The air in Baghdad is potent stuff. Plastic-rich garbage heaps burn in empty lots. Massive diesel generators run round the clock. More than a million vehicles—old cars, trucks and fuel-guzzling U.S. tanks—creep through the streets belching fumes. On the horizon, beyond the looted and bombed out office blocks, looming above the low-rise residential sprawl, is a giant smokestack; its massive… return to article
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Reader Comments (57)Page 1 of 1 pagesthe more I read online the more that “70% supporting the war” stat sounds like so much garbage. It is quite widely-quoted outside the US, you know.
Posted by Owen on Sep 8, 2003 at 11:50 AM What a sad mess. I hope the UN will become more involved so that fewer young servicemen/women and Iraqi civilians will be paying the ultimate price for an unjustified war that apparently finished months ago.
Posted by Maz on Sep 8, 2003 at 12:04 PM I agree. It is a sad mess. I think it would be a nightmare to be a
GI over there right now.
Posted by Corbin Dallas on Sep 8, 2003 at 12:24 PM And we were misled to believe that this war was only going to cost not even half of what it is going to actually cost us in our shaky economy, and NOW they ask for help, that just proves to me that the people that rule our country and govern the world are money hungry “history revisionists”.
Posted by Bob on Sep 8, 2003 at 1:22 PM If only the American public were better informed. If only American citizens demanded more transparency, more accountability, more innovation from our so-called “representatives” and from ourselves as well. We are better than this!!! We hold all the capacity necessary to create better strategies for resolving whatever problems exist in this world - strategies other than war. Yet, we have an administration that seems to reflect the absolute worst of our nation’s potential (fear, deception, greed, violence). It is disgraceful. We have got to get these awful people out of the Whitehouse.
Posted by Just Me on Sep 8, 2003 at 2:09 PM If only 10% of what is reported here is true ,it seems like enough to impeach a president. And he still has over 50% approval.Where is the American press? I,m sick enough to vomit.
Posted by rosestern on Sep 8, 2003 at 2:50 PM If only 10% of what is reported here is true ,it seems like enough to impeach a president. And he still has over 50% approval.Where is the American press? I,m sick enough to vomit.
Posted by rosestern on Sep 8, 2003 at 2:51 PM Rosestern, that 50% approval rate is probably not accurate either.
This “pResident” doesn’t care about all the jobs lost in all the closed steel mills in your area, or refinery jobs lost or other manufacturing GC and Alton and surrounding areas are known for.
We need to impeach this guy and stop selling our manufacturing to firms in the pocket of Bush & Co.’s friends.
Posted by neil on Sep 9, 2003 at 12:11 AM with officers and soldiery like that, in such a situation, how can the U.S. of Amnesia fail?
Posted by Ryokan on Sep 9, 2003 at 7:00 AM Beuatifully wriiten and very much in the traition of the journalism of the Vietnam era. Terrific coverage.
Posted by frank Miata on Sep 9, 2003 at 7:37 AM It’s a shame we don’t have recall
The republicans are crazy about that in California. I would sign that petition. He was only elected by a minority and the SUPREMES.
Posted by ROSE on Sep 9, 2003 at 7:50 AM Hasn’t every other reporter that has gone to baghdad said the opposite of what this article said. So is it possible that inthesetimes is the news source that has been effected by their ideology.
Is the war going perfectly? No. Mistakes have been made. Is it going well? Yes. The majority of Iraq is in good shape (all of Iraq is better than before).oh and Owen, the “70% supporting the war” stat you mentioned is true. The people on this site can’t refute that, in fact Joel Bleifuss even referenced it in one of his articles.
Posted by mike on Sep 9, 2003 at 10:00 AM So what’s the source Mike?
P.S. The people who led the charge don’t count.
Posted by Owen on Sep 9, 2003 at 10:49 AM The writer’s correct, in the best tradition of war journalism, to point out everything that’s wrong with the U.S. occupation, to expose every unpleasant, tragic detail. The American public needs to know. I just hope they don’t lose their nerve. Those who say we should “end U.S. occupation” are irresponsible in the extreme. This is the best argument yet for staying the course. We need more commitment, not less. Does anybody on this board understand this? It’s irrelevant now whether you were for or against the war. They ousted a tyrant, and now they have the hard work to do of installing a representative democracy. Pulling out would do nothing but emboden the regressive fundamentalist Islamists. We can only pull out once the nation-building is over. I hope the U.N. gets involved. Another Viet Nam? Don’t think so. The country is largely under our control, whereas Viet Nam was never more than half under our control.
Posted by earbrain on Sep 9, 2003 at 12:00 PM Just wanted to echo the statements made by Just Me. The current “war without end” we find ourselves in is just a symptom of an illness which grips our nation at it core.
Rather than fullfill the vision of the founding fathers, our leaders have chosen to follow a path that will, I fear lead us all to destruction.
Weapons and military hardware are the largest US export. What does this say about our values?
The current administration claims that going to war with Iraq represents the highest form leadership. Its plan to implement nuclear first strikes on non-nuclear countries veiwed as prudent.
Where will this take us?
I recommend the following link:
http://www.freespeech.org/fsitv/fscm2/contentviewer.php?content_id=244
Posted by Al Baars on Sep 9, 2003 at 12:23 PM “The majority of Iraq is in good shape”
I see irony is alive and kicking in the US
Posted by frank on Sep 9, 2003 at 1:21 PM Earbrain,
Yes, we cannot just walk away from something we started. I just feel that we approached the whole thing the wrong way. If we worked closer with the UN instead of rushing into our “shock and awe,” we probably could have healed a wound (over time) that was there rather than pick a scab and then try to stop the bleeding. My opinion of that would probably be different if we found WMD. That is just proof of our government’s brash judgements without following through diplomacy. It’s easy to support a war that’s fought on a different soil, but imagine if it were in your back yard. Sure, we were attacked 2 years ago, but that wasn’t a war. It was an attack. They happen everyday all over the world. Why were we attacked? You never hear that on Fox News. About how our lack of foreign policy has oppressed people in other countries. Look at GW’s pocketbook. He’s a freakin’ billionaire. I look in his eyes and see $$$$$$$. This government is not in the best interest of the people of the US and the world, it’s about lining their pockets with dollars. Think about it that way. It’s easy to pass judgement when you see all of the biases in the comfort of your living room. Read the terrific story above and put yourself in the shoes of a shop keeper, or an innocent bystander on the street shot in the face.
Posted by Bob on Sep 9, 2003 at 2:03 PM Bush, Pearle, Wofowitz, Rumsfeld need to be held accountable for the horrific mess they concocted, This war was designed by a few neo cons( some who hold dual citizenships)
with NOT especially americas interest at heart. I find their actions repulsive. Impeach em and boot em all out!
Posted by chhet polwin on Sep 9, 2003 at 4:22 PM What are you smoking, Mike?
Do you really believe this? 70%??! No way. Not even here in one of the most conservative states is that figure correct.
So many people are affected by this war if not by some relative getting blown up with a car bomb over there but by the high gas prices oil companies are using this war as an excuse for. And the rising unemployment and the 88 billion dollars more he’s asked for, the programs he’s pronounced would end this depression that he isn’t giving any money to, not to mention the veterans he’s screwing by cutting VA benefits.
Fuck George Bush Jr. and his idiotic bunch of evil-doers who brought this upon our nation. Treason to the highest degree. Rig an election, allow 9/11 to happen, now this. He’s a fucking bastard.
Posted by neil on Sep 9, 2003 at 6:43 PM Parenti’s writing crackles with vitality, intelligence and reportorial authority. You are lucky to have him. I hope he gets paid.
Posted by Bob Fitch on Sep 9, 2003 at 9:17 PM I read these comments and fell truely sorry for people like Mike. I don’t live in America and therefore don’t know what the media is like, but based on the opinion that Mike has I would think that the American public is being mislead. Living in SA we get coverage from both sides and it is clear that your government doesn’t have a clue what it is doing in Iraq. This is further highlighted by the fact that Bush has now asked for assistance from the people that he was Threatening economically in the build up to the war. Bush stated that he was going to war, with or without the world’s support. He chose to go to war and now wants the world to bail him out. Are America going to do like they did in Vietnam, ravage the country and then leave? Maybe get some big corporations to open sweatshops?
I hope that the real story reaches the American public before the next elections and Bush does not get re-elected. If not, which country is going to follow Iraq?
Posted by Trevor on Sep 10, 2003 at 1:52 AM Fuck George Bush Jr. indeed (and Sr. for that matter), but I was trying to come up with a US president in the last 40 years who hasn’t been party to some criminally insane act resulting in massive loss of life, and am not having much luck. Even the ones with halfway decent reps seemed to, you know...Carter and Somoza, anyone?
Posted by Owen on Sep 10, 2003 at 2:21 AM I can not believe the good American people will allow this moron to stay in office much longer. He is the scum of the earth along with his parents and brothers. May the whole family get cancer together and die.
Posted by Tim on Sep 10, 2003 at 6:43 AM mike, in regard to your comment that “The majority of Iraq is in good shape (all of Iraq is better than before).” Does “ all of Iraq” include the little boy who had his arms and legs blown off, as well as his entire body burned horribly count? Or is he counted under the “mistakes have been made” portion of your analysis of the situation? Bush asking for help from the U.N. now, while still insisting that the U$A was justified is absurd.
Posted by Chris on Sep 10, 2003 at 9:15 AM Yes Earbrain, America should do what it can for cleaning up the mess it lied itself into, and then leave ASAP.
And straight to hell with Bush and his Neo-con minders who brought about this hideous, half-witted crusade!
Posted by Patrick on Sep 10, 2003 at 9:39 AM chris, if you want to talk about the boy who had his legs and arms blown off then I could go on all day about how Saddam TORTURED AND RAPED his own people. So all of those people (maybe even said boy) that would have eventually have been tortured are better off.
Posted by mike on Sep 10, 2003 at 11:51 AM Yeah Owen, you’re right about Carter, sadly. He increased the flow of arms to Indonesia when their dictator was slaughtering his own people before even thinking about going after East Timor. Clinton later referred to him as “our kind of guy”.
Nixon and Reagan backed Pinochet until pressure from the public and their own staff made them back off. And the murderous ways of George Sr. continue through prince George.
Not in any defense of the past 12 presidents, but one thing the past Democrats generally had before taking actions was consent from the UN. Now, without their consent, this current “pResident” is seeking their support. If the UN wants to maintain any credibility, they should refuse and let our country lie in the bed it’s made for itself.And Mike, the whole idea of illegaly invading Iraq for “humanitarian” reasons is so completely insane. How many people are suffering now? 500,000? Why is gasoline $2 a gallon, energy prices soaring? This war is a perfect excuse. And if you believe Bush’s BS you probably believe in the tooth fairy.
Posted by neil on Sep 10, 2003 at 6:27 PM The Rebublican Administration is worse than the Democrates. Yes Iraq is bad. How about Republican Hatch proposing that we plant something in mp3’s to destroy the computers of the downloaders? He needs to be put out of office immediately! Iowa Rep I believe!
We can’t have a criminal like that in office :(
Posted by Jerry on Sep 10, 2003 at 10:55 PM neil, i don’t think that the reason we went to Iraq had a lot to do with the humanitarian reasons because there are a lot of places that have a problem with that. I was just addresing the idea that the people of Iraq are worse off now.
Posted by mike on Sep 11, 2003 at 8:28 AM what hatch proposed is a terrible idea. Firstly, I download music. A lot of the music I download is illegally downloaded. But I found it interesting that you called Hatch the criminal when he in fact is just attempting to stop criminal activity.
Please don’t think I’m disagreeing just for the sake of disagreeing, I just don’t think that hatch is a criminal for that. I feel that destroying people’s computers is not the best way to go about it. I say that they continue, just have record companies sue those who have a lot of songs.
Posted by mike on Sep 11, 2003 at 8:33 AM My hope is that relevant facts continue to reach the American people (even if merely a trickle) or that the people take increasing initiative to independently investigate the true basis of this administration’s policies. I am especially hopeful that the Project for a New American Century is revealed because if the people knew that a plan (signed off by key members of this administration) to take over the middle east had been in place long before 9/11 then, the everyone will be in a better position to ascertain the truth.
If anyone here who has not yet explored the Plan for a New American Century would like to obtain some information, you may want to start at the following link:
I think we have to constantly remind ourselves and other American citizens that, what makes this country great is not its politics or politicians but rather the American people. It is in the American people that we should extend our loyalties rather than a particular party whether political or otherwise.
Don’t you think?
Posted by Just Me on Sep 11, 2003 at 9:51 AM Were are at the gates of hell, thanks to this phony unelected president, uninformed public, and stupified politicians.
Posted by Al on Sep 11, 2003 at 10:02 AM Mike,
Who knows what reason they’re going to say we invaded Iraq for next? The latest one, due to their failure to find WMD, was to rid the people of the evil Saddam thereby making this a humanitarian operation.
I have to disagree about the people being better off. 100,000 ex-military people are out of work, close to 500,000 total, possibly more are unemployed and that’s a huge hit to any economy. The police force is in shambles....it IS a mess and the people are far worse off. One can’t blame them for being pissed off. This gives rise to more fundamental Islamic groups to come in and get the people going against the US, which has repeated such actions in the Middle East over and over and over again since the 50’s. They have lots of reasons to get the people going. We never learn, and this was the point of so many opposed to going in there illegally.
When the ANC took over in South Africa a period of economic disaster followed that still isn’t fully over. It just doesn’t happen unless the people themselves have the power and resolve to do it. We had NO right to made this decision for them. The death of so many innocent does not justify the econimic interests of this country. Quite the opposite.
Posted by neil on Sep 11, 2003 at 7:37 PM Neil, how can you say that. A recent Zogby poll that was done in Iraq has said that the heavy majority (70%) of the iraqi people are happy with the US being there. Even more are happy that the US had removed Hussein. If looked at this poll closely, you would see that those happy with invasion are younger people, people whom we will be dealing with. So according to this poll (released yesterday) what you said was made up.
Neil, I have another question: Since you were against this war, how could it have been a success, according to you? (most people know it was a success, I’m just wondering what it would take for you)
Posted by mike on Sep 12, 2003 at 8:49 AM Mike,
when that statue of Hussein fell, the crowd numbered some 3 to 400. It was entirely ignored in the mainstream press that a couple of days beforehand an anti-US demonstration took place, the crowd numbering 20,000. They donĄt like Hussein but they sure as hell donĄt like the US being there either.
Posted by Owen on Sep 12, 2003 at 11:20 AM Mike, like Owen said, our government inflates numbers or stretches them to fit their needs. If you listen to our shithead “pResident” last week, he needs 88 billion dollars so, of course, they’re going to start saying everyone is happy over there, when in fact, the violence against our troops is escalating. He needs public support and it’s falling fast.
Haven’t you been listening to the news? Every day more and more troops are killed. “That’s from isolated former members of Saddam’s regime” the State Department is saying. What a success of rounding them up, huh boys? Bullshit. They’re pissed! Listen to the interviews on any station other than mainstream media and you’ll get the truth.My scenario for success. Leave Saddam in. We had no right to go in. Why haven’t we gone into Cuba? Nothing there but cigars and sugar cane and we have those. Why not Korea? Because they’d kick the shit out of our army for months before we’d eventually win. But I don’t think that would be right either.
We had no right to go in so we shouldn’t have. Our economic interests and our “leader’s” failure to run this country are no reason for this illegal war.
Now we want the UN to help out but I hope they refuse. Shame on this illegal president and his staff. The innocent Iraqi citizen’s blood is on his hands and it will never come clean. Some Christian.
Posted by neil on Sep 12, 2003 at 7:39 PM Neil, right now you have just said something that I have always thought but could never prove, YOU ARE ANTI-AMERICAN!. You want the United States to lose this war. “My scenario for success. Leave Saddam in.” If our purpose was to remove Saddam (which it was) then you hope we fail at that purpose.
Another thing Neil, you said that the government inflated the poll numbers. ARE YOU INSANE!! This is the Zogby poll, you even referred to Zogby polls in your statement when you said Bush’s popularity was falling. That was a zogby poll.
Posted by brad on Sep 13, 2003 at 9:55 AM And what exactly is it that you think American must win, Brad? Major combat is over, remember. Is it not the peace that now has to be won? Isn’t the objective to give the Iraqi people back their own country?
I have some important information for you, Brad. True patriots are those who recognize that a democracy works to empower “the people” (whether American, Iraqi or otherwise), NOT the politicians. Perhaps it is you that is anti-American.
Posted by Leslee Hamrick on Sep 13, 2003 at 1:29 PM leslee, you shouldn’t join in a debate and then argue with the person you actually agree with. Are you for democracy in Iraq? I am, and you are too. Neil is not. By saying, “My scenario for success. Leave Saddam in.” He is obviously supporting the dictator. Why do I think America must win? well, umm, because I am American!!! I support my country’s troops. If they are fighting someone, I hope they are not the ones being killed.
Posted by brad on Sep 13, 2003 at 2:11 PM Thank you for one out of many few clear understandings that involve the war in iraq.
I am deeply concerned for all human lives around the world and i must say that i cannot believe our soldiers that are supposed to protect the iraqi people engaged in sexual acts with them.teenagers?WHY must these ‘’soldiers’’ be allowed to do what they please?I would’nt be surprised if higher-ranking soldiers did worse!
Nobody should engage in abusive activity to get an education.EVERYBODY should have an opportunity to learn.
Why doesnt the government help built non-permamnent schools(maybe out of tents, backs of trucks, etc.) to educate the lost woman and children there.Simple iraqi education, nothing really AMERICAN.Im sure there are teachers in iraq who would love to participate-Better to be distracted by words than by bombs.
It’s a simple idea from a simple teenager.
I am amshamed to be an american today.
Troops should get off there ass and be aware of the people around them(iraqi’s also) and protect them.It’s those ignorant ‘’soldiers’’ that tell the iraqi people that all-americans are white-washed and greedy and only care for themselves.
Well...not this american!!!!!
I will send my message to people all over the world one day and show that the true american is a hard-working lower-middle class human being just like them.PEACE NOW! and dont forget my name......revolution will come.
Posted by andre on Sep 13, 2003 at 3:21 PM Brad, I believe that you may want to explore making more distinctions about life. Whether you accept reality or not, the Iraqi people’s lives are not better under our occupation. It is much, much worse right now. While you haste to exclaim a political posit of “liberating” the Iraqi people exhaling those mass graves that Saddam did in fact fill, you fail to admit the reality of our shock and awe horror which added tens of thousands of innocent people to those graves. You fail to recognize that,...the death of those valuable people at the hands of “old school” American policies of war,...was the perspective from which Neil was coming from.
Another distinction you will most likely come to embrace (because I can tell that you do care about people) is that of a “political philosophy” versus American ingenuity. You see, there are unlimited solutions to every problem,...you know that. Although you may be loyal to a particular approach or party or whatever for whatever reason, your loyalty does not necessarily dictate “righteousness”.
As an example, the position or party to which you are loyal dictates that war is the only “resolve” towards ridding the world of evil. If that resolve is true, our government would be perfectly “right” to have bombed the entire state in which McVey lived. Do you see both the hypocrisy and the limitations of such a “resolve”?
Moreover, do you see how such a policy is not only insulting to the intelligence of the American people but it also diminishes the value and potential of all human life? Open your mind some, Brad. Get past all the sound bites and rhetoric and think about what you want your world to be. I envision something better for all people all around the world.
Posted by Leslee Hamrick on Sep 13, 2003 at 10:56 PM By the way, Brad,...the reason I defended Neil against your character assasination of him as “anti-american” is because he offers experiences and courage that you should respect.
You see (obviously not yet), notwithstanding Neil has suffered terrible losses at the hands of unforeseeable violence in our own nation,...he has chosen compassion over revenge, understanding over biggotry, hope over cynicism and a determination to pursue a vision greater than the past and politics and “fashion”.
Perhaps you don’t get that because you lack the experience or exposure or composure or faith. But,...where you simply do not get where Neil is coming from,...I do. If you would like to figure him out,...I suggest trying on someone’s shoes other than your comfortable own.
Posted by Leslee Hamrick on Sep 13, 2003 at 11:42 PM Brad, you are blinded by one of the most evil family members to ever rig an election to get into the white house.
So what is it? Is his popularity up or is it down as you say by the same poll you’re using as a source? If it is the same source, then you’re admitting his popularity is down, along with it, American’s agreement about whether this war was a good idea or not. That drops daily as even the most dim-witted people are starting to see through the lies.How dare you say I’m not for democracy. And how dare you say I’m anti-American. These statements prove your inability to look objectively at this situation. How absolutely WRONG it is for us to decide a nation’s fate for them when they never asked for it.
Democracy is not what we are bringing those people--we’re raping their natural resources, selling their jobs our from under them and auctioning off whatever’s left. That’s not democracy--that’s a corporate republic, much like we’re getting here in this country. Where the majority has little say. Like the majority of voters who elected Gore, but “Whoah, wait there a minute WE say this is a better choice.” Bush is a tyrannt. He’s bringing those people further suffering and most likely another US puppet administrator.And if you ever call me anti-American again, you fucking son-of--a-bitch, I WILL FIND YOU.
Posted by neil on Sep 14, 2003 at 3:04 AM Now, see, how does a threat like that sound? Not very good? That’s of the way we’d feel over here if some European of S. American leader decided he would find our leaders and rid the world of them.
I’m not threatening you, just making a point.
Posted by neil on Sep 14, 2003 at 3:07 AM If we are to end this stupidity, we must all work together, forget our differences and bust our asses to get George Bush and his neo-convict army out of Washington forever. The Viet Nam syndrome has returned to the Pentagon. Let’s not wait 10 years before ending this one.
Posted by Tim Ferguson on Sep 14, 2003 at 8:22 AM Neil, you are still forgetting that you said that you would prefer Saddam to whatever Iraq will get. That means you are choosing a dictatorship. But lets be honest, we’re not there because Saddam was a dictator, we’re there because a combonation of things. We thought there was WMD, which we can’t find, but we know was there at a point (we don’t just make those things up), and we are there because we thought that Saddam would try to obtain and use weapons against us, the fact that Saddam was a dictator was helpful to our cause. On the charge that we’re turning them into a corporate republic, I can’t comment on that because we don’t enough but I firmly believe the US will move as fast as possible to get the country to democracy.
I do admit that support for this war is falling, I don’t deny facts (it is still favorable though). Hey, I am the first to admit that this war hasn’t been 100% perfect. This is shown by Bush being more vulnerable then I ever thought he be. (oh and let go of the election of 2000, I agree it was bullshit that Bush won, but he did win according to the rules that the dems have yet to even attempt to change, and in a year, the 2000 election won’t matter as I’m sure Bush or whatever Dem. will win with the majority vote).On a personal note to Neil. I enjoy debating with you as your views are very independant and alternative to what most people (even far-lefties) believe. I am also very sorry about what happened to your brother. I have a brother and if that had happened to him, I never would be able to respond the way you did. I called you anti-american because you said you wanted us to lose the war. Please don’t ever talk to me like that again. I don’t like being threatened and I realize that you know you went a little overboard, but I am asking you (like someone else had to) to tone it down a bit.
Posted by brad on Sep 14, 2003 at 7:13 PM neil after reading what i wrote , i felt it was unclear. Your views follow no party lines or ideology which means that while you are usually far-left, I have seen you take a conserv. stance on things.
Posted by brad on Sep 14, 2003 at 8:00 PM Brad, thanks for the words about my bro.
Personally, I was using a threat to show you how it feels in this way because I was afraid to mention the US being threatened for fear it’s taken the wrong way. My friend got drunk and e-mailed stupid comments to the president and he claims (don’t know if it’s true) that a helicopter followed him for a few days. Sorry if that was harsh, I didn’t mean it to come out that way and after I sent both e-mails and re-read them I realize I often don’t get my point across well in writing. That was shitty of me.Losing the war, no. I just hoped it never had started and Saddam was still in, even though he is an evil guy. The Iranians are used to war and one dictator after another and they’re capable of making the best of things over there, I’ve heard it said several times from interviews with Middle Eastern experts. Their anger stems from many things, one of which is the US dictacting what’s good for them.
Castro is a dictator too as well as most of the African leaders, but in the case of Cuba, an invasion would cost more lives and probably a build new socialist support from all sides. Probably one of the reasons North Korea is taking pot-shots at us.
In this instance, there’s a new-found jiihad against the US. After 9/11, the Muslim world supported us. Now that support is next to gone and the days of escalating terrorist attacks against the soldiers are getting treated like war stories were in Viet Nam.I have conservative and liberal ideas. I don’t believe in abortion, but who am I to tell a woman what to do with her body? I also don’t believe in capital punishment.
I believe in personal responsibility and hate the way people just care about themselves anymore.
I see Bush this way because he isn’t keeping his end of all the important promises he’s made to this nation after 9/11. Capturing those responsible, supporting Afghanistan after the war. Empty promises that just anger other nations and we have plenty of that.
I at one time supported George Sr. until I started reading background info on him when he was in the CIA and I realized how fortunate we were he wasn’t re-elected.I know you get a rough deal here on this forum, from me, from a lot of people and we’re all just arguing with each other over things we have little power to change. So, I’ll keep it toned down and practice what I’m preaching here, too.
By the way, I used to work for the Yankees. Are you a Mets fan?
Posted by neil on Sep 15, 2003 at 1:44 AM You see,...it is neither “policies” or politicians that make this country great. What makes the United States of America a truly great nation,...is the American people. Thank you Neil and Brad for proving that the experiment of democracy is worth taking a stand for.
Today, I participated in a demonstration in Charleston, West “by God” Virginia. Cheney was in town (surprise!!!). Last night, knowing I was planning to attend that demonstration because of my ad hoc announcement in church, my Father asked, “Why would you demonstrate with ‘peacenics’ at a fundraiser for a local representative?” I replied, “I am not a ‘peacenic’, I am a human being who cares not only about my life but the lives of others as well. And the reason a demonstration happens to be taking place when Cheney is showing up for a GOP fundraiser is because, we the people are precluded from an audience with him or our other so-called ‘representatives’,… so we have to take advantage of whatever small opportunity we can get.”
He chided, “You shouldn’t interfere with political matters!” I thought for a minute (being really *laugh* pissed off that he would suggest that our democracy doesn’t include me), and said “This really isn’t political, Dad,...I am not a pig for politics,...I am a patriot for the people ‘cause I think the people of our country count more than the politicians.”
He insisted that I did not understand “reality”. I promised him that I am perfectly in tune with “reality” and because I am quite aware of the reality we have created by our buying into or doing nothing to change or improve “reality”,...I am hell bent upon being involved in having an impact upon making “reality” something better. What is wrong with that?
Nothing. It is the American way!!!
Posted by Leslee Hamrick on Sep 15, 2003 at 9:23 PM Corporate Amerika has always called the shots in this country and will continue to do so! The politicians are just their lacky mouthpieces! THIS is how we ended up in Iraq, amoung other places in the past. Bush and his henchmen need to be disposed of and fast. Take his immediate and extended families out as well . This family gene pool is contaminted beyond hope!
Posted by KarlM on Sep 16, 2003 at 6:55 AM I bet the good folks of Iraq are pleased to go out and vote with the Zogby Poll instead of looking for food and water and fuel. I bet protecting their families from the criminal gangs is way down on their list of priorities as well. Mr Parenti gives a vivid and accurate snapshot of the actual situation. I would rather trust his snapshot than any phony poll. P.S. I have never ever been approached by a pollster, maybe i live in the wrong locality, perhaps i should live in downtown Baghdad.
Posted by GA on Sep 16, 2003 at 8:11 AM What? an amazing conglomeration of idiotarian cacophony.
I agree impeach GWB please! Six months in and this quagmire is totally unacceptable. This report was totally fair and balanced. It is absolutely certain that all rumors of positives are propagada and lies. Bush&Co;have either had a bad plan or no plan and things are only going backwards. They didn’t anticipate any of this, clueless bastards. If only America was as righteous and knowledgeable as us.
There are no ambiguities, no uncertainties, and no reason even feel threatened or consider issues outside of your neighborhood. Those who do and are not with us cannot be trusted and are merely greedy capitalist pigs.Kofi please save us, we didn’t mean it. Kofi, you know Bush doesn’t listen to anybody but neo-conmen and closet fascist right wing christian ashcroftianites.
Yah Sure You Betcha!
Posted by What? on Sep 19, 2003 at 7:48 AM “Mr Parenti gives a vivid and accurate snapshot of the actual situation.”
Please people, it’s a large country and this was certainly an ambitious undertaking. This has always been a country of great diversity ethnically and economically and within that the vast majority was oppression and suppresion politically. Parts of the country are worse off, about the same, or better off depeding on where in the country you talk about.
And I would be willing to bet that for every negative story there are 100 positive human interest stories on both the Iraqi and Coalition side. It’s not that I doubt that much of What? is reported here is not true. It’s just disengenously one sided in a serious extreme on a serious issue.
Posted by What? on Sep 19, 2003 at 8:04 AM I saw you on CNN this morning, Tuesday, February 17, 2004, and I wondered if you are related to Michael parenti who I had to read in Polibical Science class at Avila College in Kansas City. I really think he was right on--was he your dad? If I were younger, I’d really like to meet you. You are beautiful--physically I mean. I like the way you stay with your points and don’t let callers like that guy in Oklahoma blast off at you. Nancy Baltinsky 816 943 0784.
Posted by Nancy Baltinsky on Feb 17, 2004 at 12:21 PM i think this cite is one of the greatest i have read..i applaude the author and hope to hear more of him.
i would like to ask a question though...we all know the war isnt doing well but then what resolution do you have for it...what steps can we do now when we are so deep into it....we cant just pull out?
Posted by abdul on Apr 22, 2004 at 12:13 AM Page 1 of 1 pages -
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