE, I’m not “Hardesty.” You can’t even read straight.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 12, 2007 at 6:14 PM Shitcago cabbie, you jack off one more time into my centennial edition of Atlas Shrugged and I’m tearing the hairs out of your balls one by one. You can’t even get a shiksa whore to go out with you. Pathetic little Zionist-Racist-Stalinist.
Posted by hawaii jack on Jan 13, 2007 at 2:18 AM Poles negortiated in good faith. Beck didn’t have the backing of the UK and France who later capitulated to Hitler without a fight. Hitler would have invaded Poland no matter what. This has been proven. You state that Nazis were tortured into confessing to crimes in EVERY warcrimes trial so you can deny crimes. This is a false and cowardly approach to “history” which you know nothing about anyhow. The Nazis were never tortured before any trials or this would have come out. No reliable source has ever claimed that Nazis were tortured. It is another fascist lie. You are one sick fuck to support Nazism. It just shows the manner in which libertarians are fascists in disguse!!
Poland had total freedom to negortiate. The UK and France encouraged Colonel Beck to accept Ribbontrop’s final offer which was outragous. The Nazis wanted Poland to expell millions of the Polish citizens in Polish controlled Pomerania to make room for volkdeutsch in a population exchange whereby poles would be resettled elsewhere, relinquish all baltic coast except for Gdynia which would be an island cut off from Poland, turn Danzig over to germany (along with Pomerania) which was not in the powers of Poland to do since Danzig was legally a League of Nations international trustee, allow Nazis to create a superhwy and railway through the corridor and polish towns with a one kilometer wide extra-territorial buffer around them to be controlled by Nazis, and extend 1934 German/Polish Friendship treaty with nazis. These are the most outragous demands in history. The germans knew the Poles couldn’t and wouldn’t accept the offer. It was tantamount to military defeat. What right did germany have to bully and invade Poland killing millions of innocent people. You are an asshole for even spewing the line of these moronic so called “historians” who are pro-Nazi.
Despite this the UK/France allies encouraged the Poles to accept the offer. Beck was even many considering the population exchange at one point for parts of eastern Pomorze. The Polish government agreed to allow a german rail system across Pomorze to link east prussia as well as german control of Danzig which the Nazis already had by virtue of the city council elections. They even agreed to german access to east prussia through the corridor via a 25 km wide transportation link. The real problem as even conservative historians see it is that the allies appeased Hitler to much and didn’t threaten a credible use of force when they had the chance. It would have been effective. Hitler would have been overthrown by German opposition were it not for Chamberlain’s undying support and appeasement. Chamberlain sympathized with Nazi anti-bolshevism.
Hardesty you are a schizophrenic moron. Why don’t you explain how your so called “libertarianism” jibes with your anti-semitic, white supremicist views of history and society. Your hate filled generalizations and smeers give you away as a stupid racist. If this is the basis of your value system you are a pathetic individual and not a legitimate thinker at all. By the Way, I would like to take the opportunity to suggest a REAL revisionist work of scholarship on WWII diplomatic history. Try the Monthly Review classic by Clement Leibowitz and Alvin Finkel called “IN OUR TIME” on Hitler and the Allies in the run up to the invasion of Poland. It is enlightening to say the very least!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 13, 2007 at 4:53 AM I’m so glad that you have conceded on all points that Hawii Jack and I have made. Yes, Beck did not negotiate in good faith as Taylor and Hoggan prove. Beck totally had the backing of the UK and France as history notes. Glad we agree here. Danzig was legally, culturally and morally a German city as you now concede. The League was a fraud and a farce like its successor UN, and the Versailles Treaty the same even as Comrade Stalin noted. It’s true that the Poles NEVER agreed to the type of corridor that facilitate easy access to Danzig, a German city and it’s also true that German demands for a friendship treaty were right in line with the far greater Polish fears of Soviet Russia. You are right that none of these respected historians were ever pro-national socialists and you right are that the blood of millions in Poland and elsewhere rests on the Poles themselves for delusions of grandeur in fighting a necessary revision of Versailles AND mainly the Brits, that the anti-Jewish Churchill as well as the French state was primarily responsible for WW2. Glad we finally agree. Yes, there was severe torture at Nuremberg and all other farce trials as Veale, Irving and Porter prove. As Joe McCarthy proved in spades about Malmedy with the support of two American Judges. Yes, it is true that many vile Jews were among the torturers and that two named by McCarthy later went on to murder a Soviet Jewish woman at the Soviet UN Mission around 1970 or 71 via the JDL. Yes, it is true that 90% of the NKVD Soviet killers of tens of millions of Russians, Ukrainians, Balts, etc., were Jewish but your peoples’ massive genocide has been exceeded by Mao Zedong. Yes, the “holocaust” is a misnamed, lying fraud as Rudolf, Butz, Mattogno, Rassinier, Cole, Burg, Sanning, Verall, Hoggan and Faurisson have proved. Yes, Finkel and Leibowitz are lying hacks with the usual special axes to grind.
I agree that you are intellectually schizoid, the term makes no medical sense, but you are being harsh in labeling yourself as a moron. Yes, it is not anti-Jewish (Semites are Arabs) to bring the GREAT news that no more than probably a million Jews perished in Europe during WW2. I’m glad that you now concede that one does not have to be a supporter of national socialism to recognize the many lies told about Hitler as no one is saying he was a good guy. And yes, most but not all Jews are racist as Israel proves in spades with the mindless support of most US Jews and Christian Zionists. Yes, the ADL and AIPAC should be required to register as Israeli State agents.
I’m glad you are reading Atlas Shrugged and Dissecting The Holocaust, Chicago Cabbie. And I
accept your concession on all points and I’m sure Hawaii Jack would agree.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 16, 2007 at 4:21 PM Again, Chicago Cabbie, thanks for gracious concession on all points. WW2 was a bad war and an unnecessary one as you have noted. The Polish Fascist Junta was worse than Hitler and even more anti-Jewish. Polish Jewry might have met a far worse fate had the Germans not invaded as you have noted. At least most of the Jews in Poland were evacuated by the Soviets who simultaneously invaded Poland. Many Jews left Poland before summer, 1942, the alleged start of the two year “holocaust” from summer 1942 to summer 1944, this is the view of all historians, where revisionists differ is that were no gas chambers, nowhere six million Jews died, there was no centrally planned extermination conspiracy and although Anne Frank was a lovely child her “diary” was concocted after WW2 in a type of ink that didn’t exist during the years of its alleged writing. Jews are no more exempt from historical correction of the record than anyone else. and I fervently agree with you that too many Jews & too many leftists throw around “nazi” and “anti-semite” and “racist” and “fascist” like the Right does “commie” and “pinko.” I also agree with you that the Jewish and liberal habit of psychiatric smears, first attempted by shrinks for the traitor Alger Hiss is deplorable and should be condemned. Thanks again for seeing the light.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 16, 2007 at 6:17 PM The Marxist Monthly Review book that you agree is Stalinist trash is part of that Soviet Cult of the Good War now increasingly discredited as more of the Communist agit-prop that we were all brainwashed with turned out to be either total lies or very partial less than half truths. I wholeheartedly agree with you that the demonization of Hitler needs to end immediately so that we can more appropriately evaluate his good and evil qualities. The Stalinist Show Trials at Nuremberg, Malmedy, Frankfurt and Jerusalem need to be repudiated en toto because they were all contaminated by extreme torture of the defendants as well as gross vulgar perjury by paid professional “witnesses.” You remember the unfortunate Demjanjuk trial in Israel wherein HUNDREDS of Jews testified against him AND THE ISRAELI COURT FOUND OUT THAT THEY WERE ALL LYING. To some degree stereotypes are true, Irish drink, Scots are cheap, Arabs are violent, blacks commit excessive crime and Jews exaggerate normally a great deal. Not all individuals in these groups but enough to validate the general perception. Arthur Butz of your hometown came to revisionism not so much from the early revisionists as by reading the standard “holocaust” literature and getting a kabbalistic feel for the big lie. See the VHO book on Hilberg, The Giant With The Feet Of Clay. Maybe you and I could work on Norm Finkelstein to win him over for holocaust revisionism. He recognizes the utter racket involved but needs to get the whole story. Are you still working on that Recall Emanuel Rahm petition ? That guy wouldn’t enlist in our army during the 91 war but volunteers for the IDF ! How do you spell treason ? 22 of the 23 candidates he recruited for the Dems were pro-war, thank god Duckworth lost in your town. When you think about it the Bund was one of our first popular peace organizations. As a social democrat, what program of HItler’s do you admire most ? Gun control ? Anti-smoking ? Anti-cancer ? National health insurance ? General welfare state measures ? Strict regulation of business and industry ? Summer camps for deprived kids ? The socialist Volkswagen factory ? Anti-porn ? Aid to mothers with newborns ? The great autobahn socialist freeways ? TThe first laws against water and air pollution ? The peace overtures to France by conceding the Alsace-Lorraine ? The generous peace offers to Poland in return for the return of the German city of Danzig ? The principled revision of Versailles at Munich ? The abolition of states rights and centralization of power in the Federal Government ? The vastly expanded Workers’ Compensation program ? Expanded unemployment insurance ? Greatly expanded peaceful public works by Keynesian pump priming ? I mean if we progressives could do have as much here we’d be another Sweden.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 17, 2007 at 12:28 AM The Demjaniuk trial didn’t show the witnesses lied at all. What it showed was that technology hadn’t gotten sophisticated enough to make the trawniki photo clear enough to show it was Ivan. Since it was a murder trial evidence had to be beyond a shadow of a doubt and D was cleared. He was however obviously guilty.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 18, 2007 at 8:08 PM They did lie and they lied bigtime. I actually thought he was guilty until Buchanan and a very few others started to take the prosecution case apart and spared Israel the shame of murdering an innocent man. He was not Ivan, IF there was even an Ivan, and he was acquited of all charges. You’re last sentence is per se libelous as well as inaccurate. You are a lump of shit and please drop dead.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 18, 2007 at 10:32 PM You, sir, are the lump of shit. The witnesses did NOT lie and were not paid or otherwise encouraged to do so. This is enormous disrespect for those who suffered something neither you nor anyone else has ever suffered. You are evil. It is well known that if the trial took place today and with today’s technology instead of in the 1980s Demjaniuk would have been easily convicted. It is also well known that the prosecution, led by the able Micheal Shakhed, made a much stronger case than did the defense. Because it was a capital case all evidence and not just a preponderance of evidence must weigh against the defendant. Hence, the mere failure to establish that Demjaniuk was the one pictured in the trawniki card photo beyond a shadow of a doubt saved one of the world’s most pathelogical mass murderers. This reflects well on Israel as a Democracy. What is unfortunate is that Israel gives more justice to a fascist war criminal than to the Palestinians which it ceaselessly oppresses.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 20, 2007 at 5:37 AM The Israeli High Court not only found that ALL the witnesses lied big time but also that many of the events described by same never took place. This is one very good thing in Israel’s favor that they stepped back before hanging an innocent man and carefully reviewed the facts, something that has yet to be done in a German courtroom since 1945. Obviously an innocent man like John Demjanjuk deserves to be acquited while a Palestinian who commits acts of terrorism, no matter how intolerable the Israeli Occupation, deserves to be convicted. Rather elementary justice that a Stalinist monkey like yourself can’t grasp. The prosecution made A VERY WEAK CASE, AND IT WAS BASED ON THE PERJURED WORK OF NEAL SHER IN THE US DEPT OF INJUSTICE. Sher was later convicted on another matter. If there was full use of current technology ALL the “trials” including Nuremberg, the Auschwitz 1964 trials, Malmedy, etc., would all be vacated. Germar Rudilof has gone way beyond Leuchter in PROVING there were no gas chambers for exterminating humans at Auschwitz, Birkenau, Majdanek, Stutthof, Belzec, etc. There were louse defusing chambers, a legitimate public health measure. The people who made up this Communist inspired crap are suffering, we agree there, but from many years of utter lying. The bad things that happened in WW2 were bad enough and I can guarantee that you would not use your nasty little Portnoy potty mouth to me in person. You are a lowlife and a coward and frankly the Palestinians do not require help from Stalinist liars like you. Go to VHO site and educate yourself for a change rather repeat these mediocre tribal lies ad infinitum. See Norman Dacey’s 1970s work Democracy in Israel for a still valid refutation of the myth of equal Arab rights inside the so-called Green Line. And there several more current works available exposing the myth of Israeli democracy as far as NonJews are concerned. Dacey was a top aid to the war criminal Eisenhower during WW2. But don’t let that prejudice you against his valid work here. One more thing, if it hadn’t been for Pat Buchanan raising hell over this Demjanjuk fraud Israel would have executed an innocent man, this is no credit on Israel per se but mainly to courageous people like Buchanan who stuck in there. I myself originally believed he was guilty and didn’t know how unreliable Neal Sher and those witchhunters in Justice were.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 22, 2007 at 5:28 PM The Israeli high court never determined anyone lied and certainly not the witnesses. Show were this is the case. Were they charged with purgery? Hardesty, you viciously make shit up out of prejudice all the time and you are a moron. Buchanan is a right wing nazi sympathizing anti-semite and is known as such. Quoting him proves nothing. Demjanjuk owes his very life to Israeli integrity and to the slow pace of technological advancement in photo analysis. This is all one needs to know about the case!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 23, 2007 at 6:03 AM The Israeli Trial Court DID indeed determine that many “witnesses” lied which is WHY they acquited Demjanjuk. The witnesses SHOULD have been charged with perjury as they were indeed PERJURERS. Israel wanted to spare itself the embarrassment of having to charge these liars so they just acquited Demjanjuk and let it go at that. No advance in photo technology would render a different verdict, they were way off base in ever charging him and they know it. I blame the criminals at that “nazi witchhunt” division of DOJ more than I do the Israelis. You’re nonargument on Buchanan is circular reasoning, i. e., he’s a nazi because he exposed the fraud of the case against Demjanjuk. ALL one needs to know about the case is that Demjanjuk was acquited. And that is ALL that everyone needs to know about you, Chicago, you’re a total tribal liar. PERIOD.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 23, 2007 at 7:32 PM You’re the “tribal” liar. You belong to the neo-Nazi moron tribe. The Israeli court affirmed the testimony of the eye witnesses. The widely agreed upon reason for aquital was the failure to sufficiently tie Demjanjuk to the picture on the Trawniki Card which was proven not to be a “Soviet Forgery” as alleged by the Defense team. You could not possibly show any evidence of intentional misrepresentation by any of the prosecution witnesses because there was none and none was alleged even by the defense. Your own anti-semitic bigotry is all you have to go on. You are pathetic. You should read the most authoritative text on the subject of the Demjanjuk trial called The Trial of Ivan the Terrible by Tom Teicholz. Most people feel Teicholz was a good source since he is a competant lawyer and legal scholar who witnessed the entire trial from beginning to end. Buchanan never even went to Israel. He probably hates Jews to much and would not really be welcome in that country. I really can’t imagine that asshole trying to speak Hebrew.
Buchanan has admitted to a disdain for Jews!! He has always held them in contempt and says so since he no longer has any ambitions for public office.
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Jan 24, 2007 at 3:41 AM The Israeli Court did NOT affirm the reliability of the witnesses, precisely the opposite. HENCE THE ACQUITAL ON ALL CHARGES. The book you reference is a Party Line Hack work which was totally discredited by the trial events and verdict. Many people did go to Israel for the trial and no one who did sides with you here. Buchanan has never admitted a disdain for Jews and has been to Israel.
Not only were ALL the “witnesses” lying but “Ivan The Terrible” never existed. I would personally be
deeply ashamed of being part of such a group of liars as you are. Hitler himself predicted that a Jewish State in Palestine would be a refuge for scoundrels and that is the UNDERSTATEMENT of the century. Demjanjuk is totally innocent and perjurers like you, cabbie, are the scum of the earth.
Don’t waste our time on this again, you little Portnoy Pod Puller. No wonder Jewish women won’t touch you with a ten foot pole.
Posted by blondemike on Jan 24, 2007 at 5:21 PM BM,
I really don’t know how such a sick creature as yourself could possibly exist. How do you live with yourself. You are pathetic. Hating Jews must consume you and now you want to consume others with hate.
For your information the Israeli high court aquitted Ivan not because the Witnesses testimony was unreliable. You can find no such finding by the court and you know it. You are making stuff up. Typical of holocaust deniers. The aquital was due to the inability of the prosecution to connect Ivan to the picture on the Trawniki Card. Today’s photo enhancement technology would easily connect him to the card on which he is pictured. This would have ended the trial with a conviction. From the very beginning of the trial the defense was filled with anti-semitic inuendo and prejudice. Mark O’Conner maligned Jews in general by associating them with Stalin and the Ukrainian Famine thus implicitly blaming the Jews for the incredible Ukrainian tragedy. I really don’t know who he was attempting to appeal to. Doesn’t seem like a viable legal strategy. He was duly replaced with an Israeli attorney who succeeded in aquitting Ivan.
I find it a supreme irony of history that it took a Jew to secure the aquital of a monstrous goy who has the blood of over 800,000 Jews on his hands. You goyim are so inept you can’t even defend your own monsters even when they kill Jews. You rely on the more adept Jews. You’re the pathetic ones!!
Posted by cabdriverinchicago on Feb 3, 2007 at 9:41 AM Chicago, thanks for your gracious concession here. As you now admit you have been wrong on all particulars, thus all generalities. As you know the Israeli Court found all the “witnesses” were interminable liars which is why they acquited Demjanjuk and sent him home. Go to the ihr and vho websites for more details on this. This was the first and only honest “Holocaust” trial, the very name a big lie because no Jews were killed by fire but MILLIONS of Germans and Japanese were by Allied War Criminals. As you now acknowledge all the heads of the GPU aka NKVD aka KGB under Lenin and Stalin were Jewish and they killed tens of millions of Ukrainians, Russians, Balts, etc. Yiddish was spoken in the Stalin household and so-called “anti-semitism” was made a capital offense. Stalin didn’t turn on the Jews till 1950 and even then they were never persecuted as other groups have been. The persecution of Soviet Jewry was hyped by neocons over here with only a very small basis in reality. The photo equipment of today would exonerate Demjanjuk as you now acknowledge. Of course, the “800,000” figure is pure bullshit, that would be 12% of the phony “holocaust” total of “six million.” Even credulous fools should see through this imposture.
Finally I’m sorry that you’re shiksa has crabs but is that something that you should be sharing with us ?
Posted by blondemike on Feb 5, 2007 at 6:40 PM Page 1 of 1 pages -
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