In November, Kurt Vonnegut turned 80. He published his first novel, Player Piano, in 1952 at the age of 29. Since then he has written 13 others, including Slaughterhouse Five, which stands as one of the pre-eminent anti-war novels of the 20th century. As war against Iraq looms, I asked Vonnegut, a reader and supporter of this magazine, to weigh… return to article
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Reader Comments (948)I am a long time fan of Mr. Vonnegut. I can’t agree more with his estute take on what has/is happening to this country. “W” is trying to merge church and state- which scares the devil out of me. Once done, we will be a theocracy with more self-rightious bigots running things. Then what? Religious wars? Ethnic clensing? Frightening!
Posted by Steven Taylor on Jun 4, 2003 at 12:35 PM It’s nice to see people (not only mr. vonnegut, but the readers also) who have a sense of obligation to sanity. George W. Bush is as comforting as snow angels over warm piss on fresh snow. How can there be a single person who supports this guy? We may all die tommorow...National security my asshole...In the words of Gandhi..."An eye for an eye would leave the whole blind” george you fucking puppet with millionaires taking turns sticking their hand up your ass and bobbing you around on stage raping my humanity and sucking the life and energy out of the world.
Posted by Sanjiv on Jun 5, 2003 at 10:20 PM How come I can’t express myself like Kurt when every word I read in this piece seems as if he is speaking my mind? However, I will keep on with “peace work” because I believe in hope for the world. If we aren’t annihilated perhaps we may have a chance to evolve into fully human beings! The question is: how do we educate for peace and justice? It sure looks grim.
Posted by Phyllis Wax on Jun 6, 2003 at 9:13 AM Phyllis, just a thought: if we only educate for peace and justice and our enemies educate for our demise, which outcome is more likely?
Posted by Jakub Ciring on Jun 6, 2003 at 4:35 PM After reading through all of the above, I cannot but help think of a question posed by the late Thomas Merton - am unable to remember what book it was from - but, given the hate, and hope, posted here for the last six months - it becomes apparent that Mr. Vonnegut also, for the past half centruy has been asking the same question:
“What will our answer be when pain comes to examine us?”
Posted by droid - union electrician on Jun 6, 2003 at 6:27 PM k-v, I just bought this morons book from Easton Press, I paid 75.00 bucks for it. I read it and find out he’s a communist, and a liberal idiot. then I read this stupid “interview” (by the way try to not put your opinions in the questions) I can not wait for this idiot to die, then I can sell his book at a profit. Hurry up and die Kurt. I’m waiting. By the way Wars over and if you did not support it you wanted more MASS GRAVES YOU UNCARING PIECES OF SHIT YOU LIBERAL PILES OF CRAP MASS GRAVES MASS GRAVES MASS GRAVES, WHERE WERE YOU WHEN RUWANDA WAS IN UPHEAVEL WHERE WERE YOU AND YOUR PRECIOUSE UN AND CLINTON THEN WHERE WERE YOU? NOWHERE BECAUSE YOU DO NOT GIVE A SHIT ABOUT ANY ONE BUT YOUR SELVES YOU WERE WRONG THIS TIME AND YOU HAVE BEEN WRONG ON EVERY SINGLE ISSUE IN HISTORY. DIE KURT DIE, of natural causes only I wish no personal ill will to you Kurt, and only hope you would die in the natural order of time. I in no way want it speaded up at all, I just can not wait for it to happen.
Posted by j on Jun 7, 2003 at 8:53 AM Kurt Vonnegut is my favorite author ever.
That being said, what make WWII a justified war and Iraw not a justified war?
You can talk about genoiced. There was a time in 1981 when Saddam and the Ba’ath party ordered the killing of 180,000 Kurds using mustard gas. This was after they declared victory from a war they lost to Iran.
Barring my personal sentiments about why the government got invovled with Iraq, I at least beleived that Saddam needed to be taken out of control. That does not make me necessarily agree with the govenrment’s motivation.I just think it’s simply sad that the world has come to a place where wars sometimes have to be fought. I guess you could say I’m anti-war in a different sort of way.
Keep up the good work Mr. Vonnegut.
Posted by Josh on Jun 9, 2003 at 8:54 PM What strange dudes these right wingers are. Justifying a preemptive war against Iraq on the grounds that they threaten us with weapons that nobody can find. Castigating allies that did not support us in this conflict even though we still need their help against Bin Laden whose capture was once Priority 1. We can’t find him either or Hussein for that matter. And Afghanistan continues to smolder, like Iraq. Doesn’t it occur to these people that something is fundamentally wrong in our current foreign policy? Sometimes, one has to change course - drastically. Unless, that is, one want to replicate the fate of the Titantic.
Posted by Don on Jun 10, 2003 at 1:36 AM Kurt Vonnegut is an American hero . He’s a truth-teller. This makes him unpopular with the average citizen . We’ll never have world peace as long as ethnic nationalism and organised religion seperate people .
Posted by Allan Price on Jun 10, 2003 at 10:20 PM This was very eloquently put. There is no better way to describe what is happening and what has been happening in our country and our world. What can there be said when hope is slaughtered every day
Posted by Pete on Jun 11, 2003 at 2:46 AM I read this essay for the first time today, about two months hence from “Operqation Iraqi Freedom.” No WMD, no bio-chem bombs, no nukes.
Why did we fight? Dubya lied to us, and Americans died.
So, it was because Saddam harbored Al Qeida terrorists, except we found no proof of that, either.
So it was for freedom, right? Except I am just as free as I was before the war.
During the war, I continued to eat French fried potatoes, dunk French bread into my French onion soup, and French-kiss my girlfriend. And I will continue to do so, because I am free. I only wish I was fabulously well-to-do, so I could keep more of my hard-earned money, but since I am poor, I must continue to pay my same taxes.
Which was worse: Clinton lying about a hummer, or Dubya lying about a war? You be the judge. Peace.
Posted by Jerry Sullivan on Jun 11, 2003 at 7:19 AM As from ex-Soviet Republic, lots of things he talks about and writes in his books is very close to me… I am his great fan and wish him a success and longivity.
I always remember his words from the Timequake: Filet O’Fish! Throu the rest away!
Posted by Mariam on Jun 16, 2003 at 7:12 AM Dear Kurt,
Will any of our outrage and disgust at the
present administration sway them from
their obvious goal of world domination?
I’m sorry to say, the answer is no.
Will there be a change in ‘04? I think the
chances are slim at present unless the Democrats
can find some backbone.
And chance is the only thing
that can derail these deranged nuts from
hurling us into worldwide economic and social chaos.
But then their forefathers had profited hansomely
from chaos and disorder, so maybe that
is their goal.
I have to say my faith that all will
turn out well is waning with each new pronouncement
from “G.W.” and the “Society for a New World Order”.
Is a coup d’etat out of the question?
Posted by Bill Havu on Jun 18, 2003 at 5:00 PM fuk the money
fuk the power
fuk the respectwe will take control!
Posted by the 1 on Jun 19, 2003 at 10:59 AM I just want to invite Mr. Vonnegut to ride in my space-ship.
When GW and the posse warned us all to prepare a plastic and duct tape room in our house, I did. I have made some changes to it and it is now on display in Houston, Texas, oil capital of the world, the center of the Universe for George I and II. WIth all due respect, please see ( http://www.dionlaurent.com/shelter_project.htm ). Theoretically, we could float around in outer space in this gas station...the only thing missing from it as it is now installed is a portrait of the Pres. of the USA, but Kurt has the exclusive rights to the only known image of W (*).Kurt Vonnegut has infected me from the day I first read his works...Bluebeard among my favorites, all of them brilliant, and every tidbit of his consciousness that I can read or hear is always inspiring and rejuvenates my faith. Years ago I was fortunate to hear a lecture, or a comedy act by Mr. Vonnegut at Vanderbilt University in Nashville...he is still as sharp, succint and as hilarious as ever, and damn sure right about our current world dilemna.
Bush is assuredly out as the economy remains flat or worse, as the war continues returning dead and injured soldiers, and as gw continues his antics. Hell, he might even be impeached for weaponsgate before then.
I have faith that our next President will have the responsibility and ability and the will of the nation to move forward, but not until whomever that may be has cleaned up a lot of the shit that bush and his cronies have smeared across the planet. What a fuckin’ mess!It’s the likes of Kurt Vonnegut that will endear a nation, and a world, to the tenets of peace and cosmic responsibility.
Love to Kurt Vonnegut
Posted by Dion Laurent on Jun 23, 2003 at 5:12 PM god bless you, Mr. Vonnegut.
And “F” the “C’ students
Posted by jesusnixon on Jun 25, 2003 at 7:11 PM i have been in a wheelchair since age 5, i handled it very well until i grew a brain at age 5. That’s when i realized that people thought i was different. i have struggled for the last 21 years to know where i belong. Even if kv never reads this i want him to know his books changed me in so many ways. i guess i want to live after all. :)
Posted by Lisa on Jun 26, 2003 at 4:22 PM hi, i’ve read most of vonnegut’s books, and it’s nice to know he’s kept his wits about him, i’d love him as a writer even if he didn’t. the point is though, he’s simply right. he’s taking an educated, politically and historically informed stand on america’s current political situation. i don’t think americans as a people are any more ignorant than the iraqis, austrians or any other people in the world, even if their ignorance may appear so much more pin-headed when compared to their well-larded butts. but americans do seem to have a lesser understanding of history than most other peoples of the world—who, as a rule, have spent 50 of the past 100 years in conditions brought on by terrible governments. the fact that the germans and austrians voted in the nazis themselves doesn’t change the fact that apart from inflicting inbcredible misery on the rest of the world they also suffered spectatcularly themselves. americans, by contrast, have suffered more from the great depression than from any war, and that memory has receded well into the past. so there’s a cocooned, safe, molly-coddled mentality, maintained by an insanely high intake of mental valium on a daily basis, that america is on some separate planet and cannot be affected by what it does to or what otherwise happens Ìn the rest of the world. i think the american political elite merely reflects that “idiocy” or idiosyncracy. like the classic cultures of antiquity or even the classic cultures on american soil it seems somehow bound to or all set to abandon its cities and march off into the wilderness. incapable of providing for the most elementary needs of its own citizens, it goes on a rampage of destruction round the globe before, finally, pressing the self-destruct button.
Posted by tom appleton on Jun 30, 2003 at 3:25 AM the rest of my comment:americaa then is not merely having another president, another hoover or reagan, another sleeper in the oval office, it is not merely going through a bad patch like the mccarthy era, it has entered with insane alacrity and speed, into a completely new historical phase—the bushites have become the true Inheritors of the Dream—like the crazed lunatics striving after world dominance in some dumb (or not so dumb) hollywood crash bang shoot em dead war propaganda flic (and are there any others?) saddam may have been a sad sorry bastard, but really he and his crew of loonies were merely the reflection in the carney distorting mirror of the guys on the other side. it’s hard to laugh about them and even harder to cry for them, when america is turning the whole rest of the world into iraqis now. vonnegut, like any other sane man or woman in america today must appear, to himself as to the majority of the population, as a crazy guy making strange noises in the desert, a prophet preaching to the rocks and the sand. might get a better hearing on planet mars.
Posted by tom appleton on Jun 30, 2003 at 3:25 AM I have always found Kurt to be one of the last icons of truth. I hope the war in Iraq is long, very long. America created and elected Mr Bush, and I have no sympathy. How many of you have faced physical harm in the spirit of Ghandi to prevent it. You and your media propagate not only wars, but the worlds tolerance and acceptance of them. You are all ‘C’ students (at best).
Posted by Baldric on Jun 30, 2003 at 7:21 PM thank you mr vonnegut and mr bleifuss for providing us with this interview. kurt vonneguts mind seems as sharp as ever. he speaks the truth as always. but he always makes one thing clear to me. if we fall in to complacency, keep to ourselves, or just stay quiet, those pps mr vonnegut mentioned will be able to do whatever the hell they want. the mantra of the great science fiction author kilgore trout comes to mind. it is somewhat poignant and could be used in these times as a message to all those under the fog of this administrations public relations indusrty--- “you were sick, now you’re better, and there’s work to do.”
Posted by luther on Jul 4, 2003 at 3:55 PM For all those fascinated by PPs read untitled mail at http://amsterdam.nettime.org/
Lists-Archives/nettime-l-0303/msg00088.html
Author covers a lot of ground: CIA: By, for and of Ps; Cheater Strategists; Control of Human Genome; names dozens he considers PPs; Declaration of Independence. Don’t know if author is mad genius or just mad, but fascinating & even if only half right, we’re in trouble.
Posted by mister 03 on Jul 8, 2003 at 12:06 PM Finally a comment from somebody that served in this war. Being that I am a Combat Wounded non-combatant Navy Corpsman assigned to a Marine Corps Infantry Unit, purple heart receipient, combat veteran of Operation Iraqi Feedom so I hear that the war has now been named, I am overjoyed with the open dicussion and protest of this war. Currently I sit at home, now blind in one eye among other major problems with my arm, back and leg and wait for the military to make god like dicissions about mine and my families future and the extent of my injuries. Having lost close friends to battle over there and almost loosing my own life, I am disgusted w/ the reward of $25 million to anyone that can provide information about the fate of Saddam Hussein while the families of those that were killed in action get next to nothing. I also witnessed the destruction of the WTC on Sept. 11 and helped treat victims that day, and my wife was laid off from United Airlines after the horrendous attacks. My family and I struggle alone financially and emotionally. We now know that not one person in the house or senate have a son our daughter serving as an enlisted person in the U.S. Military. I bet none of the those commenting on this article or none of those protesting the war in hollywood know a single person serving our country in this conflict. I am the first to welcome with open arms anybody that exercises their 1st emmendment rights and especially in protest of war, as war is very bad. I know first hand that war is bad, but it is at times necessary. Keep it real. P.S. I aslo have a head injury.
Ted Bittle
BA Psychology 1997 GMU
U.S. Navy Corpsman Oct 2001 - present
Blind in r. eye, head injury, with other major problems - Permanent
Posted by Ted Bittle on Jul 8, 2003 at 5:19 PM Just Vonnegut,
Yep… read it, but I haven’t read all of his books. Point taken on the scary industrial revolution. I have to go launch some aircraft, wirte more later. Would love to e-mail you. Thanks for the intelligent but condescending comment!JA
Posted by Just Anger on Jul 16, 2003 at 8:07 AM ì...As long as there is a soul in prison, I am not free.î
Does E.V. Debs mean that he would prefer that 300 lbs maniacs sodomizing each other in the laundry rooms of prisons be on the outside sodomizing innocent folk in laundry rooms.
Yeah, that’s a world I want to live in, Not!
Posted by David on Jul 18, 2003 at 1:16 PM What happened to all the great leaders in America?
At least there’s still one…
Vonnegut for President!
Posted by Mike on Jul 21, 2003 at 2:32 PM Peter,
I suppose that in this context it looked as though I was asking about the war in Iraq. I wasn’t. I was asking in general… What do you think?Laters!
Posted by Just Anger on Jul 23, 2003 at 9:10 AM Fantastic interview. Once again… as he’s done in every book, every story, every speech… KV helps us lonely souls know that we are not alone. This man is a national treasure. Thank you, Mr. Vonnegut, for saying what so many are afraid to say and what so many are afraid to hear.
Posted by Scott on Jul 23, 2003 at 8:11 PM Jason
I feel a little sorry for you. One of the greatest atrocities of history? I think not. Not even close. Lets just ignore WWII, WWI and associated atrocities (my apologies to Mr Vonegut) and look at recent histories. Angola (1960) - democratic elections happened to elect the wrong guy (sound familiar?) so the US sends in arms to the minority. Zaire - same story except they destabilised the country first and had the president beaten to death. Nicaragua - same except they didn’t do the beating to death thingy. Panama - enough said about that. Granada - and what was that all about? Not democracy thats for sure. We all know how many UN resolutions Isreal has broken (and continues to do so) and still gets 2 billion US$ PA for military use. Donald Rumsfeld so nuclear reacters to N Korea a few years ago, no he appears to want them back. Chile - brutal dictatorship with US approval. S African invasion into Nimibia with US backing (which they then removed when it got embarrassing). Removal of the Whitlam government in Australia when it asked for US bases to be removed. Quite frankly the US appears to be made up almost entirely of wankers. I wonder why the rest of the world tolerates you to be frank. I mean it’s not for your culture or cuisine. With everything that is done under the US banner, I am surprised you are accepted into any country. We’re all only friends with you because we can sell you stuff.If I were you Jason, I would save a little face and leave the grown ups alone. You are not even an irritation on the butt-hole that is the US.
Samalia - now that didn’t go well did it. Vietnam - oh dear ...
Posted by Baldric on Jul 24, 2003 at 7:59 PM Kurt Vonnegut, you are great. Thank you for giving the word such great literature to read!
Posted by Norma Ruiz on Jul 25, 2003 at 10:00 PM Kurt Vonnegut, you are great. Thank you for giving the wold such great literature to read!
I love your work! And I love this article. So it goes…
Posted by Norma Ruiz on Jul 25, 2003 at 10:29 PM Haven’t read this yet, but I assume it’s great!
Love you so much and miss you too,
Me
Posted by Michael on Jul 27, 2003 at 11:02 PM I read it in your magazine when it came out. I reread it today. It is a great article as is the one by Dr,Cleckley that he recomends.
Posted by Clarence Fisher on Jul 28, 2003 at 7:15 AM Great to hear Mr. Vonnegut has as good of a blunt and honest mind in the realm of reality as I had already found out he has in fiction last summer when i read the children’s crusade. I had no idea he was of the left, but thinking back on the subtle, yet intelligent style of Slaughterhouse, its no surprise.
Posted by Carlo Reyna on Jul 28, 2003 at 3:20 PM Way to go! There are so many questions I want to ask you and am looking forward to perhaps reading a satire of these Godawful times, when law is constantly gaining the upper hand on logic, which I myself am currently writing a novel about. You are a true inspiration to all pursuers of the fine arts and if I ever get published, I hope to one day meet you. Always a devoted fan.
-Mark A.
Posted by Mark Agerholm on Jul 30, 2003 at 7:50 PM My only worry, given our collective reverence for Mr. Vonnegut, at what point does it become a granfalloon?
Posted by Jimmy Davies on Aug 1, 2003 at 9:11 AM I remember a very wise friend of mine, whom is now in the peace corps, told me our last year of college at the University of Kentucky, that I should read something by Kurt Vonnegut. I was drunk at the time and filed the notion deep in my perforated, cerebral warehouse. I am now serving, and I mean serving, in the army as a slightly disgruntled spec 4 with a bachelor’s degree in forestry. This story was my first exposure to Mr. Vonnegut, and while I will probably not build an alter of worship for the man, I did enjoy the poignant clarity of his justified bashing of our current world political and industrial leaders. I hope I can soon harness the will power to read a few of his books so that I may put forth a better response. While being a strong environmentalist, I just can’t totally buy into the comprehensive liberal ideal of pacifism. I either have too much testosterone or my perception of the world leads me to believe that society, just as a healthy forest, often requires the culling of harmful, invasive species which compete for resources at the expense of others through parasiticm and in many cases out breeding the competition. When I consider the mindset of a modern day socialist, I make the mistake perhaps of vastly over simplifying society by dividing it into two categories: they who covet wealth, and they that do not. Can you truly be a wealthy liberal, or is that kind of like being a gay priest, or maybe fat free crisco? Why doesn’t the left hemisphere of our human collective attack war, environmental pollution, and just about everything f_cked up in our world at its source: Greed?
Posted by luke saunier on Aug 5, 2003 at 1:15 AM I finally succeeded in getting a grandson named Kurt. trouble is I think the assholes are targeting us, with a lot bigger guns. Thanks, Lloy
Posted by Lloy Penka on Aug 8, 2003 at 8:50 PM I really enjoy K.V.’s books and writings, however I strongly disagree with his stance on the current war.
But as I look at it, he has to say these things. Afterall, he has opposed wars in the past, and being a pacifist he can never truly be for a war, at least not one that will happen in this day and age. He is saying these things because if he changed his mind now, he would be a hypocrit and a lyer.
I love his books, his style, and his art, but I think he is wrong about this war and this administration.
Thank God we are in America, where he is ALLOWED to say such things. (If he were in Irag pre-war, he would have been killed for saying that about Sadaam)
Posted by Mike R. on Aug 10, 2003 at 5:07 PM Kurt Vonnegut has always been a voice of wisdom and knowledge. It is truly a pitty that we don’t have more moral men like him in positions of authority over the huddled masses. He is an inspiration. God bless you, Kurt.
Posted by Charles L. B. Carr on Aug 17, 2003 at 6:33 PM yeah, they should re-write Marx’s quote and mix it with Carlos Castaneda and urgently hand it to whoever Human still exists:
“Humans from all over the world, lose Selfimportance and unite!”
Posted by rosin on Aug 26, 2003 at 9:25 AM I think that a problem people are having with Mr. Vonnegut’s interview here is that his opinions are rather coarsely expressed. He is a strong advocate of the first amendment, so he agrees that everyone should get to say their peice. But I think that it’s not quite fair to diagnose the administration with mental deficiencies. They do disagree, and I personally do not exactly understand the reason behind the war, but regardless they are definitely much better informed than I am so even if I don’t agree with them I can respect them. From what I’ve seen, so far we have found that the Bush administration acted without any actual information suggesting that a) Hussein in any way was connected with the Taliban, or b) that Iraq has or has been trying to make weapons of mass destruction. The problem is with the military itself. Unfortunately, the policy-makers do not have family nor are they themselves in the military, meaning that other uinnocents are fighting a war they didn’t start. So I’d say there are certainly problems, but I think that Vonnegut is acting too closed-minded here. I do welcome responses.
Posted by Harry Avery on Aug 30, 2003 at 11:28 AM Come on Mr. Avery, Get with it. GW Bush is a a complete nitwit, a fake, a liar, a hypocrite. Wht is this pathetic personality doing in the white house? The Gods must
be crazy or, perhaps, nemesis is here to deal with this nation’s mighty hubris. Vonnegut was too easy on this demented and corrupt nation where democracy is drowning and few seem to notice or even care.
Posted by Dongi on Aug 31, 2003 at 4:19 PM Whether or not I agree with you (I in fact do), first of all I think that he should be respected as a human being, but also I think that closed-mindedness is the reason that anyone gets blasted on this site. Stating your opinion isn’t worth shit if you won’t listen to anyone else’s with an open mind.
Harry Avery.
Posted by Harry Avery on Sep 1, 2003 at 10:19 AM There are many other articesl and interviews from Vonnegut on this website; they are definately worth checking out.
Posted by Martin Manning on Sep 1, 2003 at 8:03 PM Hey, I’ve never thought that so many people in the U.S. were and are against the war with Iraq. As I was watching you, Americans on tv I had the impression that you were with GWB.
It’s good to find out that many weren’t with him. Thanks for this revelation!
Cheers, Bette
Posted by Tur·n Beatrix on Sep 3, 2003 at 6:56 AM Without a doubt, Kurt Vonnegut is a brilliant writer and a valuable voice for our side. As an international socialist, however, I must disagree with some of his positions.
Vonnegut says that he is a pacifist (i.e., advocate of PRINCIPLED nonviolence), but does he believe in the right to self-defense? Self-defense in the face of police brutality? Self-defense in the face of racist, sexist, and homophobic attacks? Does he celebrate the resistance of the Warsaw Ghetto fighters (much of which was organized by socialists)?As for his assertion that WWII was a just war . . . Does that include the roundup and detention of thousands upon thousands of innocent Japanese Americans? And what of the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki? I would HIGHLY recommend that anyone who believes that WWII was about anything other than imperialism read the Ashley Smith article, “World War II: The good war?” It can be found in Issue #10 of the International Socialist Review (ISR). <<http://www.isreview.org>>
Finally, and perhaps most importantly, I must dispute Vonnegut’s contention that the movement against the Vietnam War accomplished nothing. Guy from McAllen, Texas was absolutely right to point out that the movement was instrumental in stopping the war. For one thing, it led to the GI revolt which effectively paralyzed the U.S. war machine. See Joel Geier’s excellent article, “Vietnam: The Soldiers’ Rebellion” (ISR #9).
History has shown many times over that real change is never handed down voluntarily; it must be demanded from below. Only by building the largest, broadest, and most political anti-war movement possible can we hope to put an end to Bush’s plans for endless war. Without struggle, there is no progress.
Posted by Jenni on Sep 6, 2003 at 3:39 AM I think that a point some people are overlooking is the reason for the Iraqi invasion. The problem may lie in the official explanation, but I think people wouldn’t complain if the war on Iraq were declared because of Hussein’s abhorrent treatment of the Iraqis.
Posted by Harry Avery on Sep 6, 2003 at 3:56 PM Mr. Avery,
We have to be absolutely clear that this war had NOTHING to do with liberating the people of Iraq. Was Saddam Hussein a brutal and ruthless dictator? Absolutely. Did he deserve to be driven from power? Without a doubt. His overthrow, however, was the task of the Iraqi people. We must remember that Hussein was a close ally of the U.S. before 1991, when his invasion of Kuwait threatened Western oil interests in the region. Indeed, his original, brutal, undemocratic rise to power was actively assisted by the U.S. government.
Did you know that his gassing of Kurds in Northern Iraq took place at a time when none other than Donald Rumsfeld was acting as U.S. Middle East envoy under Bush I? Rumsfeld certainly knew about this atrocity, but he kept silent. It became convenient to remind the world of Hussein’s brutality only when the U.S. needed to galvanize public support for war.
Have the Iraqi people been liberated? Hardly. Their country has been bombed to smithereens for the second time in 12 years. What was left (or had been rebuilt) of the country’s infrastructure is in shambles. Fully 100% of the population is now dependent on food aid. Electricity and clean water are scarce. Hospitals are severely lacking in basic supplies--years of bombings and strict economic sanctions have taken their toll.
And Halliburton (where Dick Cheney served as CEO until becoming VP) has been awarded a special no-bid contract to manage virtually all of Iraq’s newly liberalized oil industry. Not to mention the military base(s) the U.S. intends to construct on Iraqi soil.
We must be absolutely clear that this war had nothing to do with freedom or democracy and everything to do with oil and empire. For more information, check out the National Security Strategy of the United States (a.k.a. the Bush Doctrine), available at www.whitehouse.gov Also check out the Project for a New American Century (PNAC), on which Paul Wolfowitz worked before becoming Deputy Secretary of Defense. This war was being planned long before 9/11.
Posted by Jenni on Sep 6, 2003 at 11:20 PM Jenni, I agree with you entirely, I just think that sometimes some people can take their anti-Republicanism to an extreme and actually lose sight of what really was happening in Iraq. I honestly am not conservative or Republican, I just think that people should tone things down a bit.
Posted by Harry Avery on Sep 9, 2003 at 3:37 PM Would you like a pie in the face? I’d like a pie in the face!! And Kurt Vonnegut can pie me in the face any time he would like.
Posted by joe on Sep 9, 2003 at 9:16 PM Haryy.
I think it’s lovely that there are people like you still in the world. I am going to send a letter RIGHT NOW to the white house asking them to ‘tone it down’.
I know you don’t mean any harm, and you’re probably a nice bloke (have absoluately no doubt whatsoever in fact), but seriously! What exactly are you saying? You take the trouble to post a message saying what? That we should tone it down a bit. Read behind the lines and you might notice that some of us a little peeved at what is going on. It’s not about democrates or republicans (being non-US I would know what that means in fact). It’s about ‘might is right’. It’s about ther control of the media and other peoples lives. What right have ANY of you to say that another soveriegn country or the way people rune their lives or worship is wrong? Total arrogance. And the US wonders why they aren’t flavour of the month throughout the world? You vote in a president (yes yes I know, you didn’t vote for him blah blah blah) but he’s yours. YOU made him. Does he bomb you? Does he put an embargo on you under the ‘trading with the enemy act’? Do you have to put up with someopne else’s television and news? The most advanced army in the world seems to only attack third world nations, so what else is it but a bully. You, all members of the US, are responsible. Learn what democracy is before you sell it. It doesn’t involve tanks, smart bombs, napalm, depleted uranium shells, or naive farm boys with guns.
In your country only 14% have passports, 60% believe Saddam Hussein bombed the twin towers, and you have an average reading age of 13 years. And you tell us what to do?
Posted by Baldric on Sep 10, 2003 at 7:43 PM It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has exceeded our humanity -Albert Einstein
I=BF Squared
(Ideas=Badges*Friendliness squared)
Posted by Hirci Nidus on Sep 11, 2003 at 4:14 AM Baldric, I have to take issue with your claim that ALL Americans are responsible for Bush and his policies. The people of the United States live in a society that is--like all capitalist societies--sharply divided by class. I am a member of the working class. George W. Bush is a member of the capitalist/ruling class. His policies are designed to expand the power of the U.S. to impose its will on the world for the benefit of U.S. business interests. And who benefits? Certainly not U.S. workers, who have paid dearly for these wars in drastic cuts to already underfunded social programs, as well as severe new restrictions on civil liberties.
Bashing Americans simply for being Americans accomplishes nothing. Indeed, it serves only to divide an unprecedented international antiwar movement which includes hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of ordinary Americans who have managed to find their way through the lies and distortions of the corporate media. These ordinary Americans will be crucial to halting the forward march of U.S. imperialism. What is needed is solidarity.
Posted by Jenni on Sep 11, 2003 at 1:16 PM Mr. Avery, things are much worse now for ordinary Iraqis than they were before the war. At the end of the first Gulf War, the United Nations admitted that the massive destruction had reduced the country to a pre-industrial state. That war, which killed hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, was followed by one of the strictest economic embargoes in history. Hospitals, schools, and other infrastructure were for 12 years systematically deprived of basic supplies. The economy was destroyed. And this at a time when cancer and other disease rates were skyrocketing due to the U.S. military’s use of radioactive depleted uranium (DU) shells.
And now this small, virtually defenseless country has again been devastated by the world’s only superpower. Whole villages lie in ruin. Electricity and clean water are scarce. The entire population has become dependent on food aid. Unemployment and poverty are the norm. Crime has risen sharply. U.S. soldiers continue to kill and wound innocent civilians with impunity. Thousands of innocent Iraqis have been detained and held in the most inhumane and degrading of conditions.
Does this sound like freedom to you?
Posted by Jenni on Sep 11, 2003 at 1:37 PM No, it doesn’t. I think that people are misunderstanding me. I’m not coming out in favor or against the current administration or the war or anything. All I’m saying is that this discussion frequently changes from a disagreement about political beliefs to personal attacks.
Harry Avery
Posted by Harry Avery on Sep 11, 2003 at 2:27 PM Jenni.
The US embraces democracy (or rather it’s intepretation of it. The US as an entity has done this thing, and it has done it in it’s own name. If you don’t like what your country is doing, change it. Stop bleeting about being working class. If the majority of your country weren’t so ignorant perhaps this wouldn’t have happened in the first place. It’s a bit late to pretend you’re someone else now. Have you lain in front of tanks lately? I marched to your embassy here, facing GI joes with guns. Did you do the same? Did you try to stop the embargoes and blockades on Iraq, Cuba, Korea, Libya, Veitnam, Cambodia, Namibia or Chad? Probably not. Have you publically questioned the US sponsership of Isreal? I think not. Or are you a nation of one. It’s time you all took responsibility quite frankly, the way you are forcing the same on the people of Afghanastan and Iraq. It’s not just Ok to say that you didn’t vote for him.
Posted by Baldric on Sep 11, 2003 at 6:56 PM Straight from the horses mouth. Vonnegut has seen more in his life than any one person should. He is an artist of the highest calibur who has been saying for years that war sucks. No supprise that he doesn’t support Bush and his most recent crusade. If you really want to know the truth the world would be better if there were more Vonneguts in it. And I would like to add that I hope he is awarded the Nobel Prize while he is still alive for in truth he no one deserves it more.
Posted by Dave on Sep 15, 2003 at 4:00 PM While I agree with the Vonnegut message wholeheartedly, I want to point out something about “C” students. Many individuals are only average or below in academia, and they turn out to be caring, responsible, productive members of society. It is true that it might not be best to have a “C” student leading our government (especially the particular “C” student in question), but I fear that some readers may equate “C” student with immoral, lying, manipulative, selfish jerk, which is not always accurate.
Posted by Matt Rosenthal on Sep 16, 2003 at 1:11 PM Dave-Stop giving Hoosiers a bad name. At least use complete sentences in your rhetoric. By the way, it’s must HAVE been, not “...must of been....”
Posted by Matt on Sep 16, 2003 at 1:17 PM I hate ignorance… it’s such a pitty that so many americans are so god-damn ignorant.
As a high school student I was apalled when one of my teachers asked my class if they knew what the island of Hispaniola is composed of, and three people knew.
THREE PEOPLE!!!!
An island that is less than 180 miles from our borders which contains two COUNTRIES, WITH PEOPLE in them, and THREE people knew.
I hate americans that think they have it so good just because they hear their fucking asshole teachers tell them that. The united states is a terrorist nation, and it has been since 1948. No one ever thinks about what this country has done to DESERVE what they got on September 11th. I certainly hope that no one was scratching their heads thinking “Now why would ANYONE attack us!!??”
If you so kindly remember September 11th, 1973, when Kissinger and the CIA supported a military coup that overthrew the democratically elected president of Chile, Salvador Allende, and placed a Facist Nazi who killed and injured one in every 100 Chileans.
All because Chile was the place to get copper from in the world. Copper being very important in 1973, seeing as how you used to make telephone wires and other such electronic connections… and *gasp* bullets. Salvador Allende wanted the yankee’s out, it was Chile’s copper, and maybe the Chileans should benefit from their country.
My mother lived through that.
My mother was alive and in Chile when the CIA placed Pinochet in power and he bombed the capitol.
My mother was alive and in Chile when they placed a noon curfew and no one could be outside their homes, or they’d get shot in the head.
My mother was alive and in Chile when Pinochet took people to a deserted island near the arctic and tortured them for years by doing sick shit to them. They would do sick shit like take their finger nails off, or shock their genitals, or probe their anus with weird things, or make them kill each other, or just fucking shoot them in the foot every once in a while.
My mother was alive and in Chile when Pinochet took all the dead bodies and dumped them in the river that goes through Santiago so people could go and try to spot a dead relative floating, bloated and blue.
Posted by Cris on Sep 22, 2003 at 1:37 AM My mother was alive and in Chile when the CIA staged bloodier and even sicker and shittier coups in Argentina, Brazil, and mostly ever other country in South America.
My mother was alive when her children were raised in the United States to escape oppression caused by the United States.
My mother was alive and apalled when her children, living in the greatest land of all, were taught that there are seven continents.
My mother was alive and apalled when her children, well into high school were not learning the geography of the world, but rather the strageties on how to pass a standardized test so the school could get more funding to be able to afford books for the overcrowded system because the government is spending too much money on killing women and children and bombing ancient wonders of the world, like the worlds oldest university, while there were STUDENTS inside of it.I am alive and apalled that everyone is brainwashed into thinking “America is the best fucking place to be in.” It’s incredibly amazing how this country can call itself the land of opportunity and freedom when if you dont have any money, you can’t get medical attention. If you dont have any money, your kids go to crappy schools and never learn what is going on outside of the borders, maybe its to keep ignorance alive, eh? If you dont support the Israeli cause, your anti-semetic.. What Israeli cause? If you try to start talking abot the crappy side effects of pre-emptive war and killing for no reason and later finding out that there WAS no reason to kill in the first place, your silenced, because your not fucking american enough. Let me tell you something, As a high school student, ive learned to think that America is this country. When America is what the CONTINENT is named.
With the passing of the Patriot act, and being shut-up whenever i try to say how unjust it is to KILL people. Brave New World, and 1984 are becoming too real for me.
Fuck it. I’m moving to France.
Posted by Cris on Sep 22, 2003 at 1:37 AM “A good example of our media and governmental bias was in the recent UN General Assembly vote. The UN General Assembly voted 133 – 4, demanding that Israel drop it’s threat to remove the elected leader of the Palestinians Yasser Arafat. The 4 countries against? United States, Israel, Marshall Islands, and Micronesia. “
Posted by Baldric on Sep 22, 2003 at 7:55 AM Thank you. I was beginning to think I was the only one who’d noticed how scary things are. But Kurt, where are the artists now? What’s most frightening about the abomination we call government these days is the lack of resistance, passive or otherwise, by those who have the most to lose.
Posted by Jocelyn Breeland on Sep 23, 2003 at 12:36 AM The first book I read was Cat’s Cradle, I was a returning Veteran from Viet Nam, Kurt and J.D. Salingers “Perfect day for Bananafish” saved my life and sanity. Then Joseph Heller also a Veteran.
Went on to read every book, some good, some o.k but all of them GREAT !
Love Vonnegut, besides he has really cool last name and use to sell Saabs !
Posted by Bill Whitlatch on Sep 26, 2003 at 3:35 PM Cris--While America has certainly not acted in an exemplary fashion for the past 55 years, I do feel you are overlooking two points. Nobody deserves September 11th. Not a single person deserved to die. They were all innocents. And no, I’m not generalizing--I think that most or all human beings are innocents, and the terrorism committed on that day targetted businesspersons and other innocents. Secondly, these problems which you outline are not American problems. They are world problems. I’m not going to say that we are the greatest nation in the world, but we do offer more freedom than the majority of the world. Despite what you feel are low educational standards, we do have infinitely greater school systems than most other nations. So while we are not living up to the ideals you hold (and I absolutely agree with), we are certainly doing better than most other places. But you can move to France, a nation beset with anti-Semitism and where the legal system is based on a guilty-until-proven-innocent system instead. Again, France has high points, but it also has problems, just like everywhere else.
Posted by Harry Avery on Sep 28, 2003 at 4:39 PM I’ve read many of kurts books and have always felot the same way about war that he has I’m VERY glad to see how he looks at modren socitey, not because it is mean but because it is truthful. but at the same time the ppl out there like vonnegut and the rest of us who give a god damn about others need to do something to get the PP’s away from the major power sources before the blow the whole grid to kingdom come
Posted by roger on Sep 30, 2003 at 4:27 AM Baldric,
First of all, at no point have I suggested that it is enough simply for the American people not to vote for Bush. YOU put those words in my mouth.
You also advised me to “stop bleeting about being working class” and change what “my” country is doing. You assumed--quite foolishly--that I have not been part of the mass international antiwar movement of which I wrote in my first response to you.
Well, for your information, I was in New York City on Feb. 15, 2003, when up to ONE MILLION people marched and rallied to oppose the war against Iraq. The International Socialist Organization (ISO), of which I am a member, is one of the most militant anti-imperialist forces
in the movement.And as for your assumption that I have never publicly questioned U.S. support for Israel: wrong again. Several times a week, the ISO sets up on street corners and campuses around the country to sell our newspaper, which features headlines such as, “Israel escalates its bloody war.”
In the future, get the facts before you go shooting your mouth off and alienating those Americans who agree with you on these issues (and who should be your allies). As I wrote before, what is needed is a united international anti-war movement.
Posted by Jenni on Sep 30, 2003 at 1:40 PM Check out the ISO’s newspaper, Socialist Worker, at www.socialistworker.org
Posted by Jenni on Sep 30, 2003 at 1:44 PM One final point, Baldric:
Your notion of the U.S. as a single entity is an illusion. Again, the U.S. is sharply divided by class. An estimated 600,000 Americans are homeless, for example. Are you seriously suggesting that the working class, which includes the poor, unemployed, and homeless, bears the same responsibility for this war as the White House??? If so, you should read Karl Marx and Frederick Engels. Read Lenin (especially his pamphlet entitled “Imperialism: The Highest Stage of Capitalism"). The U.S. ruling class bears responsibility for this war. You are correct, however, in that it will be up to ordinary Americans to organize to stop it.
Posted by Jenni on Sep 30, 2003 at 1:57 PM i personally think that his views on aspects of the political party are aplicable and and far as my level of respect goes thats it. he speaks his mind and i ll build him up for that but past that hes no more of a man than he dpeicts when he speaks, the art he produces isnt in the slightest bit as strong willed as his writings, from what ive seen theres no dpeth behind what hes producing art wise, no emotion no focal points nothing, just simple drawings of things that cant be depicted in any other way but simple minded.
Posted by nicholas ferficholas on Sep 30, 2003 at 7:16 PM i personally think that his views on aspects of the political party are aplicable and and far as my level of respect goes thats it. he speaks his mind and i ll build him up for that but past that hes no more of a man than he dpeicts when he speaks, the art he produces isnt in the slightest bit as strong willed as his writings, from what ive seen theres no dpeth behind what hes producing art wise, no emotion no focal points nothing, just simple drawings of things that cant be depicted in any other way but simple minded.
Posted by nicholas ferficholas on Sep 30, 2003 at 7:17 PM Jenni,
Good on you for marching. We all need exercise. Were you at the front, or somewhere in the middle feeling smug because you were ‘doing something’. A million people marched, but Iraq and Afghanastan still are occupied. Doesn’t that suggest something ...
And we can all talk left wing writers. watch - Trotsky, Satre’. Means very little doesn’t it. You are I am afraid confusing movement with action. In my own country a smaller but more significant march arrived at your embassy to meet GI Joes with guns as well as our own rentacops. A very grim message was relayed to us and we all wondered how far your country’s arm had reached. Yes you do bleet on. You appear to not wish to stand by your own country when the chips are down, rather to splinter into groups and so make smaller targets for criticism. At some point the ‘oh it wasn’t me!’ line wears a little thin. If the masses of the US allow themselves to be used as justification for the weight that the US weilds, then be prepared to face the consenquences. If you look at the body of your writing, it is not dissimilar to Harry Avery’s ‘but no-one disserved that’ line. True, no-one disserved september 11, and yet the US has since then visited it on parts of the world 100-fold. Grow up, this is the real world now, not one of your sit-coms.
Posted by Baldric on Oct 1, 2003 at 10:28 AM And although I am an estimated 5000 or so km’s from your border, I believe that there are an estimated 1M homeless in NY alone, and the police force is larger than our army, most guys join left wing movements to meet girls, and Micheal (above) can’t spell ‘you’re’. Oh, and I love that word ‘hubris’. Well done Dongi.
In regard to your socialist link, I believe it was Trotsky who admitted that the only way to socialist rule, was through armed struggle. Get with the plan babe.
Posted by Baldric on Oct 1, 2003 at 10:37 AM Oh! How I love this old curmudgeon! Unfortunately, we, the lazy, self-indulgent citizens of the republic, are voting in our mirror images. Too bad. It was a great Republic, once.
Posted by Bruce Trego on Oct 1, 2003 at 12:48 PM To think the only anti-war “supporter” I’ll listen to would be my favorite writer too. But as he said it best in “Slaughter house five”..why dont you write a anti-glacier book. I may not be anti-war but this stuff makes sense.
Loved the banna cream pie crack.
Posted by James Conniff on Oct 1, 2003 at 9:32 PM “All you can do is laugh like hell!”
I wish there was a way we could preserve Mr. Vonnegut forever. He should donate his DNA to science and have himself cloned a million times over and each of these clones should be placed in as many homes world wide as possible. So everytime a dilemma presents itself which might cause a stupid or asinine solution, a result that may reflect badly on the human race, whatever that is, they can turn to the Vonnegut clone, and this clone does not have to be the physical representation of Vonnegut himself but it may very well be a dog, a chair, a plant or a cantalope, what ever, and we can ask the clone what do you think we should do? The world would be alot better place.
Posted by Adrian Malinowski on Oct 2, 2003 at 2:58 PM Oh man, that reminds me of a joke you may have heard…
One day, all of the parts of the body got together to decide who would be the boss. The Brain spoke first and said “I should be the boss because I do all the thinking and coordinate everything else.” The Hands said, “I should be the boss because I do all the work for the body.” The Feet said “No, I should be the boss because I take the body wherever it needs to go.” And so on with the other parts of the body. Finally the Asshole piped up and said, “I should be the boss! I do the important job of removing waste from the body.” Everyone laughed and laughed at the Asshole. The Asshole became angry and shut itself off and refused to remove anymore waste from the body. Pretty soon the Brain became tired and could not think, the Hands hung limp, and the Feet would not move. Finally everyone gave in and let the Asshole be the boss.
The moral of the story is this: you don’t have to do all the work or be the brain to be the Boss, just an Asshole.
Posted by David on Oct 7, 2003 at 10:25 PM When I was younger I had a great deal of repect for Kurt Vonnegut. I’ve read all his books and several articles. But as I’ve gotten older, he nows seems to be just another complainer.
I agree, that none of us chose to be here. But as long as you are here quit crying and play ball!
Posted by Rod on Oct 8, 2003 at 8:40 PM Cheers once again Mr. Vonnegut. Probably one of the only authors that tell the truth about this world, like the saying goes,"It is funny because it is true.” The part about literature being opinionated is probably the smartest thing I’ve seen in writing. English teachers are much more irrevalent than they put out to be. As with the comments on the war and our politically superior ‘comrades’, nothing suites them better than a quote by the could-be-worse chemicals in my brain,"There is a fine line between childhood and stupidity, some of us never grow up.”
Posted by "Comrade Plishenko" on Oct 9, 2003 at 11:01 PM Some of these comments are very interesting. I do not believe in really critisizing other people, a.k.a. a “non-christain”, but there is no denying the truth, Bush is being quite selfish, certainly benefiting his own rather than the group. Kind of a communist point-of-view, but it almost works. Humans are truly the most arrogant beings on this earth by far, we kind of need a kick in the pants. I sure hope no mormons are viewing this page, or any other arrogant humans.
Posted by "Comrade Plishenko" on Oct 9, 2003 at 11:19 PM He is right. How long will we have to suffer under the maniac Bush? It is like we are in a TV induced trance and it takes somebody from the old school “pre TV” to give us a sharp slap in the face of reality.
Posted by Mike Perkins on Oct 9, 2003 at 11:22 PM When I die, if there is a heaven I hope to see Kurt Vonnegut sitting next to God advising him on how to make the world a more liveable nicer place to be.
Posted by Paul Allen on Oct 15, 2003 at 4:32 PM once again, vonnegut has been the lighthouse to a dark sea of confused tankers…
thank you, mr vonnegut…
truly a king among men… a king among men.
Posted by travis duvall on Oct 16, 2003 at 8:31 AM I was reading an old copy of The Atlantic and saw that the editor, the late Michael Kelly, had mentioned this in the usual snide right-wing way.
Although it WAS tragic that Kelly lost his life embedded in Iraq it inevitably gives rise to the unworthy thought that God sometimes just reaches the point of terminal exasperation and, almost in despair of ever getting through, decides on yet another ípunishment fits the crimeí example. This is by no means the first example of this kind of thing since the country was hijacked using, to no small extent, Godís name.
So I think Mr Vonnegut is probably on to something when he calls them PPís. Irony will be lost on them along with all the other missing sensibilities.
Now that Saddam has been removed, the realization that we are not finished with Iraq and will not be for the foreseeable future is beginning to dawn on all those just too lazy to care when we were going in. Troop deaths, Reservist fatigue and money will concentrate the mind even above flag-waving eventually. Weíre going to grow sick and tired of being sick and tired of the endless spin and obfuscation in justifying the war and regular doses of disinformation about the ongoing Iraq situation in an attempt to keep President Bush looking good. The certainty of a nasty Presidential campaign arising from the obscene amounts of money heís already raised and the hundreds of millions more heíll get looms ahead.
I think we can take it for granted that heíll win in Texas, Oklahoma, Nebraska and all the other usual suspects even if things turn unspinnably bad so itís by no means certain that weíll be liberated in 2004. I hope Mr. Vonnegut remains with us long enough to see the end of these conscienceless corruptors and the re-emergence of a country for and by the people.
Posted by Dick Walsh on Oct 26, 2003 at 11:45 AM I find I am saddened by the vitrol on both sides of the argument. However, remember even Jesus lost his temper at times. Mr. Vonnegut has shown that anger can be constructive. Anger won’t solve the problem but it sure can help a person come up with creative solutions. Most Americans are kind, decent, people. I am horrified that our current leaders are portraying us as people who love to bomb, kill, maim, and seek revenge. This is why our leadership must change.
Posted by dolly on Nov 2, 2003 at 2:05 PM God bless you, Mr. Vonnegut. Your voice is needed in this time when idiots and fools are our leaders.
Posted by Craig S. Mullins on Nov 2, 2003 at 8:46 PM Vonnegut responds to questions just like he writes his books. Quick-witted, thoughtful, and ...
badass
Posted by andy on Nov 8, 2003 at 5:02 PM thought you might find this of interest . . and share
Posted by gary winkowski on Nov 8, 2003 at 9:00 PM From one good cynic to another, please read Chapter 14 of the book of Bokonon.
Posted by Jim Hayes on Nov 10, 2003 at 11:28 PM Kurt Voneegut is the funniest person alive. No matter whether he is right, wrong, or senile-he’s a riot. I appreciate this story very much
Posted by Nicolette Moody on Nov 11, 2003 at 2:54 PM i’m 48. been reading KV since 1969. he affected me like no other U>S> author by pulling the dark plastic curtain back so i could see the real Amerika in all it’s stupidity and unfairness. i love this country when it remembers what it’s supposed to be doing...and the current power brokers have serious amnesia. i must say that this piece reminds me once more that if we’re going to change anything...we must address it...we must take action. so as i sit here in sadness and anger and hope (a bit!!!) and ponder what action(s) i will take...i am thankful for KV. i am searching for who my next hero can be after KV goes to heaven! (right!). living w/o the minds of frank zappa & john lennon has been hard enough. when our buddy KV is gone and we’re reading those so sane words over again...who will we look to and hold aloft? i’m sure there’s some man or woman...but there will never be another KV who could wake up a 14 yr. old kid from dinkytown michigan and say..."look pal...there’s a LOT of shit out there so don’t forget to wear your boots” (my line). the saddest thought (other than living to see us bomb ourselves into extinction) is to remember a reviewer who stated on reading one of KV’s fine works..."he give’s us once again a POST MODERN SHRUG. what you gonna do!? robert redford recently said “this is what we get for not paying attentio”. yup, it’s our fault. if there’s a bully in the school yard you have to call him out...he won’t just go away. so we must blame ourselves...what you gonna do? something...we all who want a change must do something...however small. don’t forget to have a fifth of Jack and a pack of Marlboro Reds around just in case the boys totally blow it. peace.
Posted by lawrence on Nov 19, 2003 at 9:18 AM Kurt Vonnegut does well to remind us of Eugene Debs, the greatest “Hoosier” (actually, a derisive 19th-century term for settlers without proper land titles). I’m curious how many of the Indiana commentors know about (1855-1926), b.
and buried in Terre Haute, founder of American Railwaymen’s Union and five-time democratic socialist Presidential candidate? His home is a National Historical Landmark at 425 N. 8th Street, well worth a visit.
Posted by David on Nov 19, 2003 at 10:27 PM On one account you are only partially right: In Europe the media quite regularly and broadly and even explicitly portray Bush’s policies, the war in Iraq, and even Bush himself as nonsense. Albeit very scary nonsense. Maybe the distance helps to see things a bit more clearly. That said, thank you for your razor-sharp comments; it felt good to hear them.
Posted by Andrew Tuttle on Nov 24, 2003 at 3:06 AM Mr. Vonnegut is remarkable. It seems however, that simply separating into camps is off the mark. Is the modern protest movement no more than recognizable opposition due to contentedness? We can bash and bash and bash, but history just takes it’s course. What is to be done?
Posted by michael mallozzi on Nov 24, 2003 at 9:50 PM michael mallozzi:
I don’t think that that is a fair assessment. There have been times when a strong opposition has changed history’s course. Remember slavery?
Posted by Harry Avery on Nov 26, 2003 at 7:48 PM Thank you Kurt....a respected elder and an honest truth. Cultural leaders today have no remorse for humanity, opinion, or basic freedom to personal belief. I am not scared of this hell bent government and our dry drunk ass prez. I was overwelmed with the sweet truth Kurt sang out in this article. Still to this day his open mind and realistic views represent a backbone that we as humans should support and be proud of.
“Land of the free, Who ever told you that is your Enemy”.
-Zach-
Posted by Sally Jarman on Nov 27, 2003 at 5:44 PM I need to connect with like minded people. Vonnegut helped form my values long ago. I loathe Bush, the neo-cons, fascists, and I am enraged at this war, which does so little to protect our citizens, while killing so many innocent humans.
Posted by Michael Waters on Nov 30, 2003 at 7:53 PM If Kilgore Trout had been Finnish he would have said: Kili, Kili!
Come to eat blueberries here in Finland
Posted by mem on Dec 8, 2003 at 11:37 AM Mr. Bleifuss, thank you so much for your interview with Vonnegut. It is clear and shining through this Southern circus ring in which I now find myself.
Posted by Benjamin Pletcher on Dec 9, 2003 at 10:43 PM “To say somebody is a PP is to make a perfectly respectable medical diagnosis, like saying he or she has appendicitis or athleteís foot.”
I would be interested to know, if anyone has this information, exactly where Mr. Vonnegut went to medical school, and what exactly qualifies him to make a “perfectly respectable medical diagnosis”.
Posted by an American on Dec 10, 2003 at 5:24 AM American from America,
Vonnegut went to the University of Curmudgeon; the school’s slogan is “No More Stupid Presidents”. So they obviously are upset with the phoney one who commanded the coupe back in 2000.
Posted by neil on Dec 10, 2003 at 6:57 AM The funniest part of this and about most of these comments, is that when all of this Bush-bashing is going on, no one seemed to mention that Bush got rid of the most heinous dictator since Hitler and freed an entire country of the daily tourture they were enduring. They are all too busy claiming how unintelligent he is and name-calling to realize that one.
Posted by Kelly L on Dec 10, 2003 at 3:29 PM Kelly L--
If you would read my comments you would see that you are mistaken.
Posted by Harry Avery on Dec 12, 2003 at 6:41 PM I went to the University of Illinois and got B’s. I also support President Bush. One of the things I like most about him is that he enrages the left. I have a question for Joel. In your first question you mentioned the Reagan wars. Do you mean the Cold War? Was that a just war?
Posted by Ted Shipton on Dec 16, 2003 at 3:45 PM It is often said that people become more right-wing as they get older. I am 34 and first read Vonnegut when I was 17 (Slaughterhouse 5), and am glad to see that his opinions have not wavered in the slightest. Mr Vonnegut, you are truly a hero of our time.
Posted by Brendan O'Malley on Dec 17, 2003 at 7:59 AM im just a kid, i have the opinions of my parents who are liberals. I havent seen or experienced any of the things youve gone through so i dont know how it is. but i like your books and your opinions and i will read all your stories again again.
thanks,
Miles
Posted by miles on Dec 23, 2003 at 2:30 AM Brendan,
I was really conservative when I was a teenager and in my 20’s living in St. Louis. As I’m getting older and wiser and less naiive, I’m a lot more liberal now than ever. I see the bullshit from this administration for what it is.To Ted from St. Louis (go Rams BTW) Direct quotes from Bush:
“The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him.”
pResident George W. Bush, September 13, 2001“I don’t know where he is. I have no idea and I really don’t care. It’s not that important. It’s not our priority.”
pResident George W. Bush, March 13, 2002He still hasn’t found him. Saddam wasn’t a threat to America--just a smokescreen to hide his failure at finding bin Laden and paying back his campaign financers.
Using the Republican logic, Vietnam “was a threat to the American way”. We lost that war and we still have our freedom.Well, happy holidays and go Rams, go Blues, go Cardinals and even though I’m an Alton guy and like the Illini, go Missouri (except when they meet here shortly).
Posted by neil on Dec 23, 2003 at 8:31 AM The thing that, for me, is so poignant about Vonnegut is and has always been the commentary *about* Vonnegut (see below, for example).
I, Kevin McGowin, have *not* loved Kurt Vonnegut since I read Whatever in Whatever year and all that. In fact, I don’t give much of a shit about Kurt Vonnegut one way or the other. There is a very real sense in which I *am* Kurt Vonnegut. And please quit sending books to my apartment, I won’t sign ‘em.
But what Kevin McGowin says, in the above exchange, is very informed and comes from the heart. Thank you, Kevin--I couldn’t have said it better.
Posted by Kevin McGowin on Dec 25, 2003 at 3:15 AM Wow! KV has once again created an environment for debate among his readers. Of particular interest is all the name calling on behalf of one’s belief(s). That elaborate treatise by the guy at eject x 3 .com way back a year ago is incredible. But my favorite is from KV himself when he says, “What has allowed so many PPs to rise so high in corporations, and now in government, is that they are so decisive. Unlike normal people, they are never filled with doubts, for the simple reason that they cannot care what happens next. Simply can’t. Do this! Do that! Mobilize the reserves! Privatize the public schools! Attack Iraq! Cut health care! Tap everybody’s telephone! Cut taxes on the rich! Build a trillion-dollar missile shield! Fuck habeas corpus and the Sierra Club and In These Times, and kiss my ass!”
Priceless, Literary Dude. Many thanks for the clarity this provides when observing our modern leadership.
Posted by Luke Skywalker on Jan 6, 2004 at 3:38 PM I have always been an admirer of Kurt Vonnegut- read most of his books-and
expected nothing less from him. May he
live at least another 20 years! - Forced to change his tune. na na. Fallacy of hope.
Posted by Bruno Gees on Jan 6, 2004 at 8:28 PM Excellent, simply excellent. Unfortunate as the truth may be.
Posted by Walter A.J. Brown on Jan 9, 2004 at 12:33 PM Excelletn, simply excellent article. Unfortunate as the truth, in this case, may be.
Posted by Walter A.J. Brown on Jan 9, 2004 at 12:37 PM Excelletn, simply excellent article. Unfortunate as the truth, in this case, may be.
Posted by Walter A.J. Brown on Jan 9, 2004 at 12:37 PM Kelly L--
Have you ever listened to yourself? How do you know, trapped in a country run by only 6 media companies (10 years ago there were 50) making crap TV prgrammes that you sell to the rest of the world, how do you know even the slightest what is going on in Iraq either now or in the past. Do you honestly believe this, and that Donald Duck wears no pants. I mean really. You should read a little I think, and you might find out some stuff. I don’t know what he was like as a person, but I do know that Iraq pre-1990 was the most progressive state in the middle east, that Bagdhad had christian churchs, mosques and synogogues, that it had free health care (yes, it happens), free schoolong and the highest rate of literacy in that area which means they could read and write). How about you and Harry A there just go back to Washington where you might be tolerated. I am sick of being some sort of listen to everyones opinion peace and love Ghandi dawk. You are the worst sort of bigott, and you and your ilk have done far more harm to the world than Sadaam or Osama ever did.
Posted by Baldric on Jan 13, 2004 at 6:34 PM God bless and long live Kurt Vonnegut Jr. , nothing of more importence may be said!
Posted by Ryan Conover on Jan 14, 2004 at 4:25 AM Cynicism is a luxury we can ill afford “in these times”. Offer a radical alternative, speak the truth, bravely, from the heart. We all fear for our children; join together.
Posted by Ramon Puga on Jan 19, 2004 at 8:20 PM I haven’t felt this way about the state of our nation since ‘ Duck and Cover’. There were airraid klaxons in my home town when I was a kid. Our gov’t is giving me that same sense of dread
Posted by Paul Brown on Jan 23, 2004 at 10:47 AM Kurt Vonnegut is always an inspiration. The world is a better place with him, his words and actions, in it.
Posted by Gary Wood Harper on Jan 24, 2004 at 1:01 PM Terrorism is when a weak state attacks a strong one. There is no morality in the term. What is it called when a strong state bombs the pus out of a third world state? What about when the worlds most advanced military power marches into a third world country and kills up to (at last count) 75 000 of it’s inhabitants? I suppose thats just an extension of play ground bullying.
Mr Bush’s environmental policy will kill more people this year than all the terrorists put together.
Posted by Baldric on Jan 25, 2004 at 6:42 PM You have made me smile Mr Vonnegut. It is my belief, that many of people in power, whether it be the CEOs of companies, or leader of our country, that may do the most harm to humanity. Along with every bomb dropped and every footprint on foreign soil, there is sure to be a ripple effect that we can never predict. By the way...Your art has inspired me...so it goes…
Posted by Ram on Jan 27, 2004 at 2:15 PM I thank the Dear Mr. Vonnegut for “planting seeds"in my head. I have voraciously read most everything I could find by him. My only regret is that I may never shake his hand before he enters a leak and departs this world for another. God Bless You, Kurt Vonnegut.
Posted by J.W. Holt on Jan 29, 2004 at 1:12 AM
Posted by fghdf on Jun 19, 2003 at 9:43 AM 
Posted by Elm on Jul 28, 2003 at 6:19 AM