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I am simply amazed that the majority of American people are so gullible. I am certainly not anti-America, but I am against an unjust and illegal war on Iraq. Wake up USA. Your leaders are turning you into that which you would currently enjoy bombing and killing. An ignorant, mis-informed population with no voice. Start informing yourself. Dont rely on the major news networks to deliver. Try alternate news sources ( such as the internet ) for a more rounded and balanced veiwpoint.
Being a New Zealander, I and a majority of others in this country still have a democratic governance where our elected members of Parliament still listen to its people. Which means it wasn’t hard for our Prime Minister to say no to USA and Britain ( who we regard as allies and good friends ) to support for a war that a majority of Kiwis are dead set against. It has already been strongly indicated by the American Ambassador here on national TV that our refusal to support the war on Iraq will be detrimental to our trade with USA. This from a country that claimed to be our friend. What friend bullies and threatens another to get its own way.
On closing, I sincerely hope that all nations wake up and realise that war, violence, murder and hate will not make the world a safer place. Peace and Love
Posted by Prof on Apr 4, 2003 at 10:55 PM
I agree. This war is not about Iraqi freedom, it’s about satisfying the greedy interests of the evil five in power in this country right now.
“The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him.”
pResident George W. Bush, September 13, 2001
“I don’t know where he is. I have no idea and I really don’t care. It’s not that important. It’s not our priority.”
pResident George W. Bush, March 13, 2002
“Clinton’s advisors met nearly weekly on how to stop bin Laden ...
I didn’t detect that kind of focus from the Bush adminsitration.”
—Two Star General Donald Kerrick
“I don’t believe any longer that it’s a matter of connecting the dots.
I think they had a veritable blueprint and we want to know why they didn’t act on it.”
—Senator Arlen Specter (R-pa)
“Of course Bush knew about the impending attacks on America . He did nothing to warn the American people, because he needed this war on terrorism. His daddy had Saddam and he needed Osama. His presidency was going nowhere. He wasn’t elected by the American people, but placed in the Oval Office by the conservative Supreme Court; the economy was sliding into the usual Republican pits and he needed something to hang his presidency on. This guy is a joke. His silence was sleazy and contemptible.”
—Lt.Colonel Steve Butler
To blame Iraq for 9/11, create media and public hysteria, get your pipelines built and come out looking like a moral man, when that’s the furthest thing from the truth, deserves an Academy Award.
Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Powell and Ashcroft—the aforementioned evil five—must be stopped before the political structure of this country is destroyed.
Thank you David—great article.
Posted by neil on Apr 5, 2003 at 1:27 AM
Mr. Moberg writes: “It’s quite an achievement to squander the goodwill from 9/11 and, for all practical purposes, to lose a popularity contest with a thug like Saddam Hussein in less than two years.”
Here, here, yes, yes, good show. Certainly America should have done nothing to protect itself after 9-11 for then we could have been more readily attacked again and had more “goodwill”.
It is not hard to attract simpathy when the town bullys kill your sibling. But standing up to those bullys, within a town intimidated from conflict with them, will draw plenty of warnings from town fathers and the shuttering of windows and doors as the showdown begins. What was it that the British PM said after the US beat the barbary pirates? Something on long the lines of—America has done Europe a great service which we have for too long avoided doing for ourselves.
As for President Bush losing a ‘popularity contest’ with President Hussein, any high school clique who would stand by a ‘Hussein’ over a ‘Bush’ would clearly not be the type of kids you would want your son or daughter to hang around. But then again this isn’t high school and we no longer have a President who would rather be liked than feared.
Posted by Carl Snodgrass on Apr 5, 2003 at 3:22 AM
dsf
Posted by sdf on Apr 5, 2003 at 6:49 AM
Well written, concise, and no apologies for not showing enough hatred for Saddam (what a relief!). This entire campaign smacks of nihilism, promoted by people who are seriously deluded, either religiously or militarily. However, what’s the media and the Democrats’ excuse?
Posted by farabee on Apr 5, 2003 at 7:45 AM
In seeing Bush’s first telecast exhaultation on war in Iraq, I said to myself and family, “this man believes he is God’s right hand”.
I am an American who believes in the moral foundation on which America was conceived. Lying to America and acting in a manner in which is ultimately detrimental to America, is far from this foundation.
The most simple behavioral analysis of subtle mannerisms and stress response of the ‘war pushers’ and the conscript media place them all as “potential threats”.
Which means that they can not be trusted and exhibit substantial sociopathic and psychopathic tendacies.
Effectively, the administration and the conscript media are applying terrorist tactics to Americans and all people of the World.
It is of this, fundamentally, that I can not abide.
As a nation, America knows that democracy, by its very nature can not be forced. It must be nurtured through its own evolution.
As an American, what I now have to look ‘forward’ to, is the rest of the world even more convinced of my inherent guile.
The killing lust has begun from our troops in Iraq. Many will exercise indiscriminate killing which will create carnage and trauma which the regime of Saddam Hussein could never equal.
Then, one day, these troops will return to America. They will suffer the ills of their actions and behavior, as will their families and friends. The emotional aftermath of this terrorism will be unprecedented.
It is the right and responsibility of every American to uphold the moral fundamentals of America. To speak out against tyranny and oppression within its own boundries.
It must always be remembered that our own history is fraught with atrocities of humanity.
As I watch the killing lust grow within our own children which have been sent to Iraq to ‘liberate’, and as I see and feel the carnage of body and soul of the victim and the perpetrator, my heart is saddened as is that of all existence.
Posted by michael on Apr 5, 2003 at 9:15 AM
YOU’LL NEVER STOP ME!!!!! FIRE AND BRIMSTONE, DEAD TOWEL HEADS, AND TEXAS CRUDE, BABY!!!!!
Ask the Democrats if they are in on the whole “world domination” idea. They will say no, but the idea of no real competition is attractive to all the power hungry morons of the world. Moberg is a naysayer, influenced by the press that is doing its best to, you guessed it, influence little minds.
I DON’T CARE BABY, I JUST WANT POWER! HOOK EM’ HORNS!
Posted by George W Bush on Apr 5, 2003 at 10:48 AM
The last poster is right about Democrats wanting in on it, too.
That disappoints me when I see them buying this BS and giving the emperor support for his war.
As a democrat, it makes me wish for an alternative party that truly does stand for the American principles John Adams exemplified.
I had wanted McCain to get the nomination. I think we’d still be economially strong and waging peace right now had he won.
Posted by neil on Apr 5, 2003 at 4:22 PM
An interesting thing is happening along with the massive disinfomedia. The Internet has presented us with a wide variety of alternative media, information and qualified analysis of the events.
Compromising facts and documents has been available for the world to see. Leaving us with more evidence pointing towards a scenario where the attack on 9/11 was staged as an incentive to put their operation to work.
However the cause behind it is perhaps more complex than that of the control over oil and distribution pipelines. But greed has everything to do with it.
How long before top executives from Cisco, Intel, Microsoft, AltaVista and others offers filtration of Non Patriotic Information on the net in exchange for options on the emerging new markets?
Posted by Lars Printzen on Apr 6, 2003 at 3:41 AM
Interesting point, Lars,
If that happens, I hope hackers world-wide unite to stop it.
Cheers,
Someone who still loves Europe.
Posted by neil on Apr 6, 2003 at 5:51 AM
The worst fears will soon be realised when Iraq, a country of hugely fractured geopolitical scene, is thrown into civil war amongst various fractions. We have already seen the abandonment of the Afghan people with none of the promised reconstruction money and the rampant tribalism of bloodthirsty warlords backed by the US government.
Posted by Mo Thomas on Apr 6, 2003 at 1:27 PM
Great article. And I agree that this war is doing nothing but creating more terrorists.
But before we even launch a war against Saddam, where is Osama? Where is Bush’s promise to find him ‘dead or alive.’
I wonder what the family’s of the 9.11 tragedy think of this administration. Do they know they’ve been forgotten by the thugs we’ve got in the oval office?
Posted by N.C. on Apr 6, 2003 at 2:43 PM
U.S. ambassador Paul Cellucci has threatened Canada with trade trouble for its refusal to kill Iraqis on command.
Oddly, I don’t recall PM McKenzie King having threatening the U.S. for the two years it sat out the Second World War. Oh well, I guess friendship doesn’t work the same north to south as it does south to north.
Nonetheless, the current shame of non-aggression is Canada’s to bear. In the meantime, I have to admit some reservations to the notion that blowing the heads off Iraqi infants with cluster munitions makes Americans safer. If that’s not true, then I’ll bank on the traditional 50-to-one exchange value on Arab to American lives to limit 911 revenge killings to maybe two or three more wars at most.
Maybe Canada and New Zealand will toe the line for Operation Damascus Democracy.
Posted by Ed Thomas on Apr 6, 2003 at 2:44 PM
I just went through my bookmarks deleting propaganda sites I saved during Campaign 2000. Believe me, now is the time when the cover story is all you need to decide.
David Moberg
Posted by NM Bill on Apr 6, 2003 at 3:08 PM
Ed from Canada,
And people don’t think our government is bullying anyone? Threatening our northern neighbor? One who has had the honor system in place for its borders since prohibition. It makes me curl my fists in rage sometimes. Civilized people don’t act like school-yard bullies.
What may be worse, if the draft is re-instated, and I feel it probably will be, you’ll be getting a huge influx of people who won’t fight emperor Bush’s war. I hope that doesn’t happen and hope the SOB gets impeached before that.
Posted by neil on Apr 6, 2003 at 3:35 PM
Ed Thomas - what the majority of people don’t seem to understand is that France and Russia and Germany made there decisions about joining the coalition based on one thing: MONEY!
It was conveniently disguised as a peaceful decision, which is exactly how they wanted it to appear. Hell, I even believed it myself, until I learned they had clandestine oil and arms deals with Iraq that would be lost when the coalition takes over.
The US “ain’t no saint”. Our foreign policy is riddled with double standards, the CIA is incompetent, and every wacko in the world wants us to suffer. The problem is, everyone wants something from the US. Damned if we do, damned if we don’t.
When water is the new currency and the US is bone dry, the Canadians will be the players and decisionmakers. I truly and sincerely wish you luck in maintaining peace in this fucked up world…
Posted by George W Bush on Apr 6, 2003 at 4:39 PM
The honeymoon between Washington and Moscow is finished. USA have accused Russia of deliveries of arms in Bagdad: now diplomatic relations of USA and Russia have appeared under threat.
During the first war in a Gulf, the BUSH-grown-up not hesitating drove for a nose of the former Soviet president Mikhail Gorbachev, which in turn tried to this to resist and to put the end to the Iraq crisis. Ten years after, BUSH-younger work purposefully: he takes the initiative in the hands and to first calls to “friend” Vladimir Putin to inform about the indignation. About it writes French Le Figaro (translation the www.country.ru)
Washington is close to officially accusing the Russian party of realization of illegal sale of arms in Iraq. This subject was discussed on the phone between the presidents of two countries on Monday in the evening.
So, at least, we were explained by the official representative of a White house:
Posted by Mr. K. on Apr 6, 2003 at 10:35 PM
Kremlin immediately has reacted to this accusation. Soon after telephone conversation, the official representative Вladimir Putin directly has contacted to some Moscow printed agencies - that happens extremely seldom - to emphasize, that the president of Russia already during telephone conversation has denied accusations on the part of America. The honeymoon between Washington and Moscow was finished. Now even in the most simple things two capitals hardly will manage to reach the mutual consent. The benevolent relations on the part of Russia to the American people as a result of consequences of September 11 are destroyed.
The Russian-American partnership, which purpose became struggle with the international terrorism, does not exist any more. Having stretched a hand of friendship to Washington, Moscow now coolly has expressed intention to stop diplomatic, economic and many other relations with America. Besides two days ago American prospecting plane U-2 within one hour turned above the Russian-Georgian border, therefore Russia has accused USA of espionage, having specified on a similar sequence concerning epoch of Cold war.
The press ironically responds concerning the American operation in Iraq and will not stint on gibe. So for example, comparing Iraq with the Soviet Union of 1949, the weekly journal Profil makes comments:
Posted by Mr. K. on Apr 6, 2003 at 10:37 PM
Russian people also is strongly concerned with military actions in Iraq. According to sociological interrogation - 71 % of the population for today sees the main threat for world stability not in Bagdad, Pyongyang or Tegeran, and in Washington:
Posted by Mr. K. on Apr 6, 2003 at 10:37 PM
Halliburton,Carlyle and the oil industry are all profiting from this war. All have close ties to the Bushs (Sr and Jr),Cheney and(strangely enough, or not if you’re cynical) the Bin Ladens. I don’t think we should (mis)underestimate the attraction of lining one’s own pockets when it comes to motives for what will turn out to be just another load of War Crimes. It’s not a question of squandering the international goodwill of 9/11 since that event was the equivalent of the Reichstag fire in February 1933 for Bush et al (although he managed that without breaking a sweat).
Posted by Paul Murphy on Apr 7, 2003 at 11:04 AM
I would like to say that this is perhaps one of the most articulate articles I have read since the war’s inception. The mainstream media is essentially brainwashing people into hawkish, blinded war mongers who justify attacking a nation and it’s inhabitants who present virtually no threat to us. If most people would just research who will benefit from this war (i.e. defense contractors, oil companies, defense policy board members, Carlyle Group members, nearly all of Bush’s administation) they would not wave our flag, they would burn it in protest of their ‘elected’ officials.
Posted by Brian F on Apr 7, 2003 at 11:41 PM
I think this war highlights the ungroudedness of contemporary U.S. culture. The extraordinary ignorance that dominates U.S. culture will kill what is left of our Constitution-based republic as it is replaced by a global Empire. Many in the left say that most Americans would oppose the war if they knew the truth—perhaps, but like most members of dysfunctional families, they clearly and aggressively *do not* want to know the truth. Those small numbers of us who oppose the Empire in the United States have no short or medium-term future if current trends continue.
Posted by Chris on Apr 8, 2003 at 1:52 PM
It looks like you were proven wrong on thr outcome of the war.A quick war ending with the people of Iraq dancing in the streets is exactly what is happening.If you would keep your hatred for the Bush administration in check maybe you wouldn’t look so stupid right now.You are not alone.I can’t count the number of enlightened liberals calling for a quagmire last week.Wrong as usual.
Posted by Rob on Apr 9, 2003 at 2:41 PM
Well, Rob, it isn’t over and won’t be for a long, long time.
It seems a lot of people look at the short-sighted end of things in support of this war. I, and I can’t speak for other anti-war posters here, but it seems like they do, look at the long-term affects.
Yeah, the fighting may be over, but who’s next? What other country is our president going to bully? What other resentment for America will fester up the next time the US goes against the wishes of the world?
Are we helping Afghanistan? No. Even the media is talking about that one.
Where is bin Laden? Has be been stopped?
My point—it just cycles over and over, feeding the oil companies and defense contractors.
As far as hatred for Bush. I hate that goddman son-of-a-bitch. He will ruin this nation through his greed.
Posted by neil on Apr 9, 2003 at 8:57 PM
Some Iraqis are celebrating. TV news (ABC Nightline) today is also reporting that fighting continues in other parts of Baghdad and throughout Iraq. We don’t know if it is a majority or minority who feel liberated or occupied. The key question is whether or not guerrilla warfare will continue and, if so, for how long. Even President Bush and Vice President Cheney warn that the war is not over yet. The leaders of the Shiite Muslim majority are already boycotting the U.S. talks for the Iraq occupation government and calling for immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq. See: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news ?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20030409/wl_nm/iraq_sciri_dc_1 Notice how President Bush is not calling for immediate elections not even within two years.
U.S.-sponsored Iraqi exile leaders are now calling for the denationalization of Iraqi oil industry and selling it to foreign investors. See: http://story.news.yahoo.com /news?tmpl=sto ry&u=/afp/20030405/bs_afp/iraq_war_opposition_oil_030405214324 This war has always really been about oil. This is why the U.S. wants to cancel the Russian, French and Chinese contracts with Iraq to develop the oil reserves and also does not want the UN to manage the oil-for-food program any longer. See: http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/printstory.hts/business/1856839 So much for the Oil being the wealth of the Iraqi “people.” So much for bringing “democracy” to the Iraqi people.
Islamic fundamentalists will probably have a better chance at getting elected after the “interim” occupation government actually allows the Iraqi people to vote whenever that may be, especially if the oil wells and reserves get sold to foreign investors.
We also will see in the future whether or not terrorist attacks will increase here and abroad over rising Anti-American hatred in the Arab world due to the Iraq war.
Posted by An observer of White House and media "news" on Apr 10, 2003 at 2:20 AM
On the challenges of humanitarian assistance and looting and the corresponding impact on the Iraqi people’s support for our “liberation,” see New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman’s 4/9/03 article, “Hold Your Applause”:
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/09/opinion/09FRIE.html
Posted by An observer of White House and media "news" on Apr 10, 2003 at 2:26 AM
I come here to absorb the extreme left end of opinion, and you folks never disappoint me. I really try hard to empathize with your point of view, but fail utterly. The problem with pacifism, or the peaceful interaction of any group for that matter, is that it only takes one person to mess it up for everyone. We’ve just witnessed the removal of one such person, and I cannnot help believing that the world is now a better place for it.
Posted by Jon on Apr 10, 2003 at 7:33 AM
i agree 100% i pray to god that we will all stand together and vote this ignorant president out of office in 2004
Posted by matthew astyron jr on Apr 10, 2003 at 3:50 PM
We’ve already taken Baghdad and laid waste to Saddam’s government, to the obvious joy of the Iraqi people, and you leftist conspiracy theorists still won’t admit you’re wrong. When we come up with some banned weapons (which we will soon) will you give it a rest and admit we should have stepped in? When it comes out that France sold arms to Iraq, which I think it will, will you admit we were right in sidestepping the UN? I’ll be sure to check back with you clowns in a few weeks and see what kind of conspiracy theories you are entertaining.
Posted by Ralph on Apr 10, 2003 at 8:15 PM
Lars writes: “How long before top executives from Cisco, Intel, Microsoft, AltaVista and others offers filtration of Non Patriotic Information on the net in exchange for options on the emerging new markets?”
I wouldn’t be concerned Lars about corporations filtering the internet, but governments that is a different matter.
China just announced a plan to control all internet access from that nation. When Europe begins such a plan, watch out!!
Speaking of Europe, did anybody notice that the EU’s Javier Solano, (insert any of his multiple and growing titles here) is extolling the virtues of military strength in his series of Venice and Mars articles and speeches?
Hmmm, now what could it be that he is trying to promote? (Besides himself that is)
Posted by Carl Snodgrass on Apr 11, 2003 at 2:35 AM
How have I been missing all this. Could someone tell me when and where the administration said the war would be a “cakewalk” and “painted a rosy scenario”?
Granted we have almost completely destroyed the government and armed forces of Iraq in less than 30 days, but I was unaware that anyone ever said it was going to be “easy”.
Posted by Nus on Apr 11, 2003 at 2:02 PM
I am as patriotic as any American can be. That said, I am appalled that we chose war in Iraq that has cost 120 of our youngs lives and many more on the Iraqi side. Ifeel that what has occured has put this countrys credibility and security at great risk as we have undermined so many of our allies and the Un to go after a neutered Sadam.
Relative to this scenario, I urge all to go to the American Conservative website and read Pat Buchanans
article entitled “Whos War” in which he outlines the strong push for war by the entrenched right wing Israeli supporters whom are in our governments upper echelons. As a supporter of Israel and a beleiver of truth, I am concerned and dismayed that a small group of people with a foreign countrys interest in mind, could spur this great country to war. Yes, I am greatly concerned.
Posted by Chet Polwin on Apr 12, 2003 at 5:45 AM
Ed Thomas is full of hooey! Kill Iraqis on command, give me a break… Any references, links, or contacts you can get to confirm that? I didn’t think so…
If you plan to spread disinformation, do it creatively so that any but the truly naive might believe it…
Guess what? I heard Chretien grew a backbone!
Posted by ROCKTIME on Apr 14, 2003 at 5:34 PM
You’re attempts to ridicule our president is humorus and shows how little steam your movement really has. War is horrible. I have been in combat and the only thing that happens in war is young people die. This is reality we did not go to war for oil. It makes no sense to go to war for 7% of our oil. IF we wanted to attack a nation that supplied us with oil we’d attack one of several south american countries we get a majority of our oil . The war is for a reason : the president of the uinted states sees this country as a clear and present danger and an imminate threat to our country and he is right. He has been thumbing his nose at the U.N. for 12 years and has harbored terrorists and tried to get weapons of mass destruction if he doesnt have them already. WE have the right to be angry at ANY country who did not support our cause and we also can do whatever we deem necessary IF anything to vent our anger. Which includes sanctions or tariffs. You might live in a delusional world where everyone and everything is equal but the world isnt made that way the US is the superpower in the world. WE wll not tolerate people thumbing their nose at the will of the world. IT is a legal and just war and one more thing
BUSH IN 2004
Posted by The True US Majority on Apr 16, 2003 at 12:32 AM
Actually, half of the U.S. oil supply comes from foreign sources mostly from the Middle East not South America. After Saudi Arabia, Iraq has the second largest untapped oil reserves in the world amounting to 120 billion barrels of oil. According to Vice President Cheney’s May 2001 National Energy Policy Report, foreign imported oil will rise to two thirds of America’s energy supply by 2020. See http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20021007&s=klare
Posted by an observer of White House and media "news" on Apr 16, 2003 at 2:14 PM
There is no evidence of a Saddam-Al Qaeda link. See: http://politics.guardian.co.uk/attacks/story/0,1320,885288,00.html
Regime change and pre-emptive attacks are illegal in international law. See: http://www.robincmiller.com/iraq6-fr.htm http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/forum/forumnew98.php Under international law every nation has the right to self-determination, sovereignty and territorial integrity. The UN and its charter were founded to prevent colonial and world wars so that powerful nations would not decide to attack, overthrow and occupy weaker nations however distasteful those regimes. Part of self-determination is deciding on the form of government. There is no international law that says every country must be a democracy. No country has the right to determine the form of government of any other country regardless of the nature of the regime. That is clear in international law. It is a governance problem for the Iraqi people to determine their political leadership and form of government even if they have to have a civil war to do so. Just like how we do not like the fact that criminals have constitutional and due process rights, but it would be worse if the government could arbitrarily arrest, imprison and invade citizens’ privacy.
The U.S. is directly responsible for the oppression of the Iraqi people as we facilitated the rise to power of Saddam Hussein and the Ba’ath Party in 1963 when they overthrew General Qassem because he nationalized Iraq’s oil industry. See University of Denver, Colorardo Political Science Professor Wadi Muhaisen’s 11/22/02 Rocky Mountain News article, “America’s Shameful Mideast History”: http://www.endthewar.org/frontps/Op-eds/shameful.htm The U.S. then provided Saddam Hussein with the chemical and biological weapons technology used against the Kurds and Iranians as payback against the Ayatollah Khomeini for overthrowing the Shah of Iran and taking the U.S. embassy hostages in 1979. The U.S. also does not care about extending democracy in the Arab world. Why are we not advocating regime change and democracy for the brutal dictatorships in Saudi Arabia (15 out 19 of the 9/11 hijackers were Saudis but no Iraqis and the Wahabi Islamic sect in Saudi Arabia is the biggest sponsor of Al Qaeda), Algeria, Egypt and the plutocratic monarchies in the rest of the Arab world such as Jordan, Kuwait, Qatar, Yemen, United Arab Emirates, etc.? Because they provide us cheap oil.
Posted by an observer of White House and media "news" on Apr 16, 2003 at 2:17 PM
to “The True US Majority”:
7% of your oil? As far as I know, nobody was supposed to buy any Iraqi oil due to the embargo.
But the point about oil is not the past, it’s the future. The numbers you quoted were the past, and the reason for this war was to change this.
You said:
“WE have the right to be angry at ANY country who did not support our cause and we also can do whatever we deem necessary IF anything to vent our anger.”
YOU don’t have any rights whatsoever, because this is not YOUR planet. The rest of the world is angry at the US, exept maybe Mr. Blair and Mr. Aznar (but not including their people).
By the way - America may be a military superpower - still it can’t take it up with the rest of the world alone, so it should better watch out that the few remaining friends it had (until about 6 months ago) don’t decide to definitely turn their back on the arrogant/ignorant states of A.
Clear and present danger? Well it wasn’t back in the 80ies, when Reagan & Rumsfeld sold those weapons of mass destruction to Saddam, and when the same goons sold weapons at the same time to Iran AND had people like Osama be trained by the CIA.
So you really believe, the US spend 80 Billion just because they are so fond of the Iraqui people?
Threat to your country? I don’t know of any attack committed by Iraq against the US (meaning on US territory). Not a single one. Did I hear 9/11? Well, wrong - those were Saudis, Egyptians etc. - no Iraqui involved. But it doesn’t matter, right? After all, they are all the same, aren’t they?
You are a good example why so many people around the world consider the US to be a pathetic heap of ignorance, ruled by criminals who give a pile of dung about freedom or democracy, as long as they can profit.
You said:
“WE wll not tolerate people thumbing their nose at the will of the world. “
Yeah, YOU just demonstrated what you mean by ignoring the UN and everybody else.
2004 ? Don’t know bout that, but I guess that about 2006 we’ll see Bush, Rumsfeld & Chaney at the War-Crimes tribunal in Den Haague.
Posted by ProudEuropean on Apr 16, 2003 at 2:52 PM
At present, the international community labours under the extreme disadvantage that, probably for the first time since the age of Spanish hegemony that ended in the 17th century, the world’s leading power is the most reactionary. There seem only two options now. The first is for the non-US world to remain divided - a scenario that will ensure that the US continues to get whatever it wants, a disaster for at least 95% of the population of the planet.
The other is for the non-US world to go it alone and build international organizations like the ICC without a thought for whether the US will decide to come on board. Although it may seem absurd to attempt to fashion a new international order without the participation of the US, it is the only alternative to a US-dominated world, for the US will dominate and exploit for its own narrow purposes any international organization with which it becomes involved.
We don’t need to go down this road. The US is surely the world’s greatest individual power, but it still only represents 20% of the world economy, and a much smaller share of the earth’s population. The majority - with 80% of the world economy - can still craft viable international organizations without US permission. After some decades, however, a more enlightened US administration will surely bring the US into line with the new international order.
In other words, the premise for a better future - indeed, a future at all - is an international order premised on US non-participation. The US is so out of touch with world opinion that the rest of us would be better off doing our best to ignore it, just as in the schoolyard, most of us tried to get on with our lives as best we could despite the occasional interventions of the school bully.
Posted by James Paterson on Apr 16, 2003 at 5:00 PM
Ralph,
Haven’t found those weapons yet. No chemical ones, either. That’s mostly because the US sold them to Iraq and the arms, too.
We’re still right. Sadly, Bush will continue to try the same tactics to overthrow another country. Which one is it this time, Syria?
Posted by neil on Apr 17, 2003 at 9:00 PM
True US Majority,
No one argues Sadaam was a rotten guy. Let’s stop the double-standards, though.
The US sold those arms to Iraq, including the chemical weapons they used on Iran, because the US wanted to see Iran defeated at all possible costs.
We who are against this ILLEGAL war and who won’t criticize other countries for not backing the US’s madness are against all the lies, the deceit, the real reasons Bush went after Iraq and not bin Laden.
What happened to THAT real threat, I ask?
This war was unsanctioned by the UN, criticized by most of the world’s respectable leaders and our administration has the gall to say France is the enemy because they won’t back us? Let’s criticize a nation with some real destructive power.
The UN, by the way has 19 resolutions still being violated by Israel, who we consistantly back up. Are we going to invade them next? They harbor terrorists and have WOMD, including nukes. There are those double-standards.
Posted by neil on Apr 17, 2003 at 9:08 PM
The non-US commentators here are the voices that will warm the hearts and actions of our US anti-war millions. We will need the support of your voices until the extremist Bush admin has been voted out. Please keep slamming at the bad developments resulting from this war of aggression on Iraq.
History shows how out-nations join together to crush the power of imperial, might-makes-right govts. And, as Moberg and many other analyists point out, civil societies of the out-nations are at least as powerful against Empire as are govts.
For the US anti-war millions, the dishonor of being a full-fledged aggressor nation—taken there by the same manner and degree of lies and falsified evidence as were used by Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, the Empire of Japan, and Communist Russia—will drive great actions to dis-elect Bush. Voices of outraged citizens of the world will help greatly.
Additionally, some of us are working on national constitutional renewal, hoping that we can meld sovereign citizen lawmaking to a still-strong, but more-regulated rep govt. If we can gain that political dynamic—proven in the 400-yr rise to greatness of the Roman Republic, as well as in the modern experience of post-1891 Switzerland—US citizens will have the right to speak for themselves, rather than be misrepresented by lying, manipulative, pseudo-scientific polls.
Many critical problems of governance would be resolved. And the US would surely vote itself into the ICC. International justice is an idea whose time has come. With that one vote, the trial of Bush, Cheney, Rice, Powell, Wolfowitz, Perle, and others, for cirmes against humanity in Iraq would be assured.
My pride is in those who are cooperative human beings first—no matter what their nationality. My country’s govt has put money first. And too many of my countrymen have put revenge for 9-11 first. My country has broken my heart.
Posted by Stephen Neitzke on Apr 19, 2003 at 10:59 AM
I can’t understand why everyone is not supporting Dick Cheney and I on our plans to remake the Middle East. We have the power - we need to use it! Enough of this namby-pamby negotiation stuff. We wasted far too much time talking and not enough time bombing! Nothing a few Tomahawks to send a message to the camel jockeys that we mean business! Now, back to my planning for the Syrian invasion - it’s the only way Numbnuts has a Chinaman’s chance of getting re-elected…..
Posted by Paul Wolfowitz on Apr 21, 2003 at 2:22 PM
why do people constantly say that anti-war people were wrong?They seem to have misinterpreted the fact that we were against this war because it is illegal and largely hypocritical of the US to go against the UN to try and promote other sanctions like the banned weapons. I recently read also about cluster bombs and was horrifyed by what i read. These bombs lay undetected for years and resurface to kill and maim the innocent children,adults and animals like goats which play a very vital role for families in these countries. How these arent acknowledged as weapons of mass destruction is anyones guess.
Isn’t it a bit odd how the UN weapons inspectors turned out nothing and now the US is sending its own inspectors in to try and ‘find’ these weapons. Use your imagination there. I am only 15 years old and just wish those older than me would wake up. A show of hands in my class revealed that about 90% were for the war, and gave no apparent reason other than Saddam was a terrorist. The media has worked in very influential ways on the ignorant masses who will listen to anything there beloved leaders tell them. The Bush administration angers me with its greed and lust for killing. It sickens me to think that so many people think that this war is justified and not an excuse for the US Milatary to flex its muscles. After failures in past conflicts like Vietnam, Iraq presented a perfect oppurtunity to show that no one messes with the US. It is a dictatorship, in an arabic part of the world and would easily be a great target. And so it was. I wonder that after this conflict, it becomes another Afghanistan where we will forget to rebuild. Already multi-million dollar contracts are being given to large companies and not to the Iraqis where this money would do well. I agree with the former reader who stated that 9/11 represented for the bush admin that the reichstag burning was for the nazis, it gave the US an excuse to wage war upon countries different from it and to kill anyone who was in the way.
On the subject of history, why do people always say “would you be anti-war against Hitler in 1939?”. That has nothing to do with anything. Absolute shite. Hitler actually posed a very major threat, with his organised army and aggresion while Iraq does not. Peace and love to all
Posted by james lawlor on Apr 23, 2003 at 9:25 AM
perhaps the idea of “national self-determination” is outdated in a world where 3,000 people can be killed, a large nations economy brought to its knees, and several massive structures destroyed, with a little bit of planning and a $5 boxcutter?
one person raised the valid point most people ignore: pacifism works until one jerk fucks it up. that jerk is (was) saddam hussein. he ignored international laws and resolutions for 12 years, and flagrantly violated human rights. his removal sends the important message that these things are not to be tolerated by the international community, and i agree that i cant see anything other than that the world is a better place without him. The actual security threat comes from Iran and north korea, but thats another story…Iraq was just to prove a point.
Posted by David Johnson on Jun 2, 2003 at 10:56 AM
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Reader Comments
I am simply amazed that the majority of American people are so gullible. I am certainly not anti-America, but I am against an unjust and illegal war on Iraq. Wake up USA. Your leaders are turning you into that which you would currently enjoy bombing and killing. An ignorant, mis-informed population with no voice. Start informing yourself. Dont rely on the major news networks to deliver. Try alternate news sources ( such as the internet ) for a more rounded and balanced veiwpoint.
Being a New Zealander, I and a majority of others in this country still have a democratic governance where our elected members of Parliament still listen to its people. Which means it wasn’t hard for our Prime Minister to say no to USA and Britain ( who we regard as allies and good friends ) to support for a war that a majority of Kiwis are dead set against. It has already been strongly indicated by the American Ambassador here on national TV that our refusal to support the war on Iraq will be detrimental to our trade with USA. This from a country that claimed to be our friend. What friend bullies and threatens another to get its own way.
On closing, I sincerely hope that all nations wake up and realise that war, violence, murder and hate will not make the world a safer place. Peace and Love
I agree. This war is not about Iraqi freedom, it’s about satisfying the greedy interests of the evil five in power in this country right now.
“The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him.”
pResident George W. Bush, September 13, 2001
“I don’t know where he is. I have no idea and I really don’t care. It’s not that important. It’s not our priority.”
pResident George W. Bush, March 13, 2002
“Clinton’s advisors met nearly weekly on how to stop bin Laden ...
I didn’t detect that kind of focus from the Bush adminsitration.”
—Two Star General Donald Kerrick
“I don’t believe any longer that it’s a matter of connecting the dots.
I think they had a veritable blueprint and we want to know why they didn’t act on it.”
—Senator Arlen Specter (R-pa)
“Of course Bush knew about the impending attacks on America . He did nothing to warn the American people, because he needed this war on terrorism. His daddy had Saddam and he needed Osama. His presidency was going nowhere. He wasn’t elected by the American people, but placed in the Oval Office by the conservative Supreme Court; the economy was sliding into the usual Republican pits and he needed something to hang his presidency on. This guy is a joke. His silence was sleazy and contemptible.”
—Lt.Colonel Steve Butler
To blame Iraq for 9/11, create media and public hysteria, get your pipelines built and come out looking like a moral man, when that’s the furthest thing from the truth, deserves an Academy Award.
Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Powell and Ashcroft—the aforementioned evil five—must be stopped before the political structure of this country is destroyed.
Thank you David—great article.
Mr. Moberg writes: “It’s quite an achievement to squander the goodwill from 9/11 and, for all practical purposes, to lose a popularity contest with a thug like Saddam Hussein in less than two years.”
Here, here, yes, yes, good show. Certainly America should have done nothing to protect itself after 9-11 for then we could have been more readily attacked again and had more “goodwill”.
It is not hard to attract simpathy when the town bullys kill your sibling. But standing up to those bullys, within a town intimidated from conflict with them, will draw plenty of warnings from town fathers and the shuttering of windows and doors as the showdown begins. What was it that the British PM said after the US beat the barbary pirates? Something on long the lines of—America has done Europe a great service which we have for too long avoided doing for ourselves.
As for President Bush losing a ‘popularity contest’ with President Hussein, any high school clique who would stand by a ‘Hussein’ over a ‘Bush’ would clearly not be the type of kids you would want your son or daughter to hang around. But then again this isn’t high school and we no longer have a President who would rather be liked than feared.
dsf
Well written, concise, and no apologies for not showing enough hatred for Saddam (what a relief!). This entire campaign smacks of nihilism, promoted by people who are seriously deluded, either religiously or militarily. However, what’s the media and the Democrats’ excuse?
In seeing Bush’s first telecast exhaultation on war in Iraq, I said to myself and family, “this man believes he is God’s right hand”.
I am an American who believes in the moral foundation on which America was conceived. Lying to America and acting in a manner in which is ultimately detrimental to America, is far from this foundation.
The most simple behavioral analysis of subtle mannerisms and stress response of the ‘war pushers’ and the conscript media place them all as “potential threats”.
Which means that they can not be trusted and exhibit substantial sociopathic and psychopathic tendacies.
Effectively, the administration and the conscript media are applying terrorist tactics to Americans and all people of the World.
It is of this, fundamentally, that I can not abide.
As a nation, America knows that democracy, by its very nature can not be forced. It must be nurtured through its own evolution.
As an American, what I now have to look ‘forward’ to, is the rest of the world even more convinced of my inherent guile.
The killing lust has begun from our troops in Iraq. Many will exercise indiscriminate killing which will create carnage and trauma which the regime of Saddam Hussein could never equal.
Then, one day, these troops will return to America. They will suffer the ills of their actions and behavior, as will their families and friends. The emotional aftermath of this terrorism will be unprecedented.
It is the right and responsibility of every American to uphold the moral fundamentals of America. To speak out against tyranny and oppression within its own boundries.
It must always be remembered that our own history is fraught with atrocities of humanity.
As I watch the killing lust grow within our own children which have been sent to Iraq to ‘liberate’, and as I see and feel the carnage of body and soul of the victim and the perpetrator, my heart is saddened as is that of all existence.
YOU’LL NEVER STOP ME!!!!! FIRE AND BRIMSTONE, DEAD TOWEL HEADS, AND TEXAS CRUDE, BABY!!!!!
Ask the Democrats if they are in on the whole “world domination” idea. They will say no, but the idea of no real competition is attractive to all the power hungry morons of the world. Moberg is a naysayer, influenced by the press that is doing its best to, you guessed it, influence little minds.
I DON’T CARE BABY, I JUST WANT POWER! HOOK EM’ HORNS!
The last poster is right about Democrats wanting in on it, too.
That disappoints me when I see them buying this BS and giving the emperor support for his war.
As a democrat, it makes me wish for an alternative party that truly does stand for the American principles John Adams exemplified.
I had wanted McCain to get the nomination. I think we’d still be economially strong and waging peace right now had he won.
An interesting thing is happening along with the massive disinfomedia. The Internet has presented us with a wide variety of alternative media, information and qualified analysis of the events.
Compromising facts and documents has been available for the world to see. Leaving us with more evidence pointing towards a scenario where the attack on 9/11 was staged as an incentive to put their operation to work.
However the cause behind it is perhaps more complex than that of the control over oil and distribution pipelines. But greed has everything to do with it.
How long before top executives from Cisco, Intel, Microsoft, AltaVista and others offers filtration of Non Patriotic Information on the net in exchange for options on the emerging new markets?
Interesting point, Lars,
If that happens, I hope hackers world-wide unite to stop it.
Cheers,
Someone who still loves Europe.
The worst fears will soon be realised when Iraq, a country of hugely fractured geopolitical scene, is thrown into civil war amongst various fractions. We have already seen the abandonment of the Afghan people with none of the promised reconstruction money and the rampant tribalism of bloodthirsty warlords backed by the US government.
Great article. And I agree that this war is doing nothing but creating more terrorists.
But before we even launch a war against Saddam, where is Osama? Where is Bush’s promise to find him ‘dead or alive.’
I wonder what the family’s of the 9.11 tragedy think of this administration. Do they know they’ve been forgotten by the thugs we’ve got in the oval office?
U.S. ambassador Paul Cellucci has threatened Canada with trade trouble for its refusal to kill Iraqis on command.
Oddly, I don’t recall PM McKenzie King having threatening the U.S. for the two years it sat out the Second World War. Oh well, I guess friendship doesn’t work the same north to south as it does south to north.
Nonetheless, the current shame of non-aggression is Canada’s to bear. In the meantime, I have to admit some reservations to the notion that blowing the heads off Iraqi infants with cluster munitions makes Americans safer. If that’s not true, then I’ll bank on the traditional 50-to-one exchange value on Arab to American lives to limit 911 revenge killings to maybe two or three more wars at most.
Maybe Canada and New Zealand will toe the line for Operation Damascus Democracy.
I just went through my bookmarks deleting propaganda sites I saved during Campaign 2000. Believe me, now is the time when the cover story is all you need to decide.
David Moberg
Ed from Canada,
And people don’t think our government is bullying anyone? Threatening our northern neighbor? One who has had the honor system in place for its borders since prohibition. It makes me curl my fists in rage sometimes. Civilized people don’t act like school-yard bullies.
What may be worse, if the draft is re-instated, and I feel it probably will be, you’ll be getting a huge influx of people who won’t fight emperor Bush’s war. I hope that doesn’t happen and hope the SOB gets impeached before that.
Ed Thomas - what the majority of people don’t seem to understand is that France and Russia and Germany made there decisions about joining the coalition based on one thing: MONEY!
It was conveniently disguised as a peaceful decision, which is exactly how they wanted it to appear. Hell, I even believed it myself, until I learned they had clandestine oil and arms deals with Iraq that would be lost when the coalition takes over.
The US “ain’t no saint”. Our foreign policy is riddled with double standards, the CIA is incompetent, and every wacko in the world wants us to suffer. The problem is, everyone wants something from the US. Damned if we do, damned if we don’t.
When water is the new currency and the US is bone dry, the Canadians will be the players and decisionmakers. I truly and sincerely wish you luck in maintaining peace in this fucked up world…
The honeymoon between Washington and Moscow is finished. USA have accused Russia of deliveries of arms in Bagdad: now diplomatic relations of USA and Russia have appeared under threat.
During the first war in a Gulf, the BUSH-grown-up not hesitating drove for a nose of the former Soviet president Mikhail Gorbachev, which in turn tried to this to resist and to put the end to the Iraq crisis. Ten years after, BUSH-younger work purposefully: he takes the initiative in the hands and to first calls to “friend” Vladimir Putin to inform about the indignation. About it writes French Le Figaro (translation the www.country.ru)
Washington is close to officially accusing the Russian party of realization of illegal sale of arms in Iraq. This subject was discussed on the phone between the presidents of two countries on Monday in the evening.
So, at least, we were explained by the official representative of a White house:
Kremlin immediately has reacted to this accusation. Soon after telephone conversation, the official representative Вladimir Putin directly has contacted to some Moscow printed agencies - that happens extremely seldom - to emphasize, that the president of Russia already during telephone conversation has denied accusations on the part of America. The honeymoon between Washington and Moscow was finished. Now even in the most simple things two capitals hardly will manage to reach the mutual consent. The benevolent relations on the part of Russia to the American people as a result of consequences of September 11 are destroyed.
The Russian-American partnership, which purpose became struggle with the international terrorism, does not exist any more. Having stretched a hand of friendship to Washington, Moscow now coolly has expressed intention to stop diplomatic, economic and many other relations with America. Besides two days ago American prospecting plane U-2 within one hour turned above the Russian-Georgian border, therefore Russia has accused USA of espionage, having specified on a similar sequence concerning epoch of Cold war.
The press ironically responds concerning the American operation in Iraq and will not stint on gibe. So for example, comparing Iraq with the Soviet Union of 1949, the weekly journal Profil makes comments:
Russian people also is strongly concerned with military actions in Iraq. According to sociological interrogation - 71 % of the population for today sees the main threat for world stability not in Bagdad, Pyongyang or Tegeran, and in Washington:
Halliburton,Carlyle and the oil industry are all profiting from this war. All have close ties to the Bushs (Sr and Jr),Cheney and(strangely enough, or not if you’re cynical) the Bin Ladens. I don’t think we should (mis)underestimate the attraction of lining one’s own pockets when it comes to motives for what will turn out to be just another load of War Crimes. It’s not a question of squandering the international goodwill of 9/11 since that event was the equivalent of the Reichstag fire in February 1933 for Bush et al (although he managed that without breaking a sweat).
I would like to say that this is perhaps one of the most articulate articles I have read since the war’s inception. The mainstream media is essentially brainwashing people into hawkish, blinded war mongers who justify attacking a nation and it’s inhabitants who present virtually no threat to us. If most people would just research who will benefit from this war (i.e. defense contractors, oil companies, defense policy board members, Carlyle Group members, nearly all of Bush’s administation) they would not wave our flag, they would burn it in protest of their ‘elected’ officials.
I think this war highlights the ungroudedness of contemporary U.S. culture. The extraordinary ignorance that dominates U.S. culture will kill what is left of our Constitution-based republic as it is replaced by a global Empire. Many in the left say that most Americans would oppose the war if they knew the truth—perhaps, but like most members of dysfunctional families, they clearly and aggressively *do not* want to know the truth. Those small numbers of us who oppose the Empire in the United States have no short or medium-term future if current trends continue.
It looks like you were proven wrong on thr outcome of the war.A quick war ending with the people of Iraq dancing in the streets is exactly what is happening.If you would keep your hatred for the Bush administration in check maybe you wouldn’t look so stupid right now.You are not alone.I can’t count the number of enlightened liberals calling for a quagmire last week.Wrong as usual.
Well, Rob, it isn’t over and won’t be for a long, long time.
It seems a lot of people look at the short-sighted end of things in support of this war. I, and I can’t speak for other anti-war posters here, but it seems like they do, look at the long-term affects.
Yeah, the fighting may be over, but who’s next? What other country is our president going to bully? What other resentment for America will fester up the next time the US goes against the wishes of the world?
Are we helping Afghanistan? No. Even the media is talking about that one.
Where is bin Laden? Has be been stopped?
My point—it just cycles over and over, feeding the oil companies and defense contractors.
As far as hatred for Bush. I hate that goddman son-of-a-bitch. He will ruin this nation through his greed.
Some Iraqis are celebrating. TV news (ABC Nightline) today is also reporting that fighting continues in other parts of Baghdad and throughout Iraq. We don’t know if it is a majority or minority who feel liberated or occupied. The key question is whether or not guerrilla warfare will continue and, if so, for how long. Even President Bush and Vice President Cheney warn that the war is not over yet. The leaders of the Shiite Muslim majority are already boycotting the U.S. talks for the Iraq occupation government and calling for immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq. See: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news ?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20030409/wl_nm/iraq_sciri_dc_1 Notice how President Bush is not calling for immediate elections not even within two years.
U.S.-sponsored Iraqi exile leaders are now calling for the denationalization of Iraqi oil industry and selling it to foreign investors. See: http://story.news.yahoo.com /news?tmpl=sto ry&u=/afp/20030405/bs_afp/iraq_war_opposition_oil_030405214324 This war has always really been about oil. This is why the U.S. wants to cancel the Russian, French and Chinese contracts with Iraq to develop the oil reserves and also does not want the UN to manage the oil-for-food program any longer. See: http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/printstory.hts/business/1856839 So much for the Oil being the wealth of the Iraqi “people.” So much for bringing “democracy” to the Iraqi people.
Islamic fundamentalists will probably have a better chance at getting elected after the “interim” occupation government actually allows the Iraqi people to vote whenever that may be, especially if the oil wells and reserves get sold to foreign investors.
We also will see in the future whether or not terrorist attacks will increase here and abroad over rising Anti-American hatred in the Arab world due to the Iraq war.
On the challenges of humanitarian assistance and looting and the corresponding impact on the Iraqi people’s support for our “liberation,” see New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman’s 4/9/03 article, “Hold Your Applause”:
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/09/opinion/09FRIE.html
I come here to absorb the extreme left end of opinion, and you folks never disappoint me. I really try hard to empathize with your point of view, but fail utterly. The problem with pacifism, or the peaceful interaction of any group for that matter, is that it only takes one person to mess it up for everyone. We’ve just witnessed the removal of one such person, and I cannnot help believing that the world is now a better place for it.
i agree 100% i pray to god that we will all stand together and vote this ignorant president out of office in 2004
We’ve already taken Baghdad and laid waste to Saddam’s government, to the obvious joy of the Iraqi people, and you leftist conspiracy theorists still won’t admit you’re wrong. When we come up with some banned weapons (which we will soon) will you give it a rest and admit we should have stepped in? When it comes out that France sold arms to Iraq, which I think it will, will you admit we were right in sidestepping the UN? I’ll be sure to check back with you clowns in a few weeks and see what kind of conspiracy theories you are entertaining.
Lars writes: “How long before top executives from Cisco, Intel, Microsoft, AltaVista and others offers filtration of Non Patriotic Information on the net in exchange for options on the emerging new markets?”
I wouldn’t be concerned Lars about corporations filtering the internet, but governments that is a different matter.
China just announced a plan to control all internet access from that nation. When Europe begins such a plan, watch out!!
Speaking of Europe, did anybody notice that the EU’s Javier Solano, (insert any of his multiple and growing titles here) is extolling the virtues of military strength in his series of Venice and Mars articles and speeches?
Hmmm, now what could it be that he is trying to promote? (Besides himself that is)
How have I been missing all this. Could someone tell me when and where the administration said the war would be a “cakewalk” and “painted a rosy scenario”?
Granted we have almost completely destroyed the government and armed forces of Iraq in less than 30 days, but I was unaware that anyone ever said it was going to be “easy”.
I am as patriotic as any American can be. That said, I am appalled that we chose war in Iraq that has cost 120 of our youngs lives and many more on the Iraqi side. Ifeel that what has occured has put this countrys credibility and security at great risk as we have undermined so many of our allies and the Un to go after a neutered Sadam.
Relative to this scenario, I urge all to go to the American Conservative website and read Pat Buchanans
article entitled “Whos War” in which he outlines the strong push for war by the entrenched right wing Israeli supporters whom are in our governments upper echelons. As a supporter of Israel and a beleiver of truth, I am concerned and dismayed that a small group of people with a foreign countrys interest in mind, could spur this great country to war. Yes, I am greatly concerned.
Ed Thomas is full of hooey! Kill Iraqis on command, give me a break… Any references, links, or contacts you can get to confirm that? I didn’t think so…
If you plan to spread disinformation, do it creatively so that any but the truly naive might believe it…
Guess what? I heard Chretien grew a backbone!
You’re attempts to ridicule our president is humorus and shows how little steam your movement really has. War is horrible. I have been in combat and the only thing that happens in war is young people die. This is reality we did not go to war for oil. It makes no sense to go to war for 7% of our oil. IF we wanted to attack a nation that supplied us with oil we’d attack one of several south american countries we get a majority of our oil . The war is for a reason : the president of the uinted states sees this country as a clear and present danger and an imminate threat to our country and he is right. He has been thumbing his nose at the U.N. for 12 years and has harbored terrorists and tried to get weapons of mass destruction if he doesnt have them already. WE have the right to be angry at ANY country who did not support our cause and we also can do whatever we deem necessary IF anything to vent our anger. Which includes sanctions or tariffs. You might live in a delusional world where everyone and everything is equal but the world isnt made that way the US is the superpower in the world. WE wll not tolerate people thumbing their nose at the will of the world. IT is a legal and just war and one more thing
BUSH IN 2004
Actually, half of the U.S. oil supply comes from foreign sources mostly from the Middle East not South America. After Saudi Arabia, Iraq has the second largest untapped oil reserves in the world amounting to 120 billion barrels of oil. According to Vice President Cheney’s May 2001 National Energy Policy Report, foreign imported oil will rise to two thirds of America’s energy supply by 2020. See http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20021007&s=klare
There is no evidence of a Saddam-Al Qaeda link. See: http://politics.guardian.co.uk/attacks/story/0,1320,885288,00.html
Regime change and pre-emptive attacks are illegal in international law. See: http://www.robincmiller.com/iraq6-fr.htm http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/forum/forumnew98.php Under international law every nation has the right to self-determination, sovereignty and territorial integrity. The UN and its charter were founded to prevent colonial and world wars so that powerful nations would not decide to attack, overthrow and occupy weaker nations however distasteful those regimes. Part of self-determination is deciding on the form of government. There is no international law that says every country must be a democracy. No country has the right to determine the form of government of any other country regardless of the nature of the regime. That is clear in international law. It is a governance problem for the Iraqi people to determine their political leadership and form of government even if they have to have a civil war to do so. Just like how we do not like the fact that criminals have constitutional and due process rights, but it would be worse if the government could arbitrarily arrest, imprison and invade citizens’ privacy.
The U.S. is directly responsible for the oppression of the Iraqi people as we facilitated the rise to power of Saddam Hussein and the Ba’ath Party in 1963 when they overthrew General Qassem because he nationalized Iraq’s oil industry. See University of Denver, Colorardo Political Science Professor Wadi Muhaisen’s 11/22/02 Rocky Mountain News article, “America’s Shameful Mideast History”: http://www.endthewar.org/frontps/Op-eds/shameful.htm The U.S. then provided Saddam Hussein with the chemical and biological weapons technology used against the Kurds and Iranians as payback against the Ayatollah Khomeini for overthrowing the Shah of Iran and taking the U.S. embassy hostages in 1979. The U.S. also does not care about extending democracy in the Arab world. Why are we not advocating regime change and democracy for the brutal dictatorships in Saudi Arabia (15 out 19 of the 9/11 hijackers were Saudis but no Iraqis and the Wahabi Islamic sect in Saudi Arabia is the biggest sponsor of Al Qaeda), Algeria, Egypt and the plutocratic monarchies in the rest of the Arab world such as Jordan, Kuwait, Qatar, Yemen, United Arab Emirates, etc.? Because they provide us cheap oil.
Camera angles can be deceiving and pictures are worth a thousand words. There were only 150 Iraqis in Firdus Square when the U.S. Marines tore down Saddam Hussein’s statue. See the aerial photo:
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article2842.htm
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article2842.htm
to “The True US Majority”:
7% of your oil? As far as I know, nobody was supposed to buy any Iraqi oil due to the embargo.
But the point about oil is not the past, it’s the future. The numbers you quoted were the past, and the reason for this war was to change this.
You said:
“WE have the right to be angry at ANY country who did not support our cause and we also can do whatever we deem necessary IF anything to vent our anger.”
YOU don’t have any rights whatsoever, because this is not YOUR planet. The rest of the world is angry at the US, exept maybe Mr. Blair and Mr. Aznar (but not including their people).
By the way - America may be a military superpower - still it can’t take it up with the rest of the world alone, so it should better watch out that the few remaining friends it had (until about 6 months ago) don’t decide to definitely turn their back on the arrogant/ignorant states of A.
Clear and present danger? Well it wasn’t back in the 80ies, when Reagan & Rumsfeld sold those weapons of mass destruction to Saddam, and when the same goons sold weapons at the same time to Iran AND had people like Osama be trained by the CIA.
So you really believe, the US spend 80 Billion just because they are so fond of the Iraqui people?
Threat to your country? I don’t know of any attack committed by Iraq against the US (meaning on US territory). Not a single one. Did I hear 9/11? Well, wrong - those were Saudis, Egyptians etc. - no Iraqui involved. But it doesn’t matter, right? After all, they are all the same, aren’t they?
You are a good example why so many people around the world consider the US to be a pathetic heap of ignorance, ruled by criminals who give a pile of dung about freedom or democracy, as long as they can profit.
You said:
“WE wll not tolerate people thumbing their nose at the will of the world. “
Yeah, YOU just demonstrated what you mean by ignoring the UN and everybody else.
2004 ? Don’t know bout that, but I guess that about 2006 we’ll see Bush, Rumsfeld & Chaney at the War-Crimes tribunal in Den Haague.
For the anti-war and peace movement’s strategy to deal with terrorism, see Michael Klare’s “How to Defeat Bin Laden” and “So, What’s the Answer?”:
http://dir.salon.com/news/feature/2001/09/13/justice/index.html
http://www.progressive.org/0901/klar1101.html
For the strategy to deal with the Iraq occupation and weapons of mass destruction, see David Cortright’s “What We Do Now”:
http://www.thenation.com/docprint.mhtml?i=20030421&s=cortright
Also, see Patrick Carkin’s “Saddam is Gone ... So What’s the Peace Movement’s Problem?”:
http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0410-09.htm
At present, the international community labours under the extreme disadvantage that, probably for the first time since the age of Spanish hegemony that ended in the 17th century, the world’s leading power is the most reactionary. There seem only two options now. The first is for the non-US world to remain divided - a scenario that will ensure that the US continues to get whatever it wants, a disaster for at least 95% of the population of the planet.
The other is for the non-US world to go it alone and build international organizations like the ICC without a thought for whether the US will decide to come on board. Although it may seem absurd to attempt to fashion a new international order without the participation of the US, it is the only alternative to a US-dominated world, for the US will dominate and exploit for its own narrow purposes any international organization with which it becomes involved.
We don’t need to go down this road. The US is surely the world’s greatest individual power, but it still only represents 20% of the world economy, and a much smaller share of the earth’s population. The majority - with 80% of the world economy - can still craft viable international organizations without US permission. After some decades, however, a more enlightened US administration will surely bring the US into line with the new international order.
In other words, the premise for a better future - indeed, a future at all - is an international order premised on US non-participation. The US is so out of touch with world opinion that the rest of us would be better off doing our best to ignore it, just as in the schoolyard, most of us tried to get on with our lives as best we could despite the occasional interventions of the school bully.
Ralph,
Haven’t found those weapons yet. No chemical ones, either. That’s mostly because the US sold them to Iraq and the arms, too.
We’re still right. Sadly, Bush will continue to try the same tactics to overthrow another country. Which one is it this time, Syria?
True US Majority,
No one argues Sadaam was a rotten guy. Let’s stop the double-standards, though.
The US sold those arms to Iraq, including the chemical weapons they used on Iran, because the US wanted to see Iran defeated at all possible costs.
We who are against this ILLEGAL war and who won’t criticize other countries for not backing the US’s madness are against all the lies, the deceit, the real reasons Bush went after Iraq and not bin Laden.
What happened to THAT real threat, I ask?
This war was unsanctioned by the UN, criticized by most of the world’s respectable leaders and our administration has the gall to say France is the enemy because they won’t back us? Let’s criticize a nation with some real destructive power.
The UN, by the way has 19 resolutions still being violated by Israel, who we consistantly back up. Are we going to invade them next? They harbor terrorists and have WOMD, including nukes. There are those double-standards.
The non-US commentators here are the voices that will warm the hearts and actions of our US anti-war millions. We will need the support of your voices until the extremist Bush admin has been voted out. Please keep slamming at the bad developments resulting from this war of aggression on Iraq.
History shows how out-nations join together to crush the power of imperial, might-makes-right govts. And, as Moberg and many other analyists point out, civil societies of the out-nations are at least as powerful against Empire as are govts.
For the US anti-war millions, the dishonor of being a full-fledged aggressor nation—taken there by the same manner and degree of lies and falsified evidence as were used by Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, the Empire of Japan, and Communist Russia—will drive great actions to dis-elect Bush. Voices of outraged citizens of the world will help greatly.
Additionally, some of us are working on national constitutional renewal, hoping that we can meld sovereign citizen lawmaking to a still-strong, but more-regulated rep govt. If we can gain that political dynamic—proven in the 400-yr rise to greatness of the Roman Republic, as well as in the modern experience of post-1891 Switzerland—US citizens will have the right to speak for themselves, rather than be misrepresented by lying, manipulative, pseudo-scientific polls.
Many critical problems of governance would be resolved. And the US would surely vote itself into the ICC. International justice is an idea whose time has come. With that one vote, the trial of Bush, Cheney, Rice, Powell, Wolfowitz, Perle, and others, for cirmes against humanity in Iraq would be assured.
My pride is in those who are cooperative human beings first—no matter what their nationality. My country’s govt has put money first. And too many of my countrymen have put revenge for 9-11 first. My country has broken my heart.
I can’t understand why everyone is not supporting Dick Cheney and I on our plans to remake the Middle East. We have the power - we need to use it! Enough of this namby-pamby negotiation stuff. We wasted far too much time talking and not enough time bombing! Nothing a few Tomahawks to send a message to the camel jockeys that we mean business! Now, back to my planning for the Syrian invasion - it’s the only way Numbnuts has a Chinaman’s chance of getting re-elected…..
why do people constantly say that anti-war people were wrong?They seem to have misinterpreted the fact that we were against this war because it is illegal and largely hypocritical of the US to go against the UN to try and promote other sanctions like the banned weapons. I recently read also about cluster bombs and was horrifyed by what i read. These bombs lay undetected for years and resurface to kill and maim the innocent children,adults and animals like goats which play a very vital role for families in these countries. How these arent acknowledged as weapons of mass destruction is anyones guess.
Isn’t it a bit odd how the UN weapons inspectors turned out nothing and now the US is sending its own inspectors in to try and ‘find’ these weapons. Use your imagination there. I am only 15 years old and just wish those older than me would wake up. A show of hands in my class revealed that about 90% were for the war, and gave no apparent reason other than Saddam was a terrorist. The media has worked in very influential ways on the ignorant masses who will listen to anything there beloved leaders tell them. The Bush administration angers me with its greed and lust for killing. It sickens me to think that so many people think that this war is justified and not an excuse for the US Milatary to flex its muscles. After failures in past conflicts like Vietnam, Iraq presented a perfect oppurtunity to show that no one messes with the US. It is a dictatorship, in an arabic part of the world and would easily be a great target. And so it was. I wonder that after this conflict, it becomes another Afghanistan where we will forget to rebuild. Already multi-million dollar contracts are being given to large companies and not to the Iraqis where this money would do well. I agree with the former reader who stated that 9/11 represented for the bush admin that the reichstag burning was for the nazis, it gave the US an excuse to wage war upon countries different from it and to kill anyone who was in the way.
On the subject of history, why do people always say “would you be anti-war against Hitler in 1939?”. That has nothing to do with anything. Absolute shite. Hitler actually posed a very major threat, with his organised army and aggresion while Iraq does not. Peace and love to all
perhaps the idea of “national self-determination” is outdated in a world where 3,000 people can be killed, a large nations economy brought to its knees, and several massive structures destroyed, with a little bit of planning and a $5 boxcutter?
one person raised the valid point most people ignore: pacifism works until one jerk fucks it up. that jerk is (was) saddam hussein. he ignored international laws and resolutions for 12 years, and flagrantly violated human rights. his removal sends the important message that these things are not to be tolerated by the international community, and i agree that i cant see anything other than that the world is a better place without him. The actual security threat comes from Iran and north korea, but thats another story…Iraq was just to prove a point.
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